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Do you tie off your saddle to the end of your tether?

Do you tie in to the end of your tether?

  • Yes

    Votes: 46 46.0%
  • No

    Votes: 54 54.0%

  • Total voters
    100
Yes this is what I was getting at. For 9 extra ounces, doesn’t sound that bad
Sorry if I misunderstood what you were saying. It sounded like you were talking about it as a way to help in a fall situation. Using it as back support would not concern me to much at all.
 
Sorry if I misunderstood what you were saying. It sounded like you were talking about it as a way to help in a fall situation. Using it as back support would not concern me to much at all.
No you were correct. I was thinking assistance with a fall situation. But in conjunction with a regular harness of course. I thought maybe the specific model i sited in my first example was just wrong. Was the Petzl one that Kyler sited more suited to that?
 
No you were correct. I was thinking assistance with a fall situation. But in conjunction with a regular harness of course. I thought maybe the specific model i sited in my first example was just wrong. Was the Petzl one that Kyler sited more suited to that?
I don’t know, it’s not something I’d fool with personally.
 
I don’t know, it’s not something I’d fool with personally.

you’re referencing the harness for advancing progress capture in rope climbing. The harness I posted is for fall protection while climbing.

it’s used as an extra layer of protection for heavier body weight climbers, those who don’t have the core strength needed to prevent injuries, and people carrying lots of gear (according to petzl).

bascially the use case describes most saddle hunters to a T haha.

just don’t know how well it would function for our purposes, nor do we have any idea right now if it would decrease risk.

@Vtbow what’s your level of experience with these rigs?
 
you’re referencing the harness for advancing progress capture in rope climbing. The harness I posted is for fall protection while climbing.

it’s used as an extra layer of protection for heavier body weight climbers, those who don’t have the core strength needed to prevent injuries, and people carrying lots of gear (according to petzl).

bascially the use case describes most saddle hunters to a T haha.

just don’t know how well it would function for our purposes, nor do we have any idea right now if it would decrease risk.

@Vtbow what’s your level of experience with these rigs?
Okay that’s what I thought. I mean I am hunting opening day either way, but if I can add 9 ounces to my gear in the form of a chest harness that adds “x” percent of shock absorption to my system, I will likely do it. Or at least attempt to diy something similar (hee hee). I mean I put something together with some extra tubular webbing I had, and tested it out hanging from my tether like I just took a fall, and my back sure would not move in that whiplash motion no matter how hard I tried. I’m interested.
 
you’re referencing the harness for advancing progress capture in rope climbing. The harness I posted is for fall protection while climbing.

it’s used as an extra layer of protection for heavier body weight climbers, those who don’t have the core strength needed to prevent injuries, and people carrying lots of gear (according to petzl).

bascially the use case describes most saddle hunters to a T haha.

just don’t know how well it would function for our purposes, nor do we have any idea right now if it would decrease risk.

@Vtbow what’s your level of experience with these rigs?
I"ve used them in situations where you may become inverted for one reason or another. I"ve always tethered them to my seat harness with a sling or 2 in order to keep them from riding up and/or pinching. I dont think they would be very applicable or helpful in this application.
 
Ok all DMM reached back out. As I explained, I told them for our applications the screamer (rip stop) would see a continuous load of 300 lbs or less. And the estimated forces from a 1.5:1 fall factor on a static line are 4kN to over 9kN. I asked her if the ripstop would work for this application and also as a primary method of lanyard attachment and here was her response:
“Thanks for getting in touch.



The ripstop has actually been discontinued so this is possibly a moot point anyway but for interest and your research purposes.



I think the ripstop is not the right product for your application.



The ripstop was designed to absorb the shock loaded on the gear placement in ice, to protect the placement and not to shock absorb the force to the load (person) in a fall.



The sling is fully deployed (i.e. extended) at a load of between 3.1-3.4 kN, following this the sling is rated at 22 kN when loaded longitudinally when new.



Typical test results:-



  1. To deploy = 3.3, 3.3, 3.1 kN
  2. Sling strength (extended) = 29.3, 27.9, 28.0 kN (rated 22 kN)


1 kN = approx.102 kg



So loading the sling at all times is not going to be a good idea, even a small dynamic movement such as a bounce could deploy the sling.



The forces you are enquiring about are high- really high! Even some of the worse factor 2 falls on climbing equipment would expect to generate around 6-7kN and one would expect some injury from experiencing this type of force.



A person experiencing forces of 9kN would have serious consequences.



You should look into some shock absorbers used for work at height, they maybe more suitable but remember that you need to ensure the clearance takes into account the maximum length when the whole system is deployed.



Some reading you may find useful has been published by Petzl here: https://www.petzl.com/INT/en/Profes...rk-at-height?ActivityName=Energy-and-networks





Best wishes


Holly Lindop
Customer Services

DMM International Ltd.
Llanberis, Gwynedd, LL55 4EL”
 
Ok all DMM reached back out. As I explained, I told them for our applications the screamer (rip stop) would see a continuous load of 300 lbs or less. And the estimated forces from a 1.5:1 fall factor on a static line are 4kN to over 9kN. I asked her if the ripstop would work for this application and also as a primary method of lanyard attachment and here was her response:
“Thanks for getting in touch.



The ripstop has actually been discontinued so this is possibly a moot point anyway but for interest and your research purposes.



I think the ripstop is not the right product for your application.



The ripstop was designed to absorb the shock loaded on the gear placement in ice, to protect the placement and not to shock absorb the force to the load (person) in a fall.



The sling is fully deployed (i.e. extended) at a load of between 3.1-3.4 kN, following this the sling is rated at 22 kN when loaded longitudinally when new.



Typical test results:-



  1. To deploy = 3.3, 3.3, 3.1 kN
  2. Sling strength (extended) = 29.3, 27.9, 28.0 kN (rated 22 kN)


1 kN = approx.102 kg



So loading the sling at all times is not going to be a good idea, even a small dynamic movement such as a bounce could deploy the sling.



The forces you are enquiring about are high- really high! Even some of the worse factor 2 falls on climbing equipment would expect to generate around 6-7kN and one would expect some injury from experiencing this type of force.



A person experiencing forces of 9kN would have serious consequences.



You should look into some shock absorbers used for work at height, they maybe more suitable but remember that you need to ensure the clearance takes into account the maximum length when the whole system is deployed.



Some reading you may find useful has been published by Petzl here: https://www.petzl.com/INT/en/Profes...rk-at-height?ActivityName=Energy-and-networks





Best wishes


Holly Lindop
Customer Services

DMM International Ltd.
Llanberis, Gwynedd, LL55 4EL”
Thanks for that.
Almost seems like you need to use a 6MM tether with the lanyard for it you fall. But you gotta be high enough for it to work....
 
Some points to add when she says used on ice to save the anchors, she means in a dynamic system, often with many anchor points or a belayer to help reduce the force. This is why she said a class 2 fall would only experience 6 to 7 kN and the person would be injured. I hope this response helps everyone understand what I was saying, if a fall occurs while one sticking, it isn’t the saddle that will fail you, it’s your body. Also a screamer should not be constantly weighted. Also if your fall force is high enough (ie a 3’ fall on a short tether) then the screamer will not reduce forces enough to help you. I am sorry if it upsets some people. Again if you’re using dynamic rope, it’ll reduce some force. If you place the scream taut but not completely loaded on a separate prusik above your tie in, it’ll help reduce force but it doesn’t seem like either one will reduce force on a fall restraint harness enough to make it safe. She also says that a person weighing over 1kN could easily deploy the screamer with the slightest of falls. Just some more food for thought.
Back to the OP about tying in. As I said I use a stopper knot at the end of my lanyard (whether it be linesman rope or tether) I also use a prusik instead of a mechanical because a prusik is stronger and lighter. A redundant tie in, isn’t required and if you have a strong well made saddle, and you inspect your gear before use,then your body will give out before your bridge or tether will.
 
Thanks for that.
Almost seems like you need to use a 6MM tether with the lanyard for it you fall. But you gotta be high enough for it to work....
Why a 6mm tether? That’s the minimum size of prusik cord I would use
 
I tie an Alpine butterfly underneath my Roperunner and then clip into the shared carabiner.
 
Why a 6mm tether? That’s the minimum size of prusik cord I would use
Use it as a tether with the lanyard as a separate tied in back up. Then your not loading the lanyard. When the cord breaks if you fall the lanyard will catch you. But would be another system to advance up the tree.
 
Use it as a tether with the lanyard as a separate tied in back up. Then your not loading the lanyard. When the cord breaks if you fall the lanyard will catch you. But would be another system to advance up the tree.
I am assuming in this instance you are referring to your lineman rope as the lanyard. A tether is also a lanyard by definition. I agree that keeping your linesman rope on while climbing , whether you are one sticking or using multiple sticks, is always a great idea. But it only helps if the rope is above your waist level and kept under tension. Using both while you one stick, could decrease the distance and fall factor, if you experienced a fall. Again if your linesman rope is used properly, you, the temporary slack in your tether would be of less concern. At least in my opinion
 
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