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Property improvement ideas

slonstdy

slonstdy

Well-Known Member
SH Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2018
Messages
1,377
I recently purchased a 17 acre property and want your ideas on how to make it a buck magnet.

It's a rectangle that is approximately 165 yards wide by 500 yards deep. The first couple hundred yards off the road is where the house and barn are located so there's not much I can do to improve deer traffic.. The area I want to work on is roughly 300 yards deep and 165 yards wide. There is a an open field that borders the north end, the west edge is bordered by a swamp at the front corner and dense pines and brush in the middle and rear. There are 4 - 10 acre properties on that side but only two have homes which are set on the opposite end of the their respective properties. So the edge that borders me is the back of those properties and is pretty thick. Neither of the neighbors hunt.

The property that borders the east side runs the entire length. It is mostly trees with huge evergreens starting about midway along the border and continue towards the rear. The evergreens taper off into an open forest made up of beech, maple and hickory trees which run past the field behind me. This neighbor doesn't hunt either.

My property is an open hardwoods made up mainly of beech trees, an evergreen here and there, and a few maples and hickories. Not one dang oak tree! There is a small open low wetland/swamp area along the east border adjacent to the neighbor's evergreen trees. The property is relatively flat for the most part. It's a very slight rise in elevation going from the front to the rear. The low wetland/swamp section is about 10 feet lower in elevation from the height of the center of the property, and levels out leading towards the neighbor to the east.

A friend suggested I knock down most of the trees to let the sun reach the forest floor. He said hinge cut the trees to create a thick area for bedding, along with planting red osier dogwoods in the swamp area and wherever I can get them to grow. His idea is to make a sanctuary in the middle of the property and set up stands in the four corners so I can hunt according to the wind.

Initially, my thought was to remove some trees along the west edge and create a small food plot/hidey hole. I've got cameras out along the swamp and the west side. Deer cross the property daily and I had two good shooters on the cameras in mid January so they'll be around this season. I'm thinking to leave the property as is for now and hunt it this season to get a better idea of deer movement and how they're using it.

I don't have access to farm equipment and I don't want a 10 plus acre food plot. Should I make it a sanctuary by opening it up and letting it brush out? Plant a couple of small food plots, say no more than 1/4 acre each? I'd like to hear what you guys have done with your properties and what you would do different, or what you have learned and would do over again.
 
IMO it’s too small to make a sanctuary so what I’d do is implement a couple suggestions your friend stated but also add food/browse items to entice them onto your property and slow them down. Too small to hold them but enough to make them detour and walk through so you can get a shot. I’d also see about securing permission to hunt your neighbors property as well, perhaps not their entire property but the edges that border yours.
I hunt a parcel that’s almost the same size as yours and that’s what me and the other fella that hunts it did. Dropped a few trees and strategically placed salt licks and food items along a path to create a travel corridor. It took about a year but it’s now paid off and we have regular traffic through the parcel.
 
Congrats on the property purchase. I don’t think it’s too small to make it a buck magnet at all but a lot of things have to be considered. Before you just go in and start hinge cutting things, if you’re not well versed in tree species and forestry management, I highly recommend hiring a certified forester, (not a logger) a forester and tell them you want to manage your property based on your priorities of buck hunting habitat development first and sustainable timber management second. This is not a cut on the loggers whatsoever but there are property tax advantages in NYS associated with a forestry management plan that must be developed by a forester. But conceptually, your buddy is correct, deer are attracted to areas where succession and secondary growth are facilitated by sun to the forest floor which encourages high stem count areas of cover which deer relate to for food and security.
 
And don’t get hung up on the cost of a forester, most will cover their fees via a timber sale where they take a percentage off the top of the sale for their forestry management services so you are not paying directly out of pocket for that. This is an important fact to remember as many well intentioned landowners forego the professional input of a certified forester just after buying land as they now feel the other costs associated with that land purchase. I hope this makes sense.
 
The forester will also handle all of the bidding for your timber sale assuring you get the best possible sale price for your timber products. In addition, they will place requirements in the specifications for things like crossings, wetlands protection, skidder road repairs and rutting, erosion management etc.
 
A lot of the paths and openings you will want to have will be made automatically via a timber sale with landings, logging roads and planting within them once the harvest has been completed. And don’t let 17 acres fool you. We just had an essentially a “cull sale” on a 16 acre parcel on a hillside that was fraught with dying ash and we began a sustainable harvest on that small tract…….we cleared approximately $10K on that with some nice new landings and roads (which were seeded) for erosion control afterwards and the deer are already pounding it in there. This was a “junk” property that some wanted to sell. In 10-12 years we will most likely triple that sale with the sustainable harvest of just new and full growth. We had another tract of approximately 60-70 acres in 2007 and it is being harvested again this year only 17 years later (could have been a year or three sooner but this is part of a 1500 acre property) and it just couldn’t have been logistically possible to hit it earlier. Anyway, the sale in 2007 netted us $36k this year we are clearing $85k on just new growth so nothing is being reduced. There is a compounding effect with proper forestry management. Please don’t just go in and start hinge cutting.
 
Exhumis said:
IMO it’s too small to make a sanctuary so what I’d do is implement a couple suggestions your friend stated but also add food/browse items to entice them onto your property and slow them down. Too small to hold them but enough to make them detour and walk through so you can get a shot. I’d also see about securing permission to hunt your neighbors property as well, perhaps not their entire property but the edges that border yours.
I hunt a parcel that’s almost the same size as yours and that’s what me and the other fella that hunts it did. Dropped a few trees and strategically placed salt licks and food items along a path to create a travel corridor. It took about a year but it’s now paid off and we have regular traffic through the parcel.
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There's regular traffic going through here on a daily basis. I've watched deer from the house move out of the front corner swamp in the mornings and cross the property just behind the barn. I also walked the property a few times when the ground was covered in snow and found three heavily used trails they like to use to move across. My goal is to get them to spend more time here somehow. Putting a small plot in the right place may help. I know they also spend time feeding in the wetland/swamp during the day so getting some red osiers in and around there would give them browse and cover.
 
woodsdog2 said:
Congrats on the property purchase. I don’t think it’s too small to make it a buck magnet at all but a lot of things have to be considered. Before you just go in and start hinge cutting things, if you’re not well versed in tree species and forestry management, I highly recommend hiring a certified forester, (not a logger) a forester and tell them you want to manage your property based on your priorities of buck hunting habitat development first and sustainable timber management second. This is not a cut on the loggers whatsoever but there are property tax advantages in NYS associated with a forestry management plan that must be developed by a forester. But conceptually, your buddy is correct, deer are attracted to areas where succession and secondary growth are facilitated by sun to the forest floor which encourages high stem count areas of cover which deer relate to for food and security.
Click to expand...
Thanks. It's in PA, not NY. Getting all my ducks in a row for when I retire and extricate myself from this state.

I didn't think about hiring a forester, that is a fantastic idea and something I'm going to research. Thanks bud!
I am hesitant to go hog wild dropping trees myself, fearing it won't produce the desired effect. I'm ok with taking enough down to open a hole in the canopy so I can put in a small plot but leveling the majority of them will require serious thought and professional help. Deer are using the property now as it is so I would prefer not doing anything too drastic that could change their pattern or make them avoid the area altogether.
 
woodsdog2 said:
A lot of the paths and openings you will want to have will be made automatically via a timber sale with landings, logging roads and planting within them once the harvest has been completed. And don’t let 17 acres fool you. We just had an essentially a “cull sale” on a 16 acre parcel on a hillside that was fraught with dying ash and we began a sustainable harvest on that small tract…….we cleared approximately $10K on that with some nice new landings and roads (which were seeded) for erosion control afterwards and the deer are already pounding it in there. This was a “junk” property that some wanted to sell. In 10-12 years we will most likely triple that sale with the sustainable harvest of just new and full growth. We had another tract of approximately 60-70 acres in 2007 and it is being harvested again this year only 17 years later (could have been a year or three sooner but this is part of a 1500 acre property) and it just couldn’t have been logistically possible to hit it earlier. Anyway, the sale in 2007 netted us $36k this year we are clearing $85k on just new growth so nothing is being reduced. There is a compounding effect with proper forestry management. Please don’t just go in and start hinge cutting.
Click to expand...
Wow, that's a nice return on investment. What sort of trees are planted for a sustainable harvest, hardwoods?
My property contains mostly beech trees and is a relatively open forest compared to most other woods settings I've been in. I don't know if beech have value, other than as firewood. I've never encountered an area that has this many beech trees. At my NY home and most other areas I hunt, maples, oaks, and hickories account for 95% of all trees. The other 5% is beech, black birch and evergreens of some sort.
 
slonstdy said:
Wow, that's a nice return on investment. What sort of trees are planted for a sustainable harvest, hardwoods?
My property contains mostly beech trees and is a relatively open forest compared to most other woods settings I've been in. I don't know if beech have value, other than as firewood. I've never encountered an area that has this many beech trees. At my NY home and most other areas I hunt, maples, oaks, and hickories account for 95% of all trees. The other 5% is beech, black birch and evergreens of some sort.
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IMG_3352.jpeg
deerassociation.com

Know Your Deer Plants: American Beech | National Deer Association

deerassociation.com deerassociation.com
 
Bought 9 acres and killed my largest buck the first year.it will not hold bucks but its a great travel rout for does and though there are no bucks living or bedfing in it they gotta fallow one of the does that constantly travel through it during the rut ONLY.....it has great safety cover and good trails through the cover.thats all i can say .cover and good well used dayly routs.
 
slonstdy said:
There's regular traffic going through here on a daily basis. I've watched deer from the house move out of the front corner swamp in the mornings and cross the property just behind the barn. I also walked the property a few times when the ground was covered in snow and found three heavily used trails they like to use to move across. My goal is to get them to spend more time here somehow. Putting a small plot in the right place may help. I know they also spend time feeding in the wetland/swamp during the day so getting some red osiers in and around there would give them browse and cover.
Click to expand...
Ah ok that’s good and changes things a bit. You could strategically plant a few spots of switchgrass to give them places to hang out after they’ve eaten or while they’re transitioning from one place to the next. That gives them different cover sources than hinge cuts. I threw down some switch grass in a couple parcels I hunted and they loved it. Mineral licks along with a couple small plots and I think you’ll be gold. Then along the edges of your parcel or maybe in thicker spots or a heavily used trail set up a licking branch and see what you’ve got
 
slonstdy said:
Wow, that's a nice return on investment. What sort of trees are planted for a sustainable harvest, hardwoods?
My property contains mostly beech trees and is a relatively open forest compared to most other woods settings I've been in. I don't know if beech have value, other than as firewood. I've never encountered an area that has this many beech trees. At my NY home and most other areas I hunt, maples, oaks, and hickories account for 95% of all trees. The other 5% is beech, black birch and evergreens of some sort.
Click to expand...
Mixed hardwoods consisting of anything from ash, basswood, beech, birch, butternut, cherry, cucumber, hickory, hop hornbeam, locust, and of course the maples and oaks and tulip, walnut, etc. also softwoods mostly hemlock.
 
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slonstdy said:
Wow, that's a nice return on investment. What sort of trees are planted for a sustainable harvest, hardwoods?
My property contains mostly beech trees and is a relatively open forest compared to most other woods settings I've been in. I don't know if beech have value, other than as firewood. I've never encountered an area that has this many beech trees. At my NY home and most other areas I hunt, maples, oaks, and hickories account for 95% of all trees. The other 5% is beech, black birch and evergreens of some sort.
Click to expand...
The property I help manage is a public piece not private hence the disclosure of the timber sale proceeds. I say that only to point out that you can get a reasonable return in a relatively short period of time if a property is managed correctly and it is not clearcut but selective cut for the forestry management purpose or purposes at hand.
 
woodsdog2 said:
Mixed hardwoods consisting of anything from ash, basswood, beech, birch, butternut, cherry, cucumber, hickory, hop hornbeam, locust, and of course the maples and oaks and tulip, walnut, etc. also softwoods mostly hemlock.
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What size and age are the replanted trees? I'm assuming they're not planting seeds.
You said you're going to harvest trees after 17 years which seems like a relatively short timespan. How big in diameter are they?
 
I agree with working with a forester. With a long narrow piece one of the big hurdles is going to be access. Need to really think about what you want where and why. Without knowing anything else about the property or seeing it, my gut reaction would be to do just what you mentioned, hunt it for a year and really nail down how deer naturally prefer to use the property then design around it. I think I would lean toward 2 small openings, something in the 1/3 to half acre size and plant some soft mast in one and hard mast in the other. I would prolly lean towards crabapples and chestnuts. Plant the rest of the openings to clover and not mess with trying to do much else plot wise on a place that size. The thinning of the timber will produce a lot of other native food and give more bang for your buck food wise.
 
Second my homies acces hurtle coment.My land is a long narrow 9 acre strip downhill than across a seasonal creek and i hunt the small other north side of the creek...the hunt only works if i drive around the other side to my father n laws land witch is a 40 acre doe factory with no bucks and access it from the north in a manor that the deer beded on the naibors land dont see or smell me.the buck i harvested this year was bedded on the naibors corner with the doe in a spot only regular to does, but the naibor cant cut them off without being busted.so he has yet to harvest a deer on his 17 acres of land or even see a buck. I started out with a high north east access point that alerted the does by seeing my skylined siliquet when they where bedded and switched to a lower north west direction that they could not posibly see me from or sent me with a southwest prevailing wind...food wise i can not compete with the pastures and vinyards down hill or the clear cut above the naibors land but have consistant travel beetween them.i do have apples in the bottom that help keep constant doe travel ,still only will see a buck durring the rut cuz they live away from the does on private land that is over grown and never hunted.try to make friends with your naibors or even just get acces to your own spot it might make all the difference
 
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