Amsteel Blue Breaking - Not during saddle use

[Jasper2]

Any pics would be great. Im 230+ and have used the same bridge for several years and have not seen anything indicating wear. There was a post earlier of a new mantis fraying and it was just the bury end wasnt fully burried. Some of the colored amsteel does lose its dye. Heck when I use green my fingers are green just splicing it. My silver is looking more white than when it was new, but I dont think color indicates wear.

You're correct color may not indicate wear but what about fraying? While it may not be an immediate danger, I still don't like seeing it. I realize this may seem like minimal wear but this photo is only about 8 hunts and I'd imagine that it will only get worse from here. Wax may hide it and it may last a long time regardless....but I still hate seeing it and don't want to mess with waxing my bridge if I don't have to. The simple fact is that this is a very light and very soft material.

The "flat spot" directly above the loop in the first picture is the center where the carabiner sits most of the time. It flattens out and gets very shiny in this spot where the carabiner rubs. This is further magnified since this area is in between the buries and therefore thinner than the rest overall. Amsteel also appears to have a pretty good "memory" in this application as it is very easy to see the spot where the carabiner sits even when the bridge is stretched out straight. I know that spot has to be wearing faster due to the steep angle and carabiner friction.

I'm sure mine is still safe as is and I'm definitely not bashing the Mantis, just trying to point out my experiences with the bridge material so far. This amsteel stuff is new to me so I'm learning as I go!

Upon closer inspection, the 2nd picture has to just be part of the bury poking through the outer fibers. The braid on the outer fibers is very "loose" especially when you pinch it in two spots and push together (like a chinese finger-lock) making it much easier for this to happen.

 

[Slingpredator06]

You're correct color may not indicate wear but what about fraying? While it may not be an immediate danger, I still don't like seeing it. I realize this may seem like minimal wear but this photo is only about 8 hunts and I'd imagine that it will only get worse from here. Wax may hide it and it may last a long time regardless....but I still hate seeing it and don't want to mess with waxing my bridge if I don't have to. The simple fact is that this is a very light and very soft material.

The "flat spot" directly above the loop in the first picture is the center where the carabiner sits most of the time. It flattens out and gets very shiny in this spot where the carabiner rubs. This is further magnified since this area is in between the buries and therefore thinner than the rest overall. Amsteel also appears to have a pretty good "memory" in this application as it is very easy to see the spot where the carabiner sits even when the bridge is stretched out straight. I know that spot has to be wearing faster due to the steep angle and carabiner friction.

I'm sure mine is still safe as is and I'm definitely not bashing the Mantis, just trying to point out my experiences with the bridge material so far. This amsteel stuff is new to me so I'm learning as I go!

Upon closer inspection, the 2nd picture has to just be part of the bury poking through the outer fibers. The braid on the outer fibers is very "loose" especially when you pinch it in two spots and push together (like a chinese finger-lock) making it much easier for this to happen.

I personally would replace frayed amsteel. Opinions may vary

 

[kenn1320]

Yes second pic is bury and not a concern. Amsteel is just like a Chinese finger torture, it grabs hard as load is applied. The first pic is another story. That is one of the loops on the mantis? It has an edge that's snagging the individual fibers, not good. Personally I'd see if theres something wrong with it and if nothin obvious, I'd wrap the mantis with electric tape.

 

[Jasper2]

Yes second pic is bury and not a concern. Amsteel is just like a Chinese finger torture, it grabs hard as load is applied. The first pic is another story. That is one of the loops on the mantis? It has an edge that's snagging the individual fibers, not good. Personally I'd see if theres something wrong with it and if nothin obvious, I'd wrap the mantis with electric tape.

Yes that is a loop on the mantis and both loops look the same in terms of fraying. I can't find any rough spots on either of the bridge loops anywhere and the material used in the bridge loops is much softer and smoother than on my Kestrel. I was actually shocked to see how much it has worn already. I honestly think that's just the way it is going to be with this setup using amsteel. Here is a pic from the bottom side of my bridge. Pretty obvious where the carabiner sits and looks similar very similar to the loops in terms of fraying and I know there is nothing there that is snagging the fibers.

 

[BCHunter]

Yes that is a loop on the mantis and both loops look the same in terms of fraying. I can't find any rough spots on either of the bridge loops anywhere and the material used in the bridge loops is much softer and smoother than on my Kestrel. I was actually shocked to see how much it has worn already. I honestly think that's just the way it is going to be with this setup using amsteel. Here is a pic from the bottom side of my bridge. Pretty obvious where the carabiner sits and looks similar very similar to the loops in terms of fraying and I know there is nothing there that is snagging the fibers.
View attachment 8621

I would never tell anyone what to do because safety is up to the user, but if mine looked like that I would think that there was 7,675lbs left of the 7,700 breaking strength of the amsteel and feel great. But really splices reduce strength buy 5-10%, so close to 6,900?

With that said, it's all up to the user. It's pretty cheap to get some 30kn rope and tie it on. But knots reduce that down 40-50% so 3500lbs of strength?




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[IkemanTX]

I am more than confident with my amsteel bridge that has over two hundred hours of hanging on it just this season... that’s not including any pre-season prep work either.
It is so easy to swap out, too, that I will do a new bridge yearly just as an overkill precautionary measure.


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[sureshotscott]

I am more than confident with my amsteel bridge that has over two hundred hours of hanging on it just this season... that’s not including any pre-season prep work either.
It is so easy to swap out, too, that I will do a new bridge yearly just as an overkill precautionary measure.

Yes. Smart folks will be overly aggressive in replacing ALL wearable items in their tree-climbing system. Ropes, biners, and even saddles. They are all temporary. You should die of old age (or something) not being cheap on life-support gear.

 

[Jasper2]

I am more than confident with my amsteel bridge that has over two hundred hours of hanging on it just this season... that’s not including any pre-season prep work either.
It is so easy to swap out, too, that I will do a new bridge yearly just as an overkill precautionary measure.
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So does the fraying just keep getting worse? I'm new to Amsteel but can't imagine what yours looks like after that many hours when mine has about 30 hours on it and is already showing signs of wear. It's not easy to swap out if you don't splice

 

[Jasper2]

I would never tell anyone what to do because safety is up to the user, but if mine looked like that I would think that there was 7,675lbs left of the 7,700 breaking strength of the amsteel and feel great. But really splices reduce strength buy 5-10%, so close to 6,900?
With that said, it's all up to the user. It's pretty cheap to get some 30kn rope and tie it on. But knots reduce that down 40-50% so 3500lbs of strength?
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Yeah that's why I said it was minimal wear and mine was still safe as is. I just don't think it should be frayed at all after only 30 hours of use. However, I have a feeling that is just the nature of the beast with amsteel and I'll either have to deal with it or change bridge materials. Since I've been dealing with a similar Dyneema material in bowstrings for years....I should've known what to expect.

I don't pay much attention to the large breaking strength numbers listed for most ropes since they are controlled, laboratory, best case scenario test numbers and seem to be meant more for marketing hype than anything else. Someone should do a shock load test with a piece of amsteel across a carabiner at about a 20 degree angle.....you know a meaningful, real world test for us saddle nuts!

 

[kenn1320]

Yeah that's why I said it was minimal wear and mine was still safe as is. I just don't think it should be frayed at all after only 30 hours of use. However, I have a feeling that is just the nature of the beast with amsteel and I'll either have to deal with it or change bridge materials. Since I've been dealing with a similar Dyneema material in bowstrings for years....I should've known what to expect.

I don't pay much attention to the large breaking strength numbers listed for most ropes since they are controlled, laboratory, best case scenario test numbers and seem to be meant more for marketing hype than anything else. Someone should do a shock load test with a piece of amsteel across a carabiner at about a 20 degree angle.....you know a meaningful, real world test for us saddle nuts!

I would think tethrd did, but not sure.

 

[GCTerpfan]

Yeah that's why I said it was minimal wear and mine was still safe as is. I just don't think it should be frayed at all after only 30 hours of use. However, I have a feeling that is just the nature of the beast with amsteel and I'll either have to deal with it or change bridge materials. Since I've been dealing with a similar Dyneema material in bowstrings for years....I should've known what to expect.

I don't pay much attention to the large breaking strength numbers listed for most ropes since they are controlled, laboratory, best case scenario test numbers and seem to be meant more for marketing hype than anything else. Someone should do a shock load test with a piece of amsteel across a carabiner at about a 20 degree angle.....you know a meaningful, real world test for us saddle nuts!

Tethrd did a drop test, I think 4' with 250lbs. The first drop broke a caribiner. The second drop held. There is a video of the test around here somewhere.

 

[Jasper2]

Tethrd did a drop test, I think 4' with 250lbs. The first drop broke a caribiner. The second drop held. There is a video of the test around here somewhere.

Cool I must have missed that one. I would be interested to know what it would take to break amsteel in that manner but I guess if the biner goes first.....It doesn't really matter bc your butt is in trouble

 

[brydan]

I don't pay much attention to the large breaking strength numbers listed for most ropes since they are controlled, laboratory, best case scenario test numbers

Yep, there is so much more to rope construction and usage than just its ideal tensile strength numbers. That's just the easiest aspect for people to quantify. Many Arborists now are rethinking bridge materials as there's been a few fatalities from rope bridge faliures. Manufacturers have been improving their bridges as well to better fit the application.

 

[bigjoe]

Amsteel does not like dirt. It can get between the fibers and abraid them. That is why amsteel is so successful being used for mooring and anchor lines. Also, replacing steel cables for Crain use. It is in the air, and water not subject to dirt and grime.

Researching amsteel a little deeper I found that splicing amsteel only reduces the strength by 10%. Yet, a whoopie sling can have as much as a 30% reduction.

If you question your bridge replace it. A bridge ought to be replaced when wear is shown. You can run a double bridge as well for added protection and peace of mind..

Look at it like this. On most ropes that are covered, you have an outer sheath or fiber that covers the rope. It is the inner rope that provides the strength. With amsteel the strength is in the open, it allows you to inspect it.

On a personal note, I will replace my amsteel bridge yearly.

 

[GCTerpfan]

Cool I must have missed that one. I would be interested to know what it would take to break amsteel in that manner but I guess if the biner goes first.....It doesn't really matter bc your butt is in trouble

Here you go

 

[kenn1320]

Thanks for the video, and tethrd guys......wear some safety glasses at least when you test like this.

 

[IkemanTX]

So does the fraying just keep getting worse? I'm new to Amsteel but can't imagine what yours looks like after that many hours when mine has about 30 hours on it and is already showing signs of wear. It's not easy to swap out if you don't splice

After 30-40 hours of use it stabilizes. It gets a smidge fuzzy, but that’s about it.

I could easily hold off a second, or even third year before replacing... but amsteel is cheap in short lengths, and easy to splice. Don’t be afraid to splice this stuff, it is an absolute breeze. It is also a nice little DIY project to entertain me in the off-season.

Heck, even my sit drag is getting fuzzy from brush and stuff. I figure one more season and I will have to look at replacing it.

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[Charliea]

Not sure how to gauge the wear on the Amsteel, it certainly looks more worn than the Predator used on my linesman and teather which still looks new? I’ll put on a new bridge for next season.

 

[bowkill00]

So after reading this thread and just to add confidence to my mind I attached a shorter bridge out off 8mm climbing rope. Both bridges are hooked into the same carabiner but the amsteel is loose and basically a backup.

 

[mattsteg]

So after reading this thread and just to add confidence to my mind I attached a shorter bridge out off 8mm climbing rope. Both bridges are hooked into the same carabiner but the amsteel is loose and basically a backup.

Is the climbing rope dynamic? If so I'd maybe give it a small preference as a backup if there's much slack (and I'd minimize slack). Otherwise I'd choose by which gave me the best feel moving around in the saddle.