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New Gear Release 2022!

Plebe said:
Some of the companies we talk about have issued warnings or sent corrective parts to effected buyers. Some without attempting any spin.
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Yeah that is good they do that when needed. I was referring more to their choice of communication/marketing strategy.
 
As a follow-up, the Barren Ridge tubing dimensions are 3/4”x3/4”.


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Plebe said:
Sitka Ambient Collection


New from SITKA — Ambient Collection

Men’s and women’s insulation pieces available now at GOHUNT!
www.gohunt.com www.gohunt.com
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Wow $300 for a layering piece containing chopped post-consumer insulation - that’s pretty crazy.

I’m with @ricky racer on recommending that everyone try a Lamilite “liner jacket or liner vest” ($62, and free shipping) from Wiggy’s before investing in a $300 piece from Sitka. The liner jacket is far and away my favorite piece for an insulating mid-layer for all occasions. It’s better than any other mid layer I’ve tried, and I’ve tried most of them. It BREATHES and doesn’t get saturated with sweat when your activity level is high. For $62, you don’t have much to lose to give it a try.

www.wiggys.com

Liner Jacket

Manufacturer of the finest sleeping bags and outdoor gear in the world. Nothing keeps you you warm & dry in cold, wet conditions like Wiggy's!
www.wiggys.com www.wiggys.com
 
LoadedLimbs said:
Wow $300 for a layering piece containing chopped post-consumer insulation - that’s pretty crazy.

I’m with @ricky racer on recommending that everyone try a Lamilite “liner jacket or liner vest” ($62, and free shipping) from Wiggy’s before investing in a $300 piece from Sitka. The liner jacket is far and away my favorite piece for an insulating mid-layer for all occasions. It’s better than any other mid layer I’ve tried, and I’ve tried most of them. It BREATHES and doesn’t get saturated with sweat when your activity level is high. For $62, you don’t have much to lose to give it a try.

www.wiggys.com

Liner Jacket

Manufacturer of the finest sleeping bags and outdoor gear in the world. Nothing keeps you you warm & dry in cold, wet conditions like Wiggy's!
www.wiggys.com www.wiggys.com
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It's new gear for 2022, so I'm sharing it, even if it seems to be priced crazy.

But, in response to your comment:

1. Lamilite sounds like nice stuff. I've thought about trying some, but haven't
2. Ambient w/ Primaloft Evolve sounds like nice stuff, I haven't tried it nor have you
3. If you could get the Sitka for $100 more than the Wiggys, would it be worth a closer look at the actual differences?
 
Plebe said:
It's new gear for 2022, so I'm sharing it, even if it seems to be priced crazy.

But, in response to your comment:

1. Lamilite sounds like nice stuff. I've thought about trying some, but haven't
2. Ambient w/ Primaloft Evolve sounds like nice stuff, I haven't tried it nor have you
3. If you could get the Sitka for $100 more than the Wiggys, would it be worth a closer look at the actual differences?
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@Plebe - Posting the Ambient line in this thread was cool - I wasn’t judging THAT.

Frankly, my reply with a link to old gear is questionable in this thread, but I just thought I’d mention a much more economical alternative to the readers who might be tempted to drop that kind of coin on a layering piece. And the liner jacket is one that I can personally vouch for as one of the best layering pieces I’ve tried, over a couple seasons of use in a variety of conditions.

I’m sure the Sitka piece is really nice - they don’t make crap. Their product lines command the price they charge because a lot of guys conclude it’s worth it.

I was a bit put off though, when I read that the insulation is recycled chopped fiber after I saw the price is $300.

To answer your question - I’m not sure it would be worth it for me to take a closer look. I’m really happy with the pieces I have currently.
 
Because of the thread any one on the wool train. I took a look at KOM wool bibs, $1,100.
Filson wool bibs $475.
Everything is going up, up and up.
 
I just ordered some Huntworth Fairbanks $209 shipped. How bad can they be? Figure for the 2 times I wore my incinerator it’s probably not worth keeping.
 
LoadedLimbs said:
@Plebe - Posting the Ambient line in this thread was cool - I wasn’t judging THAT.

Frankly, my reply with a link to old gear is questionable in this thread, but I just thought I’d mention a much more economical alternative to the readers who might be tempted to drop that kind of coin on a layering piece. And the liner jacket is one that I can personally vouch for as one of the best layering pieces I’ve tried, over a couple seasons of use in a variety of conditions.

I’m sure the Sitka piece is really nice - they don’t make crap. Their product lines command the price they charge because a lot of guys conclude it’s worth it.

I was a bit put off though, when I read that the insulation is recycled chopped fiber after I saw the price is $300.

To answer your question - I’m not sure it would be worth it for me to take a closer look. I’m really happy with the pieces I have currently.
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I think comparisons between new and old gear are natural. I just think it's an oversimplification to make a comparison solely based on price. Your experience with the liner jacket is only half the story. The other half (experience of the Sitka piece) may not be worth the look, or it may.

I'm confident the Sitka will be had at about $100 more than the Wiggys. That's still a lot, but it closes the gap. If someone can get that pricing, and the garment is indeed a better fit for him/her, spending $60 on another item is not money well spent. So, at this discussion point, I'm suggesting a deeper look at what makes the garments successful or not and then the ensuing conversation of better/best value has more context for those following along.

For example:
The Wiggy's liner jacket has a 3 layer construction with interior liner. The Sika has a 2 layer construction with lofted insulation on the inside. Is one better than another and why?

The Sitka has 4 way stretch, does the Wiggy's?

The Sitka has a high collar, the Wiggy's has a crew neck, why does one benefit from either or?

The Sitka has DWR, Wiggy's a higher denier nylon. What does this mean for performance?

The Wiggy's has elastic cuffs, the Sitka has a stretch wrist. Is there a felt difference?

$60 for Wiggy's liner jacket may equate to a better garment at a better price, but I'm interested in the details of why. I've no allegiance to either company, often root for the little guy, and am happy when our collective experience help community members get something better cheaper. Or even a nice alternative at more economical pricing. But I think it's helpful to get into the details to establish the fullest picture. I meant no offense with my post, just wondering if we moved the bar on price lower, would you be i interested in a closer inspection of the garment.
 
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Plebe said:
I think comparisons between new and old gear are natural. I just think it's an oversimplification to make a comparison solely based on price. Your experience with the liner jacket is only half the story. The other half (experience of the Sitka piece) may not be worth the look, or it may.
My responses in red, below. Your mileage may vary:

I'm confident the Sitka will be had at about $100 more than the Wiggys. That's still a lot, but it closes the gap. If someone can get that pricing, and the garment is indeed a better fit for him/her, spending $60 on another item is not money well spent. So, at this discussion point, I'm suggesting a deeper look at what makes the garments successful or not and then the ensuing conversation of better/best value has more context for those following along. If you have an extra $100 to spend, consider trying the Wiggy's liner and spend the extra money on an additional vest liner and a pair of 13" Lamilite socks which are proven, instead of buying Sika and hoping the Marketing Department isn't, yet again, over hyping their products.

For example:
The Wiggy's liner jacket has a 3 layer construction with interior liner. The Sika has a 2 layer construction with lofted insulation on the inside. Is one better than another and why? The Wiggy's Lamilite insulation is laminated to the material so the coverage is consistent throughout the garment which equates to no cold spots. The Sika is quilted to hold the insulation in place. Every place the insulation is quilted, it is compressed by the sewing process which compresses the insulation in the stitched areas and compressed insulation equates to cold spots.

Also, the Lamilite insulation can be compressed for years and still retain it loft and insulating properties. The Sika insulation will degrade under compression, whether it is compressed by laying in a sealed tote with other clothing or whether it's compressed over the shoulders by being hung on a hanger in your closet. If you can afford to replace it every couple of years, that's fine. The fact that Wiggy's Lamilite products are used by the military for survival suits (that are vacuum sealed to compress the suit down to a small size) and are affixed to every ejection seat on jet fighters or by the Coast Guard's Victims Casualty Hypothermia Bags which are kept in compression bags until they get used, vouches for this claim. No other insulation can meet this requirement regardless what the Marketing Department says.


The Sitka has 4 way stretch, does the Wiggy's? The Wiggy's liner is generously sized so it does not fit tight against the wearer which equates to more trapped airspace which traps more heat near the body. Excessive stretch is not required. The Sika is a more form fitting, athletic cut which requires more stretch to keep from binding. The more form fitting Sika leaves less room for trapping heat next to the body.

The Sitka has a high collar, the Wiggy's has a crew neck, why does one benefit from either or? As a mid layer, a well thought out garment will not have a collar because the outer layer will have an appropriately designed collar and serious hunters like John Eberhart won't have to cut the collars off of a $300 jacket. Because the Wiggy's liner is just that, a liner it has no collar nor pockets.

The Sitka has DWR, Wiggy's a higher denier nylon. What does this mean for performance? DWR is nice until the garment has been washed a few times, then it's gone. The Wiggy's liner is just that, a liner. The outer garment is what should be repelling water during inclement weather. However, if Wiggy's Lamilite does get wet, it will still keep you warm unlike the insulation used by Sika. If you have any doubts about it, watch a few YouTube videos of guys verifying that Wiggy's sleeping bags, once totally soaked will keep you warm and comfortable in cold weather and dry quickly.

The Wiggy's has elastic cuffs, the Sitka has a stretch wrist. Is there a felt difference? Seems to me, a stretch cuff is a stretch cuff. Although the knit cuff can extend up into your glove gauntlet to seal out cold from creeping in.

$60 for Wiggy's liner jacket may equate to a better garment at a better price, but I'm interested in the details of why. I've no allegiance to either company, often root for the little guy, and am happy when our collective experience help community members get something better cheaper. Or even a nice alternative at more economical pricing. But I think it's helpful to get into the details to establish the fullest picture. I meant no offense with my post, just wondering if we moved the bar on price lower, would you be i interested in a closer inspection of the garment. It's your money, spend it on what you want. I often wonder what the advertising budget is for a company like Sika and how many high priced Advertising Agency's they use to come up with new ways to put lipstick on the same old thing to make it sound like the next big thing. I do know what Wiggy's advertising budget is, $0 unless you consider whatever it cost to keep his website up and running.
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Is there any noise to the wiggy’s fabric? Looks like something from the 80s but military spec clothing often does to me


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Ricky,

I appreciate your thorough response. There's lots of good options for mid layers. I believe that the Wiggy's liner(s) are one.

This Sitka garment is by design not intended to solely serve as a liner or midlayer, so maybe it needs to be looked at a bit differently. It's intended to be an active outer garment that can transition to a mid layer if conditions dictate that.

Primaloft Evolve isn't exactly a quilted in insulation, like say Primaloft Gold or Silver or Down. It's more like pile jacket linings worn against the skin and preferred by many survivalists for next to skin airspace and moisture wicking (eg. Buffalo Mountain Shirt https://www.buffalosystems.co.uk/products/mountain-shirt/). In this instance form fitting is an advantage over boxy.

Given that build criterea, stretch seems to enhance the garment's performance for it's intended use as an outerlayer. This is especially important for bow hunters. A more tailored fit is also more suitable for layering over.

Frankly, I don't really care for the cuff on the Wiggy's garment. It is a large area lacking the benefits of lamilite. But, it may work better with certain overcoats than the Sitka design by binding less at the wrist, idk. Probably a very specific issue.

For reference, here is the garment I'm referencing from Sitka.

www.sitkagear.com

Ambient Hoody | SITKA Gear

Stay warm and comfortable while hunting in the Sitka Ambient Hoody, featuring a unique Optifade Open Country camouflage pattern and durable water-resistant construction.
www.sitkagear.com www.sitkagear.com
 
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Gator said:
Is there any noise to the wiggy’s fabric? Looks like something from the 80s but military spec clothing often does to me


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Some material is noisier than others. When I order my liners, I've always asked for the quietest material they have regardless of color. I have sent liners back when the material was louder than it should have been. Jerry grumbles but when I specified the quietest material they have and didn't get it, he took my liner back and sent one that was nice and quiet. If you tell them you want a quiet material and it's not quiet (keeping in mind, it is nylon so it's not going to be quiet like fleece) and they send you something that's crinkly, then they've made a mistake and it's up to you to push back.
I ordered one in a camo pattern since I had to pick a color but told them I wanted quiet material more than any specific color. The liner came in a crinkly, noisy material and I called Jerry. He had me send it back and he replaced it with a black one that is awesome. Interestingly though, I ordered a 0 degree sleeping bag and it came in the same camo as the liner but it was nice and quiet! Go figure...
Remember, it's a liner and will be under your quiet outer layer. It's not going to be rubbing against bark or limbs or whatever.
 
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GeoFish said:
Well you sold me. Do they have a liner paints? Could not find it on their site.
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Negative. However they have Leg Jackets. I don't have any experience with them but see post #12 below.

Adding bibs after I’m hooked up

Holy moly, I might be late to this idea but I hate walking/ climbing in my bibs so I usually pack them in them dress at the tree. This morning is was 35 so I had layers on. This afternoon it was just too dang hot, 55*F, to wear much more than a light layer while walking a mile back to a stand...
saddlehunter.com
 
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