Muddy has been using cam cleats for a good while now. They have had some QC issues but I haven’t heard of a cam that grabbed then failed under weight. A cam strap works on the same concept.I've never used a rope/cam cleat combo so I have no experience there. I have one sticked and no sticked climbed and used multiple sticks. I can tell you daisy chains are too short or too long about 95% time for me. I want to love them but it seems like they never work. I think they are best suited for someone using multiple sticks and doing the truckers hitch? tie off on each stick.
Cam buckles are manageable and I use them for my current climbing platform setup. I am going to try the Catalyst speed button in hopes it makes removing the cam buckle easier vs a traditional versa button. You can just loosen the cam buckle and "walk" the strap up the tree but that is not ideal on certain setups (loose bark, limbs, etc). I'm also playing with adding a hook to my tether and hanging my platform on each move to free up both my hands. But nothing is going to be quicker or easier than a rope/cam cleat combo.
IMHO you are never “staking your life” on the cam cleat, you are staking your life on the tether that is always attached to the tree and your saddle bridge. As with gun safety, your primary safety is keeping your finger off the trigger and not pointing the gun at anyone, the mechanical safety is the backup. Just my two cents....I agree with the rappelling gear as being a necessity for one sticking. Personally I am at best skeptical about the whole cam cleat thing. I’m sure it’s pretty well ok and safe if done the right way and a sailor cleat is used. I just have a hard time getting past the fact that like a gun safety, it is a mechanical device that can fail. I have a lot to live for and therefore have a hard time staking my life on a device like that.
See,I just don't find there to be any extra work involved.I do use a cam cleat but climbing with one stick is about the easiest way to get up a tree.I find it far easier than fighting with three or four sticks and even easier than using a climber.Everything... lol. I’ve tried one sticking a lot of different ways, including with cam straps, versa straps, and traditional rope mod. All are way too difficult to justify the method. A cam clear is a legitimate game changer.
Two things you must have for one sticking to be worth the extra work: 1) cam cleat and 2) rappelling gear.
When one sticking your support moves from stick to tether during the climb. The tether is unlikely to fail if your knots are good. While climbing the stick, you are introducing slack in your tether. If the stick fails you will fall and be caught by the tether. The sudden stop is not good from what I have heard. Rappelling is super easy. You will see. I equate learning to rappel with an ATC to learning to drive with a manual transmission. You can do it but it adds more complexity. A mechanical, locking belay device is like an automatic transmission. It does many things for you more safely. During rappelling your feet are free so I don't understand what you mean by slip of the foot.I’ve been considering one-sticking and rappelling for a little while but the ascent and descent safety practices seem contradictory to me (and correct me if I have it wrong). To your point @bowhuntr09 the climber was safe in that cam cleat fail because they maintained the tether height and tension. To you guys who rappel, you’re ideally keeping constant, steady tension on the tether, but during the descent aren’t you also constantly expanding the tether height? I can see with practice one could become competent with rappelling. But it also seems like one slip of the foot with a long line and you could swing pretty wild around the tree. What am I missing?
Ideally you should rappel off the low side of a tree to mitigate that specific risk. Gravity will always win, don't ask me how I know...But it also seems like one slip of the foot with a long line and you could swing pretty wild around the tree. What am I missing?
Your tree would have to be severely leaning to swing you wildly. If you slipped you might go around the tree at most before gravity holds you to the trunk.I’ve been considering one-sticking and rappelling for a little while but the ascent and descent safety practices seem contradictory to me (and correct me if I have it wrong). To your point @bowhuntr09 the climber was safe in that cam cleat fail because they maintained the tether height and tension. To you guys who rappel, you’re ideally keeping constant, steady tension on the tether, but during the descent aren’t you also constantly expanding the tether height? I can see with practice one could become competent with rappelling. But it also seems like one slip of the foot with a long line and you could swing pretty wild around the tree. What am I missing?
I like the sound of that. All my vehicles are manualsRappelling is super easy. You will see. I equate learning to rappel with an ATC to learning to drive with a manual transmission.
I am envisioning if you are holding yourself off the tree with your leg extended and you suddenly slip you could swing beside or around the tree trunk. What would concern me most is the pendulum swing back towards the trunk. But as I consider what you said about the tree leaning I can see my scenario is probably an overblown hypothetical, especially if you rappel slowly and maintain good contact with the tree. You probably can’t get more than a few feet off the trunk at any given time to gain that much momentum.Your tree would have to be severely leaning to swing you wildly. If you slipped you might go around the tree at most before gravity holds you to the trunk.
When one sticking your support moves from stick to tether during the climb. The tether is unlikely to fail if your knots are good. While climbing the stick, you are introducing slack in your tether. If the stick fails you will fall and be caught by the tether. The sudden stop is not good from what I have heard. Rappelling is super easy. You will see. I equate learning to rappel with an ATC to learning to drive with a manual transmission. You can do it but it adds more complexity. A mechanical, locking belay device is like an automatic transmission. It does many things for you more safely. During rappelling your feet are free so I don't understand what you mean by slip of the foot.
That was a clam cleat. Not a cam cleat. Two totally different things. The clam cleat used was also nylon.There is a video online of the OOAL style cam cleat failing at height. The climber was fine because he was properly maintaining his tether height and tension. I have never seen or heard of a traditional cam cleat failing.
Be careful with the ATC while learning. You will not just grind some gears if it slips.I like the sound of that. All my vehicles are manuals