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bullman pioneer step daisy chain trucker's hitch attachment, faster than with tree hopper steps

raisins

raisins

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Jan 17, 2019
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Some of you might remember this thread.

description/review of amsteel buckleless treehopper step climbing method after 20+ hunts

I described on someone else's thread a while back how I was going to try an amsteel daisy chain method with treehopper steps. I developed that and used it for the past 20 or so hunts and this will be my method until maybe I switch to Tethrd One sticks with aiders. Any critiques or suggestions...
saddlehunter.com


where I posted this video.


I can save 1.5 pounds by going from tree hopper steps to bullman pioneer steps. I haven't made all the new daisy chains yet (all 12....fun).

The first video shows the basics of the daisy chain trucker's hitch for steps (watch it to see all the trucker's hitch details I left out of second video). The second video below shows how with the bullman pioneer steps you can skip all the wraps.

I have only used the pioneers on the ground (used tree hoppers for 2 years in the field). So, I have no real field experience. Seems to work okay so far. The tree hoppers are better for side pressure due to the wings and also quieter because they are solid polymer.

I'll probably have to chamfer the area on the step where I terminate the hitch. Where any edge would rub would change from climb to climb, but I won't feel good about it until most of the steps edges are smoothed.

Here's the new video. I need a GoPro or something.


This has a lot of the dreaded "fiddle factor" and is slower than sticks but at 3 pounds (12 steps, 2 carry sacks) to get you to over 20 feet, I feel it is one of the lightest and safest methods around. One thing I didn't mention in the second video is that you can go around the tree a few times with the tag end of the trucker's hitch prior to terminating it on the step as shown. This would give you fewer wraps on the tree hopper method (where all slack is taken up with wraps). However, this tends to end up with a looser step as all those wraps around the tree settle out. With the pioneer step, you can get around all of that.

Hopefully this helps someone.

Anything you'd add or subtract to the method?
 
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Thanks for the video. I for some reason, maybe my big size 14 boots the Pioneer steps would kick out.
With the Treehopper I am finding that I dont need to use a trucker's hitch. Just attach the daisy to the buckle (like the Pioneer minimalist method) set the step (like a stick) and go. No kick out but I am taking 18" steps, no reason to worry about side pressure with smaller step distance.
 
GeoFish said:
Thanks for the video. I for some reason, maybe my big size 14 boots the Pioneer steps would kick out.
With the Treehopper I am finding that I dont need to use a trucker's hitch. Just attach the daisy to the buckle (like the Pioneer minimalist method) set the step (like a stick) and go. No kick out but I am taking 18" steps, no reason to worry about side pressure with smaller step distance.
Click to expand...

i'll keep you posted after climbing....the pioneers are getting tight enough that i don't think they'll kick out

what do your kick outs look like with steps? whole thing sliding around the tree?
 
May be the wrong term, by kick out I mean the top of the step kicks out making the step feel loose. This may be something I am doing wrong. Maybe if I had some slack in the daisy it may set better. I do not worry about side pressure since I am taking baby steps. Now in the second pic, I am moving my foot out so you can see the kick out. Kinda of a spongy feel. I have the same issue with Cranford rope on steps, or squirl steps.
 

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GeoFish said:
May be the wrong term, by kick out I mean the top of the step kicks out making the step feel loose. This may be something I am doing wrong. Maybe if I had some slack in the daisy it may set better. I do not worry about side pressure since I am taking baby steps. Now in the second pic, I am moving my foot out so you can see the kick out. Kinda of a spongy feel. I have the same issue with Cranford rope on steps, or squirl steps.
Click to expand...

oh okay, i got ya....thanks....i was thinking of stick kick outs which are dramatic and can leave you hanging from your tether....i think you are right about the cause, but i think it can happen a bit with any step and so long as it is safe then it isn't something that bothers me

do those kick outs feel unsafe at all when it happens to you?

i will say that the tree hoppers are better for this...but they are 2 ounces heavier per step which adds up over 12 steps

maybe i'm crazy doing all this for 1.5 pounds
 
I just dont like the soft feel of the step. Same thing with Cranford rope on steps.
I am all for saving weight so I hope they work for you.
 
Can anyone recall the name of the website that sells all the amsteel attachment methods? If i remember right, it kinda had a unique name


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Aeds151 said:
^anyone?
Click to expand...
Not sure what you are after. See post #6, is it one of these vendors?

Mobile Expo Ohio

Maybe I’m missing it or have no clue….lol. I don’t have a Facebook account but a guy at work told me about it. Is in Winchester, Ohio next weekend. Anyone have details on this am I missing the thread I searched and found stuff for last year but different place.
saddlehunter.com
 
Its not
EWO
CGM
It was another website that sells nothing but different amsteel stick/step attachment methods and aiders
 
Aeds151 said:
Its not
EWO
CGM
It was another website that sells nothing but different amsteel stick/step attachment methods and aiders
Click to expand...

best thing to do is start another thread with a descriptive title asking this question, then someone not following this thread will see it and give you your answer
 
Hey @raisins are you using these to climb yet?

Any more feedback?

Looks like you've solved the "get the step tight to the tree" part. What about the side to side wiggle of such a thin step with no wings or wide strap securing it? Does that come into play climbing? Or feel fine?
 
kyler1945 said:
Hey @raisins are you using these to climb yet?

Any more feedback?

Looks like you've solved the "get the step tight to the tree" part. What about the side to side wiggle of such a thin step with no wings or wide strap securing it? Does that come into play climbing? Or feel fine?
Click to expand...

hey, haven't used them in the field yet because i couldn't figure out a way to keep them quiet that i like (every option adds too much weight or has another issue)

the tree hoppers do a great job of no side wiggle because of the wide wings....these i know are gonna be an issue in comparison and i'll have to be more careful on weird trees

i'll keep you posted, probably think about it more in the spring and develop a system
 
I was hoping raisins or someone was going to figure this out. I’ve used pioneers with cam / hook straps and a climbing sling aider. It’s a pretty effective & compact method and smoother for me than say, WE steps . There is a weight penalty for the cam straps , and I’m not big on black straps for bow season.
It would be great if someone could figure out a high strength version of this style of attachment ; it works great for a gear hanger. Naturally this wouldn’t support a human.
 

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TreeCreep said:
I was hoping raisins or someone was going to figure this out. I’ve used pioneers with cam / hook straps and a climbing sling aider. It’s a pretty effective & compact method and smoother for me than say, WE steps . There is a weight penalty for the cam straps , and I’m not big on black straps for bow season.
It would be great if someone could figure out a high strength version of this style of attachment ; it works great for a gear hanger. Naturally this wouldn’t support a human.
Click to expand...

The trucker's hitch will definitely work just like that with those steps but get them tighter (3x leverage with a trucker's hitch) and be stronger (nothing but aluminum step and amsteel daisy chain).

I think with any system, that the pioneers are going to rotate more than tree hopper steps under side pressure because the pioneers are so narrow. I think they would be perfectly safe though. I'm not using the pioneers because they are loud banging together and I didn't want to rush a solution for that that would be goofy or add a lot of weight (which would defeat the purpose of this climbing method for me).
 
TreeCreep said:
I was hoping raisins or someone was going to figure this out. I’ve used pioneers with cam / hook straps and a climbing sling aider. It’s a pretty effective & compact method and smoother for me than say, WE steps . There is a weight penalty for the cam straps , and I’m not big on black straps for bow season.
It would be great if someone could figure out a high strength version of this style of attachment ; it works great for a gear hanger. Naturally this wouldn’t support a human.
Click to expand...

[mention]raisins [/mention] trucker’s hitch or my button runner. I think I’ve got a TH step that I’ll try it with when I get a chance.
 
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