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Ropeman Safety

BenG

BenG

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2017
Messages
412
I don't know a lot about climbing gear but the ropeman 1 is rated at 15 kN. I just started using one and I like it, I just always thought the standard to stay above was 22kN or 5000 lbs. I realize it is highly unlikely I would ever generate this force in a fall, but if I did fall 6 ft for some reason I wouldn't have the 2x safety factor. So why is it okay to accept a lower rating in this case if your setup is only as strong as your weakest point? I'm still getting used to the saddle so I'm still a little nervous about some things when I'm 25 ft in a tree, so I just want to make sure I'm being safe.
 
BenG said:
I don't know a lot about climbing gear but the ropeman 1 is rated at 15 kN. I just started using one and I like it, I just always thought the standard to stay above was 22kN or 5000 lbs. I realize it is highly unlikely I would ever generate this force in a fall, but if I did fall 6 ft for some reason I wouldn't have the 2x safety factor. So why is it okay to accept a lower rating in this case if your setup is only as strong as your weakest point? I'm still getting used to the saddle so I'm still a little nervous about some things when I'm 25 ft in a tree, so I just want to make sure I'm being safe.
Click to expand...

This will be my first hunting season with a saddle but I have been bow hunting out of trees for 25 years. I still have my concerns as well. The one thing I have done is to buy the samson rope in bulk that came with the aerohunter and make a extra long linesman belt/rope using another ropeman 1 and leave it attached to the tree... I set up some rather large trees lol I just screw in an extra ameristep and put the rope over it so it does not slide down or get in the way.... good luck !

Oh ..also make sure to take the loop at the bottom of your main lead rope and run it through your carabiner.


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You are correct that a ropeman is not rated high enough for a long fall. In rock climbing falls can be much farther so greater strength and dynamic rope is needed.

If we are tethered our fall will be inches or we may slide a bit down a tree On a linemans belt the same thing would occur. Both would not stress our equipment the same as a rock climber.

I feel way safer in an aerohunter than a climber stand or lock on.
If you are worried put a prussic on the tail of your rope and clip it to your harness and leave a stopper below the prussic on the tether.

It takes a while to get used to a saddle. I don't like heights and cannot afford to fall but I feel safe in a saddle
Some of what is suggested on this site is not always up to standard. Many use a ropeman 1 on 9 mm rope. Not recommended A sit drag without a backup is not up to standards.


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Last edited:
BenG said:
I don't know a lot about climbing gear but the ropeman 1 is rated at 15 kN. I just started using one and I like it, I just always thought the standard to stay above was 22kN or 5000 lbs. I realize it is highly unlikely I would ever generate this force in a fall, but if I did fall 6 ft for some reason I wouldn't have the 2x safety factor. So why is it okay to accept a lower rating in this case if your setup is only as strong as your weakest point? I'm still getting used to the saddle so I'm still a little nervous about some things when I'm 25 ft in a tree, so I just want to make sure I'm being safe.
Click to expand...
You are correct. The ropeman is not intended to be used as a sole life support device. The original ropeman1 from just a couple years ago was only rated for 4 kN! This one came out a year or 2 ago.

To answer your question as to why is it acceptable.... basically that is something that is up to each user to decide on their own. The 22 kN recommendation is intended for arborists, rock climbers, etc. Do they do the same things as us? Not exactly, but they are the closest thing that we have to look to for guidance. Some of the gear used in the hunting industry is rated way below that number. In fact if you look at some of the stuff they are selling, it is pure junk. With just a little bit of knowledge you can make something of higher quality and safer for often much cheaper.

Safety comes first and I do try to stick to that 22 kN number as often as I can. You can also build redundancy into your system. If you put a prussic below your ropeman it would allow you to use the ropeman for the easy adjustment but have the prussik as a backup. If you search around you will find users who are doing this.
 
Thanks guys for the prusik idea. I'll definitely be adding one as that makes a lot more sense to me. Even if climbing sticks or something I don't see a fall being more than a few feet but you never know how that ropeman or biner might twist. Chances are it won't be the ideal orientation for the fall so I feel like the "overkill" of the extra amount the equipment is rated for really isn't overkill at all.

I know what you mean about stuff being pure junk. I had a harness from a hunting brand for a while that I ended up getting rid of because I thought if I jumped and fell a few feet there's no way something on it wouldn't snap. But it was better than when I was younger and didn't use one period.
 
redsquirrel said:
You are correct. The ropeman is not intended to be used as a sole life support device. The original ropeman1 from just a couple years ago was only rated for 4 kN! This one came out a year or 2 ago.

To answer your question as to why is it acceptable.... basically that is something that is up to each user to decide on their own. The 22 kN recommendation is intended for arborists, rock climbers, etc. Do they do the same things as us? Not exactly, but they are the closest thing that we have to look to for guidance. Some of the gear used in the hunting industry is rated way below that number. In fact if you look at some of the stuff they are selling, it is pure junk. With just a little bit of knowledge you can make something of higher quality and safer for often much cheaper.

Safety comes first and I do try to stick to that 22 kN number as often as I can. You can also build redundancy into your system. If you put a prussic below your ropeman it would allow you to use the ropeman for the easy adjustment but have the prussik as a backup. If you search around you will find users who are doing this.
Click to expand...

Red is spot on.

I think it's great to plan for the worst case scenario. However, in reality we will never get close to testing the limits of the Ropeman. You'd have to be doing something seriously ignorant or flagrantly risky to find that extreme.
 
I always back it up. No worries. If you use a short tether you can simply tie a loop in the end and clip on.

If you rig an autoblock (search justsomedude autoblock ) you can also use that to rappel down if you want to switch over to an ATC (what I do).

With some setups, I put a daisy chain around the tree and clip into that as a backup and as a way to distribute weight
 
Ontariofarmer said:
You are correct that a ropeman is not rated high enough for a long fall. In rock climbing falls can be much farther so greater strength and dynamic rope is needed.

If we are tethered our fall will be inches or we may slide a bit down a tree On a linemans belt the same thing would occur. Both would not stress our equipment the same as a rock climber.

I feel way safer in an aerohunter than a climber stand or lock on.
If you are worried put a prussic on the tail of your rope and clip it to your harness and leave a stopper below the prussic on the tether.

It takes a while to get used to a saddle. I don't like heights and cannot afford to fall but I feel safe in a saddle
Some of what is suggested on this site is not always up to standard. Many use a ropeman 1 on 9 mm rope. Not recommended A sit drag without a backup is not up to standards.


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Click to expand...
Furtive said:
Lots of good information here this thread should be a sticky IMO. Makes a lot of sense to always back your system up.
Click to expand...
 
Hi: u seem very knowledgeable and I'm hoping you can provide me a quick tutorial. Just got a sitdrag and I will use it with a HSS harness. What else do I need bridge-wise? I like redundancies so I will want to be tethered to he tree two times.
 
Mike said:
Hi: u seem very knowledgeable and I'm hoping you can provide me a quick tutorial. Just got a sitdrag and I will use it with a HSS harness. What else do I need bridge-wise? I like redundancies so I will want to be tethered to he tree two times.
Click to expand...
I am not a long time saddle hunter and only have knowledge of some of our equipment because my grown children rock climb and ice climb at a fairly high level. They want to keep their dad safe so I ask them questions.

I trust my bridge. I have a fixed bridge made with 9 mm ultra tech. It is rated for I think 8000 pounds. When I first started two years ago I felt the same as you about redundancies and being tethered multiple times. With very little time and practice you become confident in your equipment so that you minimize those redundancies. Some of which are unnecessary.
A prussic on the end of your tree tether is not a bad idea. I do use a ropeman 1 on 9 mm ultra tech rope but it is not recommended so I do go beyond the standards set by the makers of the ropeman 1. I do have a prussic at the bottom of my tether though for backup. Many others do too. I may try an adjustable bridge on a ropeman with a petzl ring like Ernie spoke about for my bridge.

Many use a sit drag without a rock climbing harness. I would be reluctant to do that. Some feel it is a small risk. Probably less risky than sitting in a ladder stand without a harness - many people do that fall asleep and get badly hurt.

If you are unsure about things, use an aerohunter which is super safe until you feel confident. I think the worst that could happen is a slip with your linemans belt attached to the tree which would probably scrape you up.

You will gain confidence as you use your equipment. I do not think it is very likely that we would have long falls that would put great stresses on our equipment. I know my son has fallen rock climbing several feet... 10 feet or more when lead climbing but his equipment is designed to handle that stress.I cannot see us falling that far if we use our equipment properly.

My disclaimer. I am not an expert at all - this is just what I have learned from others on this site and from my kids and from my limited experience. So I am speaking as a fairly new hunter and saddle hunter. Because of this I can certainly relate to your fears. My age 59 years old makes me cautious too. Caution will be reduced with confidence in your equipment. Practice.
 
Mike said:
Hi: u seem very knowledgeable and I'm hoping you can provide me a quick tutorial. Just got a sitdrag and I will use it with a HSS harness. What else do I need bridge-wise? I like redundancies so I will want to be tethered to he tree two times.
Click to expand...
Ontariofarmer said:
I am not a long time saddle hunter and only have knowledge of some of our equipment because my grown children rock climb and ice climb at a fairly high level. They want to keep their dad safe so I ask them questions.

I trust my bridge. I have a fixed bridge made with 9 mm ultra tech. It is rated for I think 8000 pounds. When I first started two years ago I felt the same as you about redundancies and being tethered multiple times. With very little time and practice you become confident in your equipment so that you minimize those redundancies. Some of which are unnecessary.
A prussic on the end of your tree tether is not a bad idea. I do use a ropeman 1 on 9 mm ultra tech rope but it is not recommended so I do go beyond the standards set by the makers of the ropeman 1. I do have a prussic at the bottom of my tether though for backup. Many others do too. I may try an adjustable bridge on a ropeman with a petzl ring like Ernie spoke about for my bridge.

Many use a sit drag without a rock climbing harness. I would be reluctant to do that. Some feel it is a small risk. Probably less risky than sitting in a ladder stand without a harness - many people do that fall asleep and get badly hurt.

If you are unsure about things, use an aerohunter which is super safe until you feel confident. I think the worst that could happen is a slip with your linemans belt attached to the tree which would probably scrape you up.

You will gain confidence as you use your equipment. I do not think it is very likely that we would have long falls that would put great stresses on our equipment. I know my son has fallen rock climbing several feet... 10 feet or more when lead climbing but his equipment is designed to handle that stress.I cannot see us falling that far if we use our equipment properly.

My disclaimer. I am not an expert at all - this is just what I have learned from others on this site and from my kids and from my limited experience. So I am speaking as a fairly new hunter and saddle hunter. Because of this I can certainly relate to your fears. My age 59 years old makes me cautious too. Caution will be reduced with confidence in your equipment. Practice.
Click to expand...
I agree with Ontariofarmer here. It is great to have redundancies, but it is even more important to use high quality primary equipment so that you can have full confidence in it.
 
I may be mistaken, but wasn't the failure mode on the ropeman when using small cable that it cut the rope? If not, you could overcome a "small" rope with a thick carabiner.

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Also the ropeman2 is rated for thinner rope, you just need to use a rope with a hard jacket so it won't eat it up. The kong duck is rated for smaller rope also and it works great on a tether.
 
g2outdoors said:
I may be in the minority here, but I believe the chances of catastrophic Ropeman failure under normal hunting cirumstances are about as high as a catastrophic rope/tether failure from a freak accident; like cutting it with your broadhead while maneuvering.
Click to expand...
I totally agree with you but the ratings are what they are. However , I would not want to test the ropeman with a large fall which is extremely unlikely for us. Force is increased with the distance you fall. I doubt we would fall more than 2 feet with a loose tether.
 
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