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Post season scouting

It’s been ten yrs since I’ve hunt this place so it may have changed a good bit. However, back then water oaks as shown were a night time food source mainly due to pressure. They were hammered by squirrel hunters. I sat plenty of trees varying distances from public access and all were the same. I found over cups in or near blackberry or green briar thickets more productive.
I tend to see this too. I have hunted feed trees that were absolutely destroyed underneath the drip line and seen nothing. My basic decision making now is to ask "does this tree have adequate cover to put a deer at ease so that it will approach in daylight?" If I have a bunch of trees showing some feed sign I will pick the tree in or nearest to cover to hunt.

In wet areas, I will also try and backtrack deer trails from hot trees out in the open to where they are going into thick cover. Setting up just inside the cover can work. Sometimes, just inside a thicket I will find a staging area where the deer seem to be spending a lot of time. There is a lot of browse sign, droppings, etc. My feeling is that this is a stage up area on the way to a feed tree out in the open they want to visit after dark. This can work also on rub lines. I will backtrack rub lines until they go into thick cover.
 
I have found this tract difficult to key in on feed trees. Having watched a number of Robert Carter’s videos, with him on almost the same latitude as me, he says that white oaks are essentially a non-factor in his area; I agree that I’ve never seen a white oak dropping heavy like other oaks we have.

I have generally been on the same tack as @Cbigbear, tho i have not seen overcups with deer sign under them before. this place also holds like a vanishingly small number of deer.

did get out this morning one more time:
 
It’s been ten yrs since I’ve hunt this place so it may have changed a good bit. However, back then water oaks as shown were a night time food source mainly due to pressure. They were hammered by squirrel hunters. I sat plenty of trees varying distances from public access and all were the same. I found over cups in or near blackberry or green briar thickets more productive.
Have a spot of persimmons on a WMA that are in a fantastic location to funnel deer through and they can be smokin hot but that little block has a bunch of wild pecan which draws the skwerl shooters. Almost no reason to ever hang there more than the first and/or last hour of legal light cause deer arent usually going to be there any other time.
 
As much as squirrel hunters irk me during deer season, I have found that their presence is not an automatic death sentence to a spot. I'll give a couple of examples.

My very first hunt on public land. I went into a spot before daylight on opening day that I pre-scouted during the summer and then a few days prior to the opener. I had found a red oak dropping heavily along a shallow creek with good cover all around. It wasn't too far off the road, but having not seen any sign of hunter activity I decided that this was going to be my opening morning sit. I got settled in about 18 feet up a smaller red oak overlooking the drip line of the big red with all the sign under it.

About 8 am the silence of the woods was shattered by a shotgun blast not 75 yards off to my right front. It jarred me it was so unexpected. Then another shot rang out. This was followed by some voices, then rustling thought the woods, then a few more shots. I followed the sounds of the two guys through the woods in front of me but never saw them. They had worked through, shot up the woods and left. They were gone by 8:30. At this point I was pretty ticked off. I also was thinking "is this what public land is going to be like?".

I decided to sit it out, however, and after a while I was calmed down enjoying the woods again when I noticed two deer emerge from a privet thicket about 70 yards to my left front along the creek. They eventually worked their way in and I put an arrow through one under that red oak. I think those deer knew darn well where those squirrel hunters were before they ever got close, hunkered down while they were there and waited for them to pass on, just like I did. Shotgun blasts aside, if my feeble human senses let me follow those guys through the woods without ever seeing them then, what more could a deer or two sense?

Another example of squirrel hunting pressure not hurting a spot was a little valley on the old club I was in. This happened about three years prior to the above story. I went in to a little hardwood draw/valley before daylight and set up over a smoking hot white oak in my Summit climber. About 9 am I see to bucks walking parallel to me about 80 yards out. They are not headed my way, just passing through. Knowing they would soon be out of my life, I let out a doe bleat. Nothing. I let out a second bleat, this time about twice as loud. Nothing. Finally, in desperation I let out a very loud "MEHHHHH!". They stopped, looked up toward where I was, and headed strait to me like they were on a string. I arrowed the biggest one and his skull mount hangs behind me on the wall as I type this story.

Well, upon telling my hunting buddy the story and him asking where I killed the buck, he proceeds to tell me he was squirrel hunting that valley the evening before and shot about a dozen 12 gauges shells off in there and thoroughly tromped the place down. I'm sure he scented it up terribly too.

So, I don't write off a spot just becasue the tree rat shooters are off in there from time to time. The deer know they are there and know when they come and go and feed around them. Sometimes it's at night, sometimes it's right after they leave.
 
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While I have found this track challenging, I will say I almost never see anybody. I have been fortunate to mainly hunt weekdays, and I do pretty much stay out of the woods each week of the two rifle splits. Ynmv
 
While I have found this track challenging, I will say I almost never see anybody. I have been fortunate to mainly hunt weekdays, and I do pretty much stay out of the woods each week of the two rifle splits. Ynmv
That's what I do also, and I hardly ever see another hunter, aside from the few guys I know and stop and talk to on roadside. I didn't see another hunter last year in the woods at all, and the year before I ran into one guy who was walking in. I hunt during the week and get work done on weekends.
 
As much as squirrel hunters irk me during deer season, I have found that their presence is not an automatic death sentence to a spot. I'll give a couple of examples.

My very first hunt on public land. I went into a spot before daylight on opening day that I pre-scouted during the summer and then a few days prior to the opener. I had found a red oak dropping heavily along a shallow creek with good cover all around. It wasn't too far off the road, but having not seen any sign of hunter activity I decided that this was going to be my opening morning sit. I got settled in about 18 feet up a smaller red oak overlooking the drip line of the big red with all the sign under it.

About 8 am the silence of the woods was shattered by a shotgun blast not 75 yards off to my right front. It jarred me it was so unexpected. Then another shot rang out. This was followed by some voices, then rustling thought the woods, then a few more shots. I followed the sounds of the two guys through the woods in front of me but never saw them. They had worked through, shot up the woods and left. They were gone by 8:30. At this point I was pretty ticked off. I also was thinking "is this what public land is going to be like?".

I decided to sit it out, however, and after a while I was calmed down enjoying the woods again when I noticed two deer emerge from a privet thicket about 70 yards to my left front along the creek. They eventually worked their way in and I put an arrow through one under that red oak. I think those deer knew darn well where those squirrel hunters were before they ever got close, hunkered down while they were there and waited for them to pass on, just like I did. Shotgun blasts aside, if my feeble human senses let me follow those guys through the woods without ever seeing them then, what more could a deer or two sense?

Another example of squirrel hunting pressure not hurting a spot was a little valley on the old club I was in. This happened about three years prior to the above story. I went in to a little hardwood draw/valley before daylight and set up over a smoking hot white oak in my Summit climber. About 9 am I see to bucks walking parallel to me about 80 yards out. They are not headed my way, just passing through. Knowing they would soon be out of my life, I let out a doe bleat. Nothing. I let out a second bleat, this time about twice as loud. Nothing. Finally, in desperation I let out a very loud "MEHHHHH!". They stopped, looked up toward where I was, and headed strait to me like they were on a string. I arrowed the biggest one and his skull mount hangs behind me on the wall as I type this story.

Well, upon telling my hunting buddy the story and him asking where I killed the buck, he proceeds to tell me he was squirrel hunting that valley the evening before and shot about a dozen 12 gauges shells off in there and thoroughly tromped the place down. I'm sure he scented it up terribly too.

So, I don't write off a spot just becasue the tree rat shooters are off in there from time to time. The deer know they are there and know when they come and go and feed around them. Sometimes it's at night, sometimes it's right after they leave.
I see the same thing here with upland bird hunters. The preferred grouse habit is the same as the whitetails. I used to get concerned that the bird hunters were running the deer off. Then one day I heard the jingling of dog collar bells heading my way as I was set up on the edge of a clearcut. As the bells got closer I watched an entire herd of deer filter out of the clearcut and into the hardwoods. They paused about 50 yards in and watched the clearcut edge closely but didn't spook as the bells went by. Once the bells started to fade they just turned and went back into the clearcut. The point is that these deer were so acclimated to the bird hunters and didn't really see them as a threat anymore. They just saw them as a distraction that they had to avoid once on a while. I think it's similar to how they react to the farmer walking a path on his farm regularly or people on normal hiking trails.
 
to be sure, the consensus view appears to be that (for whatever reason) southeastern deer are much spookier than counterparts elsewhere. i have limited experience but can confirm that deer in Nebraska anyway are much less spooky - possibly because they can go whole seasons without seeing anybody? I don't know, but I had encounters off the ground with deer in NE where I could've reached and touched them with my arrow tip - no joking.
 
I am heading west tomorrow for a few days scouting.

Is this post season or pre-season?
 
to be sure, the consensus view appears to be that (for whatever reason) southeastern deer are much spookier than counterparts elsewhere. i have limited experience but can confirm that deer in Nebraska anyway are much less spooky - possibly because they can go whole seasons without seeing anybody? I don't know, but I had encounters off the ground with deer in NE where I could've reached and touched them with my arrow tip - no joking.
I saw more racked bucks in wide open fields, broad daylight, in a week in VA last year than I will see in here in the next 5 years. Hardly ever going to catch a buck in the open in daylight here that isnt making mach 3 for cover.
 
to be sure, the consensus view appears to be that (for whatever reason) southeastern deer are much spookier than counterparts elsewhere. i have limited experience but can confirm that deer in Nebraska anyway are much less spooky - possibly because they can go whole seasons without seeing anybody? I don't know, but I had encounters off the ground with deer in NE where I could've reached and touched them with my arrow tip - no joking.
My only out of state hunting has been in Ohio, and I can definitely say there were more deer and they seemed far less spooky. We saw big bucks just walking around power line easements in broad daylight. They would only get away with that once around here. They also responded to rattling. Around here if you do a rattle sequence they are gone. You might as well beat some cymbals together.
 
Yall are cheatin huntin during the week like that. What happened to fair chase?? :cool:
So far the deer haven't complained, and the other hunters don't have to contend with my presence in the woods on the weekend and I don't have to see them during the week. Wins all around, lol.
 
My only out of state hunting has been in Ohio, and I can definitely say there were more deer and they seemed far less spooky. We saw big bucks just walking around power line easements in broad daylight. They would only get away with that once around here. They also responded to rattling. Around here if you do a rattle sequence they are gone. You might as well beat some cymbals together.
my pops lives in SW OH, and when we visit him we regularly see 15-20 deer on a given day just driving around. not uncommon to see 6-8pters either. same for my family in N IN.

why do you guys think southeast deer are so spooky? genetics, pressure, available cover? farm country obviously restricts cover greatly + food is in the open, so deer are more visible. this vs. thousands of acres of piney woods so thick you couldn't see 3 yards into it.
 
my pops lives in SW OH, and when we visit him we regularly see 15-20 deer on a given day just driving around. not uncommon to see 6-8pters either. same for my family in N IN.

why do you guys think southeast deer are so spooky? genetics, pressure, available cover? farm country obviously restricts cover greatly + food is in the open, so deer are more visible. this vs. thousands of acres of piney woods so thick you couldn't see 3 yards into it.
I have often speculated about what makes them so skittish. From the way they act you would think we had prides of lions roaming the countryside. I really don't have a good answer, but I do know they are paranoid on a whole other level.
 
Long hunting seasons probably have something to do with it. Plus a history of Cletus and Jimbo extending the season, if you know what I mean ...

Private land in some parts ---I'd say most parts--is no better than public for spookiness, IMO. Dog-driving and feral/loose dogs don't help, LOL, but aren't necessary to put our deer on springs.

There's no doubt the easiest whitetail hunting (or turkey hunting, for that matter) that I've experienced has been in the Midwest and West. Night and day difference.
 
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