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Bad Penetration.....Again

Glad i could help out! Also, I entered some of you arrow info into an FOC calculator, and your FOC was rather low, between 7-8 percent. Along with broadhead adaptor rings, you may want to also consider bumping up to a heavier head

I suggest a brass insert so you can use readily available heads like 100-125grn from any store. I use 100gr slick trick standards because of their long range accuracy. 520grns total at 70lbs, 28.5” draw, I think I could shoot a whitetail bow to stern.
 
Something to keep in mind when you increase the mass at the front of the arrow - you’re going to put some additional stress on the components and connections.

I’d like to get in more detail in another thread, but essentially - putting a 300 grain broadhead on a standard length cheapo aluminum insert is probably not a good idea.
 
FMJ''S and wasp jackhammer's go through shoulder blade and through the length of the body and out back hip. Works for me. Only time I've broken a FMJ is due to slapping rocks then the target
 
I'm thinking I have determined through all the help everyone has offered that the culprit is an improperly assembled arrow. Thanks to @Matki15 who pointed out that Easton requires a broad head adapter ring to protect the shaft. Shaft integrity was compromised. I can imagine that anything can happen when the broad head is no longer solidly fixed on the shaft. I do agree with you about the deer's change in position effecting impact point and trajectory of the arrow after impact. Couple that with a an arrow that comes apart on impact and I'm pretty sure we answered the questions I needed answers to. Now moving forward, I need to think about my arrow set up, bow tuning, and broad head selection.

I’ve use Easton arrows with HIT inserts (FMJ and carbon) for 12 years and more than 75 animals killed and never once used the recommended BAR. Maybe the specific broadhead you used makes a difference?


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Glad i could help out! Also, I entered some of you arrow info into an FOC calculator, and your FOC was rather low, between 7-8 percent. Along with broadhead adaptor rings, you may want to also consider bumping up to a heavier head

If you listen to some of the top shooters in the world like Levi they don’t even worry about FOC that much and when asked Levi didn’t even know the foc of his hunting setup. Imo it’s not as important as a properly built arrow and tuned bow. Also it’s worth getting an arrow spinner to check for alignment of broadhead I’ve noticed that sometimes they need to be micro adjusted to get to spin true
 
I suggest a brass insert so you can use readily available heads like 100-125grn from any store. I use 100gr slick trick standards because of their long range accuracy. 520grns total at 70lbs, 28.5” draw, I think I could shoot a whitetail bow to stern.
I agree, on my personal setup I use the standard inserts, just because my broadheads are 165 grains already and are inexpensive. For people using other broadheads a brass insert would be much better
 
If you listen to some of the top shooters in the world like Levi they don’t even worry about FOC that much and when asked Levi didn’t even know the foc of his hunting setup. Imo it’s not as important as a properly built arrow and tuned bow. Also it’s worth getting an arrow spinner to check for alignment of broadhead I’ve noticed that sometimes they need to be micro adjusted to get to spin true
I agree that a properly built setup is more important, but in my opinion a higher FOC helps on the times when an arrow may encounter bone or something similar
 
I’ve use Easton arrows with HIT inserts (FMJ and carbon) for 12 years and more than 75 animals killed and never once used the recommended BAR. Maybe the specific broadhead you used makes a difference?


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I concur about the BAR adapter I never used it. I do beleive his arrows must have passed through and hit something hard to push insert back into arrow which I’ve had happen myself. My issues with the fmj were this as well as I’ve had them dent or bend from shooting groups. With the aluminum once then bend or get a dent mine as well throw them in the trash. I went to a full carbon shaft gt xt hunters and I’ve beet the crap out of these arrows. I’ve shot them into trees and just unscrewed the fieldpoint and put a new one on. I have also broke them but not nearly as brittle as the fmj imo. The concept is great for building a heavy arrow just not as durable.
 
Glad i could help out! Also, I entered some of you arrow info into an FOC calculator, and your FOC was rather low, between 7-8 percent. Along with broadhead adaptor rings, you may want to also consider bumping up to a heavier head
I agree 100%. I'm going to build some arrows,whether they're FMJs or gold tips, I'm going to add a 100 gr total arrow weight and I'm going to increase my FOC. I will make sure they're to manufacturers specs in regards to component compatibility.
Something to keep in mind when you increase the mass at the front of the arrow - you’re going to put some additional stress on the components and connections.

I’d like to get in more detail in another thread, but essentially - putting a 300 grain broadhead on a standard length cheapo aluminum insert is probably not a good idea.
I agree completely. As much as I like the idea of the massive cut of an expandable the Trypan it self does not withstand any bone. I hit rib and the head was a mess. I'll go to a beefier everything.
 
I like to stick with arrows and components that are somewhat simple to get anywhere for just in case.

Gold tip hunters or also I really liked the axis arrows as well.

Gold tip makes different weight inserts I run what comes with them but they do sell an aluminum 50 as well as a brass 100. I like to run 125 gt exodus heads. Can’t say enough good about the exodus never had a failure and has replaceable blades. Just check your state laws some states can’t used barbed head which the swept blade could be considered.
 
Just make sure you get correct spine if adding that much weight to insert as it’ll most likely bump you up to a stiffer spine which will also give you more GPI as well.
 
FMJ''S and wasp jackhammer's go through shoulder blade and through the length of the body and out back hip. Works for me. Only time I've broken a FMJ is due to slapping rocks then the target
I do love the FMJs. I've been shooting them along time, using a different broadhead.
If you listen to some of the top shooters in the world like Levi they don’t even worry about FOC that much and when asked Levi didn’t even know the foc of his hunting setup. Imo it’s not as important as a properly built arrow and tuned bow. Also it’s worth getting an arrow spinner to check for alignment of broadhead I’ve noticed that sometimes they need to be micro adjusted to get to spin true
 
If you listen to some of the top shooters in the world like Levi they don’t even worry about FOC that much and when asked Levi didn’t even know the foc of his hunting setup. Imo it’s not as important as a properly built arrow and tuned bow. Also it’s worth getting an arrow spinner to check for alignment of broadhead I’ve noticed that sometimes they need to be micro adjusted to get to spin true
I have it on my arrow building shopping list, along with my shaft cutoff saw.
 
Just make sure you get correct spine if adding that much weight to insert as it’ll most likely bump you up to a stiffer spine which will also give you more GPI as well.
In looking at the easton chart for my setup I'm already on the weaker end of things. My thought is to increase total weight, increase FOC, and replace all components with more suitably rated options.
 
I like to stick with arrows and components that are somewhat simple to get anywhere for just in case.

Gold tip hunters or also I really liked the axis arrows as well.

Gold tip makes different weight inserts I run what comes with them but they do sell an aluminum 50 as well as a brass 100. I like to run 125 gt exodus heads. Can’t say enough good about the exodus never had a failure and has replaceable blades. Just check your state laws some states can’t used barbed head which the swept blade could be considered.
We can't use that head here in MA.
 
Something to keep in mind when you increase the mass at the front of the arrow - you’re going to put some additional stress on the components and connections.

I’d like to get in more detail in another thread, but essentially - putting a 300 grain broadhead on a standard length cheapo aluminum insert is probably not a good idea.
I'd like to get into some arrow building discussions as I move forward to build a better arrow. I've really only been a, go to the shop have them cut arrows to length, put the components together and pick a broadhead and go shoot. I have paper tuned and broad head tuned so I could hit what I was shooting at, but I kept it very basic. I can do a better job of tuning my bow, making sure I'm shooting with the best form I can. I've always kept my effective maximum hunting range short, and getting away with a lot, so I now I'm finding with a little more educated effort I can build a better arrow myself. I know the guys at the shop do their best, but no one is going to take the time to make sure that things are as they should be better than me. It's my responsibility to make sure it's the best I can make it, I'm the one that's shooting these things at a live animal. I embrace this opportunity to do a better job all the way around.
 
I concur about the BAR adapter I never used it. I do beleive his arrows must have passed through and hit something hard to push insert back into arrow which I’ve had happen myself. My issues with the fmj were this as well as I’ve had them dent or bend from shooting groups. With the aluminum once then bend or get a dent mine as well throw them in the trash. I went to a full carbon shaft gt xt hunters and I’ve beet the crap out of these arrows. I’ve shot them into trees and just unscrewed the fieldpoint and put a new one on. I have also broke them but not nearly as brittle as the fmj imo. The concept is great for building a heavy arrow just not as durable.

Yeah, that’s why I’m shooting the all carbon axis now. Less drama potential. The thick carbon walled axis is one of the toughest arrows available.


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I'd like to get into some arrow building discussions as I move forward to build a better arrow. I've really only been a, go to the shop have them cut arrows to length, put the components together and pick a broadhead and go shoot. I have paper tuned and broad head tuned so I could hit what I was shooting at, but I kept it very basic. I can do a better job of tuning my bow, making sure I'm shooting with the best form I can. I've always kept my effective maximum hunting range short, and getting away with a lot, so I now I'm finding with a little more educated effort I can build a better arrow myself. I know the guys at the shop do their best, but no one is going to take the time to make sure that things are as they should be better than me. It's my responsibility to make sure it's the best I can make it, I'm the one that's shooting these things at a live animal. I embrace this opportunity to do a better job all the way around.

Don’t go too far down that rabbit hole, you’ll end up with a $400 spine tester to identify the stiff/weak side. It’s a slippery slope (ask me how I know). Honestly, I enjoy the process and the detailed method certainly will build your confidence.


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I'm thinking I have determined through all the help everyone has offered that the culprit is an improperly assembled arrow. Thanks to @Matki15 who pointed out that Easton requires a broad head adapter ring to protect the shaft. Shaft integrity was compromised. I can imagine that anything can happen when the broad head is no longer solidly fixed on the shaft. I do agree with you about the deer's change in position effecting impact point and trajectory of the arrow after impact. Couple that with a an arrow that comes apart on impact and I'm pretty sure we answered the questions I needed answers to. Now moving forward, I need to think about my arrow set up, bow tuning, and broad head selection.
Kurt, I have been shooting Rage 3 blades for the last 15 years and have literally killed hundreds of hogs, deer and exotics. I recently switched to the trypans because I was tired of replacing the broad head after every animal. I always had pass throughs with the older 3 blades, but I have shot 4 animals with the trypans and none have passed through. If you look at the older cut on contact tip of the 3 blades the ferrule was slightly conical after the tip, which allowed the head to go around bone, I believe the chisel tip on the trypans has a tendency to lodge in bone as opposed to deflecting around it. I will switch away from the trypans after hearing your story, I thought my occurrences were flukes.
 
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