Be sure to cut a groove for the feather quill. Otherwise your template will rock and not hold the feather portion in place while the blade cuts. Then you get wonky fletch
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A&A feathers
- Thread starter Allegheny Tom
- Start date
@Allegheny Tom
QUESTION: In order to get great arrow flight with the A & A fletching (2.5"-3", 4 fletch, low profile feathers), do you have to have rock solid form and arrow spine?
This has my interest peaked, but I'm afraid I'm about to jump head first into a rabbit hole.
QUESTION: In order to get great arrow flight with the A & A fletching (2.5"-3", 4 fletch, low profile feathers), do you have to have rock solid form and arrow spine?
This has my interest peaked, but I'm afraid I'm about to jump head first into a rabbit hole.
U probably only need the "turbulator" directly in front of the feather but that would be hard to apply correctly so the easier mark/wrap/whatever around the whole circumference is done
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I mean unless you have schlieren imaging or some other test set up that allows you to see the air flow separation all of this is hypothetical or speculative at best. Again, the smaller fletching benefits are fairly intuitive, the turbulator is a stretch for me. Also, while we are speculating let me speculate. I would say that I would not think that you would just need a piece only in front of the fletching. If you only had 3 single pieces in front of each fletching you would have a mixture of turbulent flow and laminar flow. You would then have three smaller flow separations and then still have a larger flow separation from the arrow at the end. I am having trouble speculating how this would be beneficial. Naturally, (without a turbulator) your turbulent flow separation will occur a little past the end of the fletching/arrow and using a turbulator to create flow separation ahead of the fletching would cause the flow separation before the end of the arrow. Making the turbulent flow transition sooner would increase friction drag which may contribute to the smaller vanes ability to more effectively stabilize the arrow. Regardless, I am still not convinced the that would make a noticeable difference but it is interesting.
Totally irrelevant but fun discussing....if u look at an airplanes tail wing almost all designs from passenger to fighter jet all have a kinda built in "turbulator"
Man....its like sitting in chemistry class again. What the hell are you all saying??????
I was lied to, I went into traditional archery because I was told it was simpler than compound bows!
I was lied to, I went into traditional archery because I was told it was simpler than compound bows!
Well, I wouldn’t say “lied to”. That’s strong language. Maybe mislead?
I'm being dramatic and said it in jest. But man some of the technical details required to fly a straight arrow is getting a little overwhelming. I finally understand the main difference between compound and traditional. Compound you focus on tuning the bow, trad you tune the arrow. Mostly, tune everything, but the details are so intense.
You can tune the bow in rudimentary ways. Mostly yes, you are tuning an arrow. But in trad, you are not just tuning the arrow to the bow but also to your idiosyncratic inputs, most of which compound bow and mechanical release technology has worked to eliminate. It can be a challenge.
I certainly do not have rock solid form. We do these thing that we do to overcome the human flaws in our shooting. If you were to put a tuned bow/arrow combination in a shooting machine (yes they have such a device), the bow would be capable of shooting an arrow in the same hole repeatedly, and without any fletching or turbulators.
And regardless of turbulators or not, we should already strive for the proper spine.
I'd refer you to look into Ashby studies in order to keep all of this in context. The optimum arrow is an entire "package". Each aspect has some level of value and each aspect interacts with other aspects. Only a few details are an absolute requirement (head integrity, and straight flight upon impact, etc) but each does add towards to end goal of having full penetration.
It's one of the advantages of the Momentum shafts. The tapered shafts have a built-in FOC of about 7%.
Is there a reason for only cutting one small feather from each of those big feathers? seems like he could have made 2 or maybe 3 small A&A style feathers and saved himself a ton of money on fletching
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"turbulator" would suggest that it is designed to induce turbulance, if I am thinking about the right thing they are not designed to create turbulence.
Ok I am done talking it! I promise. Unless @Weldabeast eggs me on again
I know this thread is about the A&A (what does this stand for) fletchings, but I would like to know what insert + broadhead combo you are using to get to 664 total arrow weight. I have 300 spine arrows setup for my compound that have a 100 grain insert. I have 200 grain 2 blade broad heads that I would like to get to work with those same arrows. Its pretty close, an I am hoping I might be bale to add a little weight to the back of the insert to get it flying well, if not I will have to completely make new arrows for this bow. If I get it to work with a little more added weight I will be near 600 grains total arrow weight. I am currently using 3" feathers.
Yes, I assume he’s doing that out of expedience for the video sake. You have to line up everything on the remaining pieces and that would look good for short video clips
Ashby and Adcock I believe
This really is pretty simple unless you get into the minutia of all the reasons why the details work. Nothing at all wrong with wanting to totally understand how/why something works, but it's not a requirement.
If you really want to twist your brain in knots, then go check out all of the details in each and every Ashby report. Man, there is so much geometry, trigonometry, and other scientific mumbo-jumbo and a lot is waaay over my simple head. But I always keep in mind exactly who Dr Ed Ashby is. Highly educated, former aeronautics engineer, former African hunting guide who has killed thousands of critters and studied, recorded, and quantified all of his dozens of arrow lethality studies. He's also started the non-profit Ashby Bowhunting Foundation whose goal is to study and further our knowledge of arrow lethality. The guy is the real deal and he does this all without making money from it. He doesn't even take money for allowing Grizzlystik to put his name on the Ashby broadheads.
So, if this man tells me my arrows will shoot, penetrate, and kill better if I add funky looking feathers and a turbulator, then I'm gonna take his word for it. He's learned and revealed more in his 30 year study than any of us can deduce with our anecdotal experiences.
I'm shooting Momentum 400 shafts. 29.25" long. Ethics insert/outserts with 2 posts cut of so they weigh 135. grains. 200 gr Samurai single bevel heads. My TAW is ~664 grains and my FOC is ~28%.
Nobody says that you have to be over 650 gr TAW, or over 19% FOC, but Ashby has determined that those numbers are where penetration starts to dramatically improve. He always says to decide for yourself just how far you want to go with all of this. Except for 2 things...head integrity, and perfect arrow flight. everything else is just making a good set-up even better.
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Thanks for the info. If i get to 600 grains it will be more a consequence of trying make what I already have work. It sounds like I will be somewhat close to your insert + broadhead weight.
So I just recently learn 3 River has tubes for carbon arrows. But I think you are not going to get the 30% FOC. a tube of 8 gpi would literally add 200+ to an arrow.
It is my understanding that the quills are optimally bound "better" in certain portions of the feather, I hope I'm saying that correctly. Therefor, most feather choppers only use the "best" part of each feather for fletching purposes.