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Anyone else using a schwabisch hitch on their tether?

Fooled around with this a little tonight. In your video you're never really putting much weight on the hitch. How well is the tender working after you really set some weight into it? I tried it for my tether and after I set that hitch good I wouldn't be able to budge it with the tender.
What hitch are you using? There's not much you can do to make a standard prusik adjust easily. Trying a different hitch, such as a schwabisch or distel, can make all of the difference in the world. I'm heavy, so I use a valdotain tresse on my tether because it's one of the easiest to adjust after heavy loading. I use the schwabisch on my LB.

Another thing to consider is friction between the tether/LB and the device. (Dee ring, in my case.) If you're pulling upward or out to the side, there's going to be substantial friction generated where the rope bends around the device. This is one reason I prefer the metal dee ring, it's very smooth.

Then there's the size differential in the diameter of the rope, the prusik cord, and the thickness of the device. You want the ring to be thin enough to fit snugly into the "corner" of where the rope and prusik cord meet. A fat ring doesn't break the friction of the hitch as easily as a thin one. You also want the ring to be just big enough to fit the rope through freely, creating more contact with the hitch. This prevents the hitch from jamming into the ring, effectively pinching it tighter onto the rope. This is why we place a thumb and forefinger on the top of the hitch and slide it down, rather than hamfisting it and trying to slide it down the rope. The goal is to break friction, not increase it.

Lastly, the length of the tender must be compatible with the length of the hitch. If the tender is too short, there will be slack in the hitch after advancement, thus making for difficult fine-tuning, and wasting effort as well as adding unneeded movement. If the tender is too long, the rope will act as if there is no tender at all.

If it would help, I'll take some photos or a video to aid in visualizing what I have so poorly articulated. I have a difficult time putting into words the ideas I try to express.

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Last edited:
What hitch are you using? There's not much you can do to make a standard prusik adjust easily. Trying a different hitch, such as a schwabisch or distel, can make all of the difference in the world. I'm heavy, so I use a valdotain tresse on my tether because it's one of the easiest to adjust after heavy loading. I use the schwabisch on my LB.

Another thing to consider is friction between the tether/LB and the device. (Dee ring, in my case.) If you're pulling upward or out to the side, there's going to be substantial friction generated where the rope bends around the device. This is one reason I prefer the metal dee ring, it's very smooth.

Then there's the size differential in the diameter of the rope, the prusik cord, and the thickness of the device. You want the ring to be thin enough to fit snugly into the "corner" of where the rope and prusik cord meet. A fat ring doesn't break the friction of the hitch as easily as a thin one. You also want the ring to be just big enough to fit the rope through freely, creating more contact with the hitch. This prevents the hitch from jamming into the ring, effectively pinching it tighter onto the rope. This is why we place a thumb and forefinger on the top of the hitch and slide it down, rather than hamfisting it and trying to slide it down the rope. The goal is to break friction, not increase it.

Lastly, the length of the tender must be compatible with the length of the hitch. If the tender is too short, there will be slack in the hitch after advancement, thus making for difficult fine-tuning, and wasting effort as well as adding unneeded movement. If the tender is too long, the rope will act as if there is no tender at all.

If it would help, I'll take some photos or a video to aid in visualizing what I have so poorly articulated. I have a difficult time putting into words the ideas I try to express.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk

Pics would be appreciated. I like this idea. I plan on trying it out. I’m a heavy guy, so I’ll try the knots you use.

Any places to order the dee ring for 11mm line?

Thx!


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Pics would be appreciated. I like this idea. I plan on trying it out. I’m a heavy guy, so I’ll try the knots you use.

Any places to order the dee ring for 11mm line?

Thx!

Somebody had posted this a while back as a purpose-made tender: https://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?item=2076

The current lineman's belt from aerohunter also comes with this style of tender, so that's another option. Theirs is used with a prusik rather than a schwabasch or distel hitch, and they sell the whole system, so it's probably overkill if you already have the rope.

I've tried a tender with all 3 knots (prusik, schwabash, and distel), and the distel hitch was the only one for me that didn't bind so much that it prevented the tender from doing any good. Others here say the schwabash works fine for them, so my issues may have stemmed from the ropes/sizes/# of wraps used.

This is what I followed to tie the distel hitch: https://www.animatedknots.com/distel/index.php
 
Somebody had posted this a while back as a purpose-made tender: https://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?item=2076

The current lineman's belt from aerohunter also comes with this style of tender, so that's another option. Theirs is used with a prusik rather than a schwabasch or distel hitch, and they sell the whole system, so it's probably overkill if you already have the rope.

I've tried a tender with all 3 knots (prusik, schwabash, and distel), and the distel hitch was the only one for me that didn't bind so much that it prevented the tender from doing any good. Others here say the schwabash works fine for them, so my issues may have stemmed from the ropes/sizes/# of wraps used.

This is what I followed to tie the distel hitch: https://www.animatedknots.com/distel/index.php
You're correct that every combination of rope and prusik cord will act differently. Some are more compatible than others. I've tried some that simply will not bite well and will slip when I take a big swing from one tree to another or from one limb to another. I've also tried some that bite too well, and I can't easily adjust my hitch even with the minimum number of wraps. Unfortunately, it sometimes requires some trial and error. One good resource for information on this subject is the Treebuzz forum. There are plenty of guys on there that are glad to make recommendations and share personal experiences with different rope/prusik combinations. The rope and prusik cord diameter is just one aspect. Jacket design and material has a lot to do with how they interact.

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Pics would be appreciated. I like this idea. I plan on trying it out. I’m a heavy guy, so I’ll try the knots you use.

Any places to order the dee ring for 11mm line?

Thx!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'll try to take some tonight. Unfortunately, I scavenged the dee rings I used from a toolbag that I had lying around, but I'll get some measurements and see what I can come up with. Another option is a ring like the one below. If you check out REI or a similar place, you can find one that's small enough to work. I prefer one that my rope fits through with just a little room to spare. (REI has some for as little as $5)
a3862b8395fd39f655f6a8e519d0271a.jpg


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Last edited:
What hitch are you using? There's not much you can do to make a standard prusik adjust easily. Trying a different hitch, such as a schwabisch or distel, can make all of the difference in the world. I'm heavy, so I use a valdotain tresse on my tether because it's one of the easiest to adjust after heavy loading. I use the schwabisch on my LB.

Another thing to consider is friction between the tether/LB and the device. (Dee ring, in my case.) If you're pulling upward or out to the side, there's going to be substantial friction generated where the rope bends around the device. This is one reason I prefer the metal dee ring, it's very smooth.

Then there's the size differential in the diameter of the rope, the prusik cord, and the thickness of the device. You want the ring to be thin enough to fit snugly into the "corner" of where the rope and prusik cord meet. A fat ring doesn't break the friction of the hitch as easily as a thin one. You also want the ring to be just big enough to fit the rope through freely, creating more contact with the hitch. This prevents the hitch from jamming into the ring, effectively pinching it tighter onto the rope. This is why we place a thumb and forefinger on the top of the hitch and slide it down, rather than hamfisting it and trying to slide it down the rope. The goal is to break friction, not increase it.

Lastly, the length of the tender must be compatible with the length of the hitch. If the tender is too short, there will be slack in the hitch after advancement, thus making for difficult fine-tuning, and wasting effort as well as adding unneeded movement. If the tender is too long, the rope will act as if there is no tender at all.

If it would help, I'll take some photos or a video to aid in visualizing what I have so poorly articulated. I have a difficult time putting into words the ideas I try to express.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
Thanks for your detailed reply! I was using a schwabisch. It was just a quick try last night before bed. I am definitely going to tinker with it more. I figured it could just be a matter of finding the right combination of rope/hitch cord and making it all work.
 
One thing I did notice yesterday is I had an issue with the hitch not grabbing well at 1st. I had to pull it really tight then leaned into even pushing away from the tree and now it locks solid. I assume there was just a little slack in the hitch and slowly leaning into it didn't get it out.

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Somebody had posted this a while back as a purpose-made tender: https://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?item=2076

The current lineman's belt from aerohunter also comes with this style of tender, so that's another option. Theirs is used with a prusik rather than a schwabasch or distel hitch, and they sell the whole system, so it's probably overkill if you already have the rope.

I've tried a tender with all 3 knots (prusik, schwabash, and distel), and the distel hitch was the only one for me that didn't bind so much that it prevented the tender from doing any good. Others here say the schwabash works fine for them, so my issues may have stemmed from the ropes/sizes/# of wraps used.

This is what I followed to tie the distel hitch: https://www.animatedknots.com/distel/index.php

Thanks for the link on the purpose made tender. I already have linemans/tether with:
11 mm blue water assault line
7mm dynamic prusik cord from blue water

I have the corresponding animated knots app which I use. Definitely worth it.

Thanks!
 
I'll try to take some tonight. Unfortunately, I scavenged the dee rings I used from a toolbag that I had lying around, but I'll get some measurements and see what I can come up with. Another option is a ring like the one below. If you check oit REI or a similar place, you can find one that's small enough to work. I prefer one that my rope fits through with just a little room to spare. (REI has some for as little as $5)
a3862b8395fd39f655f6a8e519d0271a.jpg


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With the ring, how much bigger than 11mm would you think I need? Also, do you connect it with paracord?

Thanks.
 
Does anyone use a distel hitch for their linemans rope or is the prussik best for the linemans
 
@sojourner I just used a small non-weight rated carabiner and some 2.5mm accessory chord. I found one just slightly bigger on its large end than the rope I’m using. Its worked great so fa on the swabisch. It probably helps that my chord on the hitch is pretty large too so the tender doesnt slip over it.
 
Thanks for your detailed reply! I was using a schwabisch. It was just a quick try last night before bed. I am definitely going to tinker with it more. I figured it could just be a matter of finding the right combination of rope/hitch cord and making it all work.

No problem! Let me know if I can help in any way.

P.S.
If you like the idea of the Schwabisch, but it's still a little difficult to adjust, check out the distel hitch. Very similar, but even easier to adjust.

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One thing I did notice yesterday is I had an issue with the hitch not grabbing well at 1st. I had to pull it really tight then leaned into even pushing away from the tree and now it locks solid. I assume there was just a little slack in the hitch and slowly leaning into it didn't get it out.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
Yep, that is common, even with well matched cordage and proven hitches. Sometimes it's just because the prusik cord is stiff and needs to be set enthusiastically. Every time I tie in with my arborist rig, I set the hitch as tight as I can by hand, then (at ground level) bounce my weight on it to pull all slack out and get a good bite. If you don't untie it, you probably won't have to do it again next time. Just check that it's biting well before unclipping your LB.

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With the ring, how much bigger than 11mm would you think I need? Also, do you connect it with paracord?

Thanks.
I would make it the same way I made my dee ring tender. Sewn into webbing. Paracord will work, but I like the webbing. Just my personal preference.
As far as size goes, I'd have to see it to say for sure, but I don't think you'd want more than a 13 mm ID. (Inside diameter.) If it's too big, the friction hitch may wedge into it, pinching the rope and creating more friction.
If it was me, I'd probably take my tether/LB, with hitch tied on, with me to REI and slip it onto the rope to test fit.

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@sojourner I just used a small non-weight rated carabiner and some 2.5mm accessory chord. I found one just slightly bigger on its large end than the rope I’m using. Its worked great so fa on the swabisch. It probably helps that my chord on the hitch is pretty large too so the tender doesnt slip over it.
I've used a carabiner or a screwlink before, they can work very well.

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This is my diy tender, using paracord and a little plastic ring I pulled off of an old pack I had. It's shown with a prusik here, but I've since changed that to a distel hitch on my lineman's belt and it works great- easy one-handed operation.
index.php
So you use it similar to a ropeman by simply pulling up on the tag end of your tether or linesmans?
 
Something to consider is that hitches used in a single line configuration will typically not tend as well due to total weight on the hitch and for example with the hybrid srt devices utilize a secondary friction point to allow descending on a hitch. While you are not descending using your tether the friction factor is the same when making adjustments in tether length.
 
I just tried a 5 wrap Michocan hitch with a 8mm Oceans Prussia cord on my Poison Ivy tether using DMM Hitchclimber pulley and a DMM oval biner works very smoothly.
 
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