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Primal steps and knaider- swaider

drpike22

drpike22

Active Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2023
Messages
143
Location
New Jersey
I bought 5 Primal steps and changed out the ratchet straps for Wild Edge rope. It took a little time to get the knot and initial rope tension right. I first tried the modified Cain method and it seems doable. I like the idea of being tethered to the tree. The issue I had was when I attached my carabiner to the second step, the step would start to pivot up. I guess I needed the second step to be a little higher. Keeping an exact spacing seems to be the problem. It also looked like the ropes may have stretched. The steps are now attached to a tree for the night and I will see if it makes a difference. I was not comfortable trying the Knaider/Swaider combo. Too much slack in the linemans rope for me. Might try again adding a tether. I plan to try again when the weather clears up. So far I am not sold on the Primal/Wild Edge step idea. For me SRT with presets seems the easiest and safest, Four 20" sticks with a 3-step aider on the first and a movable one step aider used on the others as needed works well for me. One stick climbing works also well for me. I am trying to find a balance between ease and safety. Being almost 67 years old, I don't bounce very well anymore. Any suggestions are appreciated.
 
drpike22 said:
I bought 5 Primal steps and changed out the ratchet straps for Wild Edge rope. It took a little time to get the knot and initial rope tension right. I first tried the modified Cain method and it seems doable. I like the idea of being tethered to the tree. The issue I had was when I attached my carabiner to the second step, the step would start to pivot up. I guess I needed the second step to be a little higher. Keeping an exact spacing seems to be the problem. It also looked like the ropes may have stretched. The steps are now attached to a tree for the night and I will see if it makes a difference. I was not comfortable trying the Knaider/Swaider combo. Too much slack in the linemans rope for me. Might try again adding a tether. I plan to try again when the weather clears up. So far I am not sold on the Primal/Wild Edge step idea. For me SRT with presets seems the easiest and safest, Four 20" sticks with a 3-step aider on the first and a movable one step aider used on the others as needed works well for me. One stick climbing works also well for me. I am trying to find a balance between ease and safety. Being almost 67 years old, I don't bounce very well anymore. Any suggestions are appreciated.
Click to expand...
Yep, I suggest learning 2TC in combination with a SRT and JRB climbing system. Much safer and easier to get up a tree.
The primal and WE STEPPS just are so finicky. And the knaider swaider with just a hook is dodgy. I would recommend being tethered, not just LB, at all times when using those stepps.
They may make a good preset ladder if you have them 12" apart.....
 
Knaider only for me. I think that the swaider is just a little unstable for me. I slipped with a swaider on a wet tree once, and I was done with that. 5 steps to 16 feet for me with knaider only with me being 5'8". Stretching the ropes out is very important. The system is great for trees with lots of limbs.

Sent from my SM-S908U using Tapatalk
 
Knaider for me too. I Gave the Swaider a fair shake and used it for a couple of years. I'm only 59 and when I was up on the ridge alone year before last and it was time to get down and it was dark and I was freezing and everything was soaked I knew it was time for a more secure climbing method.
 
I just got my Primal Steps today.
Went out and Strapped just the one to the tree. I am not a fan of the adjustable latch. I had it set, had it all crammed down, put my weight on it to test it, but then as soon as I step on it the latch comes unhooked ?

I went right back inside and ordered Amstel from HangFree. They also set me a link that gets my “friends” some 10% discount. How come no one from SaddleHunter sent me this link ?

Click this link and get the discount that none of you sent to me.
i.refs.cc

High Quality, Affordable Saddle Hunting Gear.

Find everything you need when it comes to saddle hunting and the outdoors with Hang Free! Hang Free offers high quality, affordable saddle hunting gear that will help you become a better hunter. We believe everybody should get to enjoy saddle hunting the way we do!
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Samcirrus said:
Yep, I suggest learning 2TC in combination with a SRT and JRB climbing system. Much safer and easier to get up a tree.
The primal and WE STEPPS just are so finicky. And the knaider swaider with just a hook is dodgy. I would recommend being tethered, not just LB, at all times when using those stepps.
They may make a good preset ladder if you have them 12" apart.....
Click to expand...

Yeap

just like you I decided to go with REAL climbing rope and a REAL arborist grade Saddle (Petzl Sequoia) You should always at all times be connected to the tree with two ropes, not just on your Lineman and not teathered in until you get to the top. I am teathered in with a climbing system before I leave the ground.
 
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I'm going to try the knaider swaider with the primal steps this summer as well. I will be repelling down though. Just something I haven't tried yet.
 
I tried the Primal steps again today. The poly ropes appear to hold tight better after being stretched overnight. I found this link today and it gave me something to think about. SteppLadder Aider - YouTube I borrowed from the idea and used a piece of 1/4" Amsteel. I put a fixed loop on one end for a carabiner to go on the second step and a whoopie sling loop on the other end for my foot, it provides some adjustability. I also sewed a piece of stiff 2" webbing around where my foot will go and did it so it will slide on the Amsteel when I adjust the Whoopie loop. The key to this from what I saw on the video is that your first step is about waist high, your second step is above your head. After you attach the carabiner to the upper step you put the foot loop so it hangs behind the foot bar on the first step. This limits the side to side kick out. I will play with it more after the rain ends. Probably won't be my go to method but I just want to see if I can make it work.
 
I would test out the primal steps just using the webbing strap and not using the hooks. Just move the hook out of the way and attach it like a regular wild edge step to see if it works for you. Good luck. I cut all the metal off of mine but still didn't have much trouble with the hooks when they were there just wanted to cut down on sound.

Sent from my SM-S908U using Tapatalk
 
kobudo said:
I would test out the primal steps just using the webbing strap and not using the hooks. Just move the hook out of the way and attach it like a regular wild edge step to see if it works for you. Good luck. I cut all the metal off of mine but still didn't have much trouble with the hooks when they were there just wanted to cut down on sound.

Sent from my SM-S908U using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
If the Wild Edge ropes don't work out, I will give the straps a try. I am also thinking about possibly using Amsteel.
 
drpike22 said:
If the Wild Edge ropes don't work out, I will give the straps a try. I am also thinking about possibly using Amsteel.
Click to expand...
The Wild Edge ropes work fine. The Primal straps don't work as well. The Ropes vs Straps are the main FUNCTIONAL difference.
I am replacing my Primal straps with customized HangFree Amstel ropes.
i.refs.cc

High Quality, Affordable Saddle Hunting Gear.

Find everything you need when it comes to saddle hunting and the outdoors with Hang Free! Hang Free offers high quality, affordable saddle hunting gear that will help you become a better hunter. We believe everybody should get to enjoy saddle hunting the way we do!
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Primal uses Stainless Steel, WE uses Powder Coating so they don't rust.

WE comes with a bag to carry them in and out, Primal doesn't supply any carry method.

WE American Made, Overseas Primal.
 
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RotoTillerGuy said:
The Wild Edge ropes work fine. The Primal straps don't work as well. The Ropes vs Straps are the main FUNCTIONAL difference.

Primal uses Stainless Steel, WE uses Powder Coating so they don't rust.

WE comes with a bag to carry them in and out, Primal doesn't supply any carry method.

WE American Made, Overseas Primal.
Click to expand...
I was not aware that Primal steps were made from stainless steel. That is a major advantage to me.
 
drpike22 said:
I was not aware that Primal steps were made from stainless steel. That is a major advantage to me.
Click to expand...
Yeap

go read their description.

it was all very important differences to me.

in all reality, had the guy from WE called me back, or Texted me back, or E-Mailed me back, I would have waited or bought WE used. But he didn’t.
 
Ok so I got 4 primal steps in today and first thing was I just off all the straps. I've attached amsteel full bury with a prussic. The prussic loop I used a 6in loop after the prussic I looped it under the step and behind the bar and then down the stand off. I can easily adjust the rope tension and no metal. 
 

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I think the Hang Free upgraded Amsteel guys recommend attaching the new lines so that they are attached and going over the top not the bottom.

They have a great video about installing them correctly.

I think the Wild Edge lines also work just fine and are very adjustable, but I like the Hang Free lines just a tiny bit better.

I think the nylon buckle system that come with the Primal Steps, I think the buckles suck and are unreliable. The Primal Steps are reportedly made of Stainless Steel which I consider an improvement over Powder Coated 16 gage Steel. I like the Wild Edge carry bag, the Primal's offer no such carry solution.
 
I switched to primals/WE this year. If you put in the time/practice it’s hard to beat them with how compact they are. And how affordable they are compared to sticks. I cut the strap and switched to 1/4 amsteel. I found that I preferred a 3 step cayg etrier. I also tried several packing styles for them and found I liked a diy kydex holster the best. Good luck!
 
Mitchellfarmer1982 said:
Ok so I got 4 primal steps in today and first thing was I just off all the straps. I've attached amsteel full bury with a prussic. The prussic loop I used a 6in loop after the prussic I looped it under the step and behind the bar and then down the stand off. I can easily adjust the rope tension and no metal. 
Click to expand...
Looks like a good idea. I may do the same.
 
Love mine.i just cut the metal buckles of mine and the short strap. Left the long strap and use it like the we ropes. To me the strap is easier adjust the tension I'm the knot
 
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