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Amsteel Bridge Buries

Losing 70-80% should mean a final strength of 20-30% of original 8600lbs total would be 1,720-2580lbs

A final strength of 70-80% would be a 20-30% loss


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You are correct. The splice retains 70-80% strength. I probably should edit the original post so no one else gets confused.
 
Ok. Here is what the Samson Rope representative had to say regarding AmSteel Blue:

If making a whoopie sling the locked Brummel splice buried with 2 fids and an angle cut end can be done; however, the splice loses 70-80% of it's strength in that configuration. Their recommendation if using in a dogbone configuration: "If you are splicing a sling with two normal eye splices then it is best to use a 3 fid bury (same as 12-strand class II eye splice) in which I would recommend using our standard taper method of gradually removing 6 strands (1s and 1z pairing x 3) with a secondary taper (cutting 3 strands gradually)." See attached images.

As for as lock stitching is concerned, DO NOT use Zing-It or Lash-It. "We recommended to not use Lashit rope for lock-stitching. Dyneema or high grade fiber should not be used for lock-stitching as the lock-stitching does not add strength to the rope and serves the purpose of holding the splice in-tact before first load and prevent the splice from being pulled apart. If you use higher grade material like Dyneema, it could lead to potential issues once the rope is loaded and may even start cutting into itself if not lock-stitched properly. We recommend a polyester/nylon twine. I usually recommend a twine size that matches or is a little bit smaller than the width of a single strand on the actual rope itself."

He also sent me sizing chart for the lock stitch twine sizing. 1/4" should use #18 twine & 1/2" use #42 twine. See attached pdf.

Hope this helps anyone that was curious.

So they suggest using twine for a lock stitch?
 
Got it

Retained strength is definitely gonna be ur higher numbers


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They recommend a 3 fid bury. That is ~17" on each side. Makes for a really long bridge.
 
You might be able to overlap the two tapered ends, but I’ll have to check Samson rep about that.


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Mine are buried 8 inches and tapered. Brummel on one side, lock stitch on the other. Zero creep or slippage, which is all I cared about. Been hanging on it all spring and summer. There is no way my 170 pounds is breaking a 1/4 inch amsteel.
 
Wait, read it again. The Samson rope representative said "the splice loses 20-30% of it's strength in that configuration". I interpret that to mean that the rope retains 80-70% of its strength when using a locked Brummel splice buried with 2 fids.
 
Great info and thanks for sharing. Not having anything fancy on hand made me lucky in the end with my lock stitch which is great to know. You’ve got to be comfortable with year gear and confident your returning home safe.

I ran the G2 version this year and loved it. More of a taper might be nicer but not a big deal for me. Even with a slight bulge the Amsteel moved through the biner just fine when I needed it too and lack of knot bulk was phenomenal. If I do loose 30% of the 7,700 min making it 5,390# with the 8” burry I’m cool with that. Fortunately, I’m a 185# leaner and not a sitter, my bridge doesnt really have the opportunity to get shock loaded and I’m within my 300#ish working load capacity at a 15:1 factor. Based on those calcs, its probably about the same load rating as my double braid tether and linemans which would otherwise likely be my weakest link.
 
So I'm lost. What did Samson say about a locked brummel? Are they saying the locked brummel is weaker than an eye splice?
 
Just wondering thoughts on doing a locked broumble on both ends of 1/4 amsteel. Girth hitch in one side of the saddle and using a carabiner on the other side for a bridge?
 
Here's what I can say on this matter.
This is a 1/4" amsteel bridge with locked brummel splices and proper 2 1/4 fid burries on each end. We had to get a concrete testing machine to finally get enough force to break the Mantis last week. At an astounding number (details coming later) something finally broke. After inspection, the bridge was stiff from being pulled so hard but otherwise in good shape.

Keep in mind, that if the bridge rope is rated for 7700#, and you lose 30%, you are still left with over 5000. Then since the rope is actually doubled over by going through your carabiner on your tether, putting half the load is on each side, the bridge theoretically can hold 10000#.......

I personally don't know how much the bridge truly can hold because we still haven't been able to break one, but it's ALOT.

425b67b0ce2ae4dafd91d1d65e608d36.jpg
cb0ca0e6c0c7934d569d5fc94cd5a965.jpg


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Here's what I can say on this matter.
This is a 1/4" amsteel bridge with locked brummel splices and proper 2 1/4 fid burries on each end. We had to get a concrete testing machine to finally get enough force to break the Mantis last week. At an astounding number (details coming later) something finally broke. After inspection, the bridge was stiff from being pulled so hard but otherwise in good shape.

Keep in mind, that if the bridge rope is rated for 7700#, and you lose 30%, you are still left with over 5000. Then since the rope is actually doubled over by going through your carabiner on your tether, putting half the load is on each side, the bridge theoretically can hold 10000#.......

I personally don't know how much the bridge truly can hold because we still haven't been able to break one, but it's ALOT.

425b67b0ce2ae4dafd91d1d65e608d36.jpg
cb0ca0e6c0c7934d569d5fc94cd5a965.jpg


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In other words your body would rip in half long before the bridge or saddle broke lol. The strength is insane!


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Hahahaha @Erniepower “still haven’t been able to break one” is more than good enough for me!!!


....................................................................................All climbing methods, platforms, saddle designs, and/or use of materials possibly mentioned in the post above are not peer reviewed for safety, and should only be used as an example of my own method. Do your own research and testing before becoming confident in any DIY solution to support your life.
-IkemanTx
 
@Erniepower Thank you for this. We need more of this from manufacturers. Proper testing. It proves things and put's hunters at ease. I know it does for me anyways. I have two young babies I need to come home to. So with that said, if the bridge needs replacing because of fraying or just being worn out, do you recommend a locked brummel with a carabiner or a stitched spliced eye on one side?
 
Here's what I can say on this matter.
This is a 1/4" amsteel bridge with locked brummel splices and proper 2 1/4 fid burries on each end. We had to get a concrete testing machine to finally get enough force to break the Mantis last week. At an astounding number (details coming later) something finally broke. After inspection, the bridge was stiff from being pulled so hard but otherwise in good shape.

Keep in mind, that if the bridge rope is rated for 7700#, and you lose 30%, you are still left with over 5000. Then since the rope is actually doubled over by going through your carabiner on your tether, putting half the load is on each side, the bridge theoretically can hold 10000#.......

I personally don't know how much the bridge truly can hold because we still haven't been able to break one, but it's ALOT.

425b67b0ce2ae4dafd91d1d65e608d36.jpg
cb0ca0e6c0c7934d569d5fc94cd5a965.jpg


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Thanks Ernie.
Have you tested any whoopie buries?
I still have a hard time wrapping my head around what they say is the proper amount of bury for a brummel. Comparing to a whoopie bury in which it seems to hold just fine with 4" of bury, why does a bury for a brummel have to be ~17"? And while we are at it... if a locked brummel is already locked, then what does the bury do other than to hide the tag end?
 
Thanks Ernie.
Have you tested any whoopie buries?
I still have a hard time wrapping my head around what they say is the proper amount of bury for a brummel. Comparing to a whoopie bury in which it seems to hold just fine with 4" of bury, why does a bury for a brummel have to be ~17"? And while we are at it... if a locked brummel is already locked, then what does the bury do other than to hide the tag end?

I'll take a stab at this. The hollow braid works like a Chinese finger trap. The more bury the more surface area it has to trap as it get's pulled. If the bury was short this put's more force on the lock which is the weakest point. Same reason why Samson say's to stitch an eye splice. The part that fails in an eye splice is where it enters the hollow braid. If it wasn't stitched it would start to slip as it's pulled decreasing the surface area of the burry. The bury's are important. We cut corners to make it work for our application (as a bridge for saddle hunting). It's not recommended according to Samson.
 
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