JRB Ascender Hitch

[twdant]

Ok so i appreciate the feedback. I learn from your comments. You didn't say if you were using a carabiner. And yes, a photo would be helpful. Are you saying that it was too tight from the start or that it jammed up as you climb? If it is too tight, ya gotta pull a little slack into it by grabbing that descending working end as it drops off the upper coil and pull some out of the bottom loop into the coil. Get it loose and tell me if it is working itself tighter or if it's too tight the whole time. If the latter, then you simply set it too tight. Also, it can't be used with an eye to eye or with separate knots at the bottom... ya gotta close that with a secure bend.

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I tried it with and without the biner toggle. Both were too tight. I didn't realize there was such a thing as setting it too tight though, so I'm almost sure that was my problem. I'll try it again tonight and see how she goes. I was using a Zeppelin Bend to close the loop, so no eye-to-eye problems.

For our benefit, @John RB, could you give a succinct reason you prefer the JRB Ascender to the Double Meech? What's better about it, specifically?

 

[John RB]

I tried it with and without the biner toggle. Both were too tight. I didn't realize there was such a thing as setting it too tight though, so I'm almost sure that was my problem. I'll try it again tonight and see how she goes. I was using a Zeppelin Bend to close the loop, so no eye-to-eye problems.

For our benefit, @John RB, could you give a succinct reason you prefer the JRB Ascender to the Double Meech? What's better about it, specifically?

I built the JRB Ascender for use in the JRB Climbing system and make it even easier. Be aware, i have designed one Climbing System which ya take in the woods and you can climb 4 different ways and without tying a friction hitch or using a device: JRB style, JRB Hitch Climbing style (for crotchless trees), SRT or MRS/DRT.

I am an experienced climber and i mean it when i say that i literally can't bring myself to use MRS nor SRT anymore. If you would like to understand why that's the case, i can explain in greater detail but JRB has a stack of advantages over both of those techniques for a saddle hunter. And the handles on the friction hitches make it even easier.

The reason i demonstrate the JRB Ascender Hitch in an SRT system is because its a great stress test for a friction hitch. In MRS systems and JRB, a friction hitch only gets HALF our weight. And so it stands to reason that it would be easier to move and easier to break under load then when it is holding our entire body weight. And so, I realize some folks are trying out the hitch for SRT climbing. My question to them is why would you SRT climb when you can jrb climb? Why set and retrieve an anchor when ya don't need to? Why put your entire life on one strand when you can be on a system that's twice as strong with your weight distributed on two strands? Why bring all of that unnecessary rope or rigging line to get the system set-up and retrieveable? Why forego the ability to climb midway between two anchor points and get in the middle of a complex tree? You get the idea.

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[twdant]

SRT is attractive to me (a noob just learning rope climbing, so I certainly don't speak for anyone else) for a couple of reasons:

I hunt almost exclusively in east central Georgia, where anything that isn't a Walmart parking lot is dense timber. Because of that, the trees around here have a tendency to grow straight and limbless for the first 40 or 50 feet, particularly trees of the pine and sweetgum persuasion. So needing a strong crotch for a double rope severely limits tree options. Most of the limbs I plan to toss my rigging line over are little dead limbs 30' off the ground, that will suffice just to pull the rope up to height and girth hitch around the trunk. That girth hitch is crucial.

In reality, my rigging line is also my bow pull up cord, so it isn't added weight. I would argue that the doubled length of rope needed to DRT would be significantly greater than SRT. Heck, even my throw ball is a water bottle that I'd be bringing on my hunt anyway. The same goes for unrigging the girth hitch. Granted, I'm still very new to this, so I'm sure Murphy will teach me some lessons in the future regarding unrigging, but theoretically, I attach my bow cord to the girth hitch after I drop my bow down, and retrieve my rope that way. Just about everything in the system I have in mind is multipurpose, which I like.

Sure, SRT lacks the redundancy of DRT, but if there wasn't a way to do it safely, it wouldn't be so popular among folks whose lives rely on it daily.

 

[gcr0003]

SRT is attractive to me (a noob just learning rope climbing, so I certainly don't speak for anyone else) for a couple of reasons:

I hunt almost exclusively in east central Georgia, where anything that isn't a Walmart parking lot is dense timber. Because of that, the trees around here have a tendency to grow straight and limbless for the first 40 or 50 feet, particularly trees of the pine and sweetgum persuasion. So needing a strong crotch for a double rope severely limits tree options. Most of the limbs I plan to toss my rigging line over are little dead limbs 30' off the ground, that will suffice just to pull the rope up to height and girth hitch around the trunk. That girth hitch is crucial.

In reality, my rigging line is also my bow pull up cord, so it isn't added weight. I would argue that the doubled length of rope needed to DRT would be significantly greater than SRT. Heck, even my throw ball is a water bottle that I'd be bringing on my hunt anyway. The same goes for unrigging the girth hitch. Granted, I'm still very new to this, so I'm sure Murphy will teach me some lessons in the future regarding unrigging, but theoretically, I attach my bow cord to the girth hitch after I drop my bow down, and retrieve my rope that way. Just about everything in the system I have in mind is multipurpose, which I like.

Sure, SRT lacks the redundancy of DRT, but if there wasn't a way to do it safely, it wouldn't be so popular among folks whose lives rely on it daily.

I think SRT will suite you well with your given situation. I think you have a good understanding of what would do well given the area that you hunt.

 

[John RB]

SRT is attractive to me (a noob just learning rope climbing, so I certainly don't speak for anyone else) for a couple of reasons:

I hunt almost exclusively in east central Georgia, where anything that isn't a Walmart parking lot is dense timber. Because of that, the trees around here have a tendency to grow straight and limbless for the first 40 or 50 feet, particularly trees of the pine and sweetgum persuasion. So needing a strong crotch for a double rope severely limits tree options. Most of the limbs I plan to toss my rigging line over are little dead limbs 30' off the ground, that will suffice just to pull the rope up to height and girth hitch around the trunk. That girth hitch is crucial.

In reality, my rigging line is also my bow pull up cord, so it isn't added weight. I would argue that the doubled length of rope needed to DRT would be significantly greater than SRT. Heck, even my throw ball is a water bottle that I'd be bringing on my hunt anyway. The same goes for unrigging the girth hitch. Granted, I'm still very new to this, so I'm sure Murphy will teach me some lessons in the future regarding unrigging, but theoretically, I attach my bow cord to the girth hitch after I drop my bow down, and retrieve my rope that way. Just about everything in the system I have in mind is multipurpose, which I like.

Sure, SRT lacks the redundancy of DRT, but if there wasn't a way to do it safely, it wouldn't be so popular among folks whose lives rely on it daily.

I do appreciate learning about how the woods are really different in GA. I can say, i have never climbed on a dead branch creating the anchor and in a manner like you explain. And so you're saying that even within the boundaries of an SRT system, you want a canopy anchor system only cuz of the cinching factor. Interesting. I could take my JRB system and use it that way, courtesy of an alpine butterfly, then climb one side only, but never thought about doing so. Ok man, great input. Be safe and good luck.

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[FrankNess14]

I do appreciate learning about how the woods are really different in GA. I can say, i have never climbed on a dead branch creating the anchor and in a manner like you explain. And so you're saying that even within the boundaries of an SRT system, you want a canopy anchor system only cuz of the cinching factor. Interesting. I could take my JRB system and use it that way, courtesy of an alpine butterfly, then climb one side only, but never thought about doing so. Ok man, great input. Be safe and good luck.

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I guess you could thread one side of the JRB climbing method thru the other ends friction hitch and pull to cinch it around the tree…not sure I like the idea…..Would definitely want a big stopper knot on the to be cinched side…


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[gcr0003]

I guess you could thread one side of the JRB climbing method thru the other ends friction hitch and pull to cinch it around the tree…not sure I like the idea…..Would definitely want a big stopper knot on the to be cinched side…


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I have canopy anchored with the JRB double lines and it is actually the safest way to climb JRB because if one of your ropes fails you will still be held up by the other half of the rope. This is not the case with the typical JRB method because if you cut the thin dynamic rope of one of the lines you are falling to the bottom of the tree. I do like climbing the dynamic line and I do think that even with twice the rope it still packs down extremely small and that why I still choose to climb JRB.

so what I do is take the rope and attach my throw bag rope to the ends of the rope doubled over. I pull that over the crotch or dead limb and feed that straight through the other end of thedouble over rope which forms a loop. This creates a large girtch hitch canopy anchor directly to the tree (pines) or limbs and similar to SRT and you can climb as younormally would with JRB.

 

[FrankNess14]

I have canopy anchored with the JRB double lines and it is actually the safest way to climb JRB because if one of your ropes fails you will still be held up by the other half of the rope. This is not the case with the typical JRB method because if you cut the thin dynamic rope of one of the lines you are falling to the bottom of the tree. I do like climbing the dynamic line and I do think that even with twice the rope it still packs down extremely small and that why I still choose to climb JRB.

so what I do is take the rope and attach my throw bag rope to the ends of the rope doubled over. I pull that over the crotch or dead limb and feed that straight through the other end of thedouble over rope which forms a loop. This creates a large girtch hitch canopy anchor directly to the tree (pines) or limbs and similar to SRT and you can climb as younormally would with JRB.

That makes more sense


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[John RB]

I have canopy anchored with the JRB double lines and it is actually the safest way to climb JRB because if one of your ropes fails you will still be held up by the other half of the rope. This is not the case with the typical JRB method because if you cut the thin dynamic rope of one of the lines you are falling to the bottom of the tree. I do like climbing the dynamic line and I do think that even with twice the rope it still packs down extremely small and that why I still choose to climb JRB.

so what I do is take the rope and attach my throw bag rope to the ends of the rope doubled over. I pull that over the crotch or dead limb and feed that straight through the other end of thedouble over rope which forms a loop. This creates a large girtch hitch canopy anchor directly to the tree (pines) or limbs and similar to SRT and you can climb as younormally would with JRB.

Interesting... i think i get it but would definitely love to see a pic of it just after ya rig it and before you send it up. I can't say i would likely use it in any scenarios i can think of, only cuz its really rare for me to climb a tree with no branches or obstructions between the ground and the tie in point. But i understand that it almost tranforms JRB into 2 independent systems, not quite because of whatever part of the canopy anchor which supports both sides. Having executed pull tests of climbing ropes to the point of breaking using a 4wd tractor... I have come to the opinion that I can trust my life on these ropes provided that they are inspected and not out of warranty. Climbing ropes are designed to absorb the impact force of a fall, which can be an incredible load. I show em a static 100lbs on a side... it's a minor load in comparison to what they can take.

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[gcr0003]

Interesting... i think i get it but would definitely love to see a pic of it just after ya rig it and before you send it up. I can't say i would likely use it in any scenarios i can think of, only cuz its really rare for me to climb a tree with no branches or obstructions between the ground and the tie in point. But i understand that it almost tranforms JRB into 2 independent systems, not quite because of whatever part of the canopy anchor which supports both sides. Having executed pull tests of climbing ropes to the point of breaking using a 4wd tractor... I have come to the opinion that I can trust my life on these ropes provided that they are inspected and not out of warranty. Climbing ropes are designed to absorb the impact force of a fall, which can be an incredible load. I show em a static 100lbs on a side... it's a minor load in comparison to what they can take.

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Do not disregard the fact that dynamic rope especially half ropes are far more easy to slice through with a blade than static lines. I get they hold dynamic and static loads with no concern at all but The situation that I’m referring to would be one where the rope is likely cut in some manner. In nominal use I never incision this occurring as you stated so long as you inspect your rope periodically for premature wear; however, it should be known to those using it including what would happen were one of those lines were to get cut and fail.

 

[deerfly]

I have been SRT climbing exclusively for about 4 years now and I hunt the same kind of trees as twdant and use SRT for the same reason where a girth hitch is a safe and secure canopy anchor even when using a small limb as the set point. I also have used more conventional crotch anchors when possible too, but hitting those smaller limbs in the 35'-45' range and girth hitching a naked trunk below is far more common. For me in Fl these trees are in old growth swamp, so cypress is another species with very high lower limbs. All these old growth swamps transition to mixed hardwoods and/or into either natural or planted pine which can be high canopy too.

When I first stumbled into JRB climbing a week or so ago,, having to rely on a crotch anchor struck me as one of the downsides given my SRT experience. But I hadn't considered the alpine butterfly approach John just mentioned, which would allow for girth hitching high canopy sets the same as I'm doing now with SRT.

I really like the redundancy in JRB and will be experimenting with it this weekend.

 

[twdant]

Arts and crafts time. Here's a typical tree in my woods:

As you can see, my bow cord is thrown over a small limb that won't support more than 5 lbs without snapping off. I use it to pull my rope into the tree above hunting height. Then:

I pass the rope around the back of the trunk and tie a figure 8 follow through in the end. Then pass the tail of the rope through the loop and pull until:

I end up with a girth hitch around the trunk, not relying on the small limb, and I'm ready to climb. Is this not a thing?

 

[deerfly]

that is exactly what I have done using SRT gear at least 100+climbs now over a 4 year period. I carry 60' of oplux and 60' of 800lb paracord retrieval line that doubles as bow/gun/equip hauler while at hunting height and 100' of zip line and 12oz throw ball.

 

[John RB]

Arts and crafts time. Here's a typical tree in my woods:
View attachment 56216
As you can see, my bow cord is thrown over a small limb that won't support more than 5 lbs without snapping off. I use it to pull my rope into the tree above hunting height. Then:
View attachment 56217
I pass the rope around the back of the trunk and tie a figure 8 follow through in the end. Then pass the tail of the rope through the loop and pull until:
View attachment 56218
I end up with a girth hitch around the trunk, not relying on the small limb, and I'm ready to climb. Is this not a thing?

Thx for photos. It's Obviously viable. Of course, it only works if you're rigging to the first branch on the tree. Any branches lower would stop ya from setting the anchor. And if the tree has any other stubs or junk on the trunk it might require some whipping action. I only set my anchors in crotches for live branches and almost never capture the trunk... The Only Exception is on a few trees where I want to be on the other side for positioning purposes. I think the key lesson here comes from the Georgia pines... and remembering that our forests are incredibly diverse. In the Northeast, I basically don't need this. And it won't work on my heavily branched trees. In the tall pines, it might be your only option.

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[twdant]

Thx for photos. It's Obviously viable. Of course, it only works if you're rigging to the first branch on the tree. Any branches lower would stop ya from setting the anchor. And if the tree has any other stubs or junk on the trunk it might require some whipping action. I only set my anchors in crotches for live branches and almost never capture the trunk... The Only Exception is on a few trees where I want to be on the other side for positioning purposes. I think the key lesson here comes from the Georgia pines... and remembering that our forests are incredibly diverse. In the Northeast, I basically don't need this. And it won't work on my heavily branched trees. In the tall pines, it might be your only option.

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"Photos" is a strong word

And now we come back around full circle to say thanks to @John RB for developing and publishing content on diverse ways to access trees for hunting without having to lug around climbing sticks.

 

[gcr0003]

"Photos" is a strong word

And now we come back around full circle to say thanks to @John RB for developing and publishing content on diverse ways to access trees for hunting without having to lug around climbing sticks.

I one stick climb in the am as well as anytime I need to get in a pine. Any other time I try and rope climb. If you are almost exclusively climbing pines then using your 40-50' rappel rope to canopy anchor to the tree itself like you showed seems like the no brainier choice.

 

[John RB]

"Photos" is a strong word

And now we come back around full circle to say thanks to @John RB for developing and publishing content on diverse ways to access trees for hunting without having to lug around climbing sticks.

Appreciate that. It's literally impossible for me to convey my sincerity in text that folks are helped out by the content i am providing. Besides appreciation, i also get motivated by the questions and interest. And part of me is sad that i can't leave my hunting knowledge to my own kids due to their special needs situation and so i am kinda using social media as a way to pass it on and "make lemonade".

I will also be beyond excited when i get around to doing a video on a special climb: i will do a JRB Hitch Climbing video on a tree with no throwball... and i will only be using my knots. They happened cuz i needed them. Necessity is truly the mother of invention. Cheers.

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[deerfly]

Appreciate that. It's literally impossible for me to convey my sincerity in text that folks are helped out by the content i am providing. Besides appreciation, i also get motivated by the questions and interest. And part of me is sad that i can't leave my hunting knowledge to my own kids due to their special needs situation and so i am kinda using social media as a way to pass it on and "make lemonade".

I will also be beyond excited when i get around to doing a video on a special climb: i will do a JRB Hitch Climbing video on a tree with no throwball... and i will only be using my knots. They happened cuz i needed them. Necessity is truly the mother of invention. Cheers.

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I would like to pile on too and commend you for devising a truly safe and novel, if not genius, approach to climbing. Your method(s) even though evolving, are well thought out and most importantly are safely testable while being built on a solid foundation of knot theory and practice. I don't think that can be over stated.

Safety is something I focused on since embarking on my saddle hunting adventure a few years ago. I am on record here on this site and others more or less saying if arborists or SAR teams aren't doing it, neither am I. One of my common refrains is asking how often do people test their fall arrest harness/system? Or even how many others do they know routinely test their fall arrest systems? Answer is always none, they simply trust the system will work when they need it.

So to me rope climbing, whether with mechanical devices in the rigging or not as JRB method demonstrates, exemplifies safety because you can always inspect your gear and inherently test the "system" before every ascent. In most cases if you don't get the rigging and technique correct you can't even get off the ground/ Worse case you may fall on your back end the first time you load the rope. Safety, safety, safety and your JRB method brings it.

Anyway, I can't offer enough kudo's for your dedication and brilliance in contributing this knowledge regardless of where your inspiration comes from. That said, as a father of two I am also humbled to hear you are dealing with special needs children and offer my deepest admiration for you and your family. Its hard enough to maneuver through this world with normal or even above average human capacity, So you deserve even more praise for your role as a parent and mentor. We are all benefiting from your inspiration. Thank you again - eric

 

[Bowmanmike]

I would like to pile on too and commend you for devising a truly safe and novel, if not genius, approach to climbing. Your method(s) even though evolving, are well thought out and most importantly are safely testable while being built on a solid foundation of knot theory and practice. I don't think that can be over stated.

Safety is something I focused on since embarking on my saddle hunting adventure a few years ago. I am on record here on this site and others more or less saying if arborists or SAR teams aren't doing it, neither am I. One of my common refrains is asking how often do people test their fall arrest harness/system? Or even how many others do they know routinely test their fall arrest systems? Answer is always none, they simply trust the system will work when they need it.

So to me rope climbing, whether with mechanical devices in the rigging or not as JRB method demonstrates, exemplifies safety because you can always inspect your gear and inherently test the "system" before every ascent. In most cases if you don't get the rigging and technique correct you can't even get off the ground/ Worse case you may fall on your back end the first time you load the rope. Safety, safety, safety and your JRB method brings it.

Anyway, I can't offer enough kudo's for your dedication and brilliance in contributing this knowledge regardless of where your inspiration comes from. That said, as a father of two I am also humbled to hear you are dealing with special needs children and offer my deepest admiration for you and your family. Its hard enough to maneuver through this world with normal or even above average human capacity, So you deserve even more praise for your role as a parent and mentor. We are all benefiting from your inspiration. Thank you again - eric

How very well put. I agree on all counts.
Thanks JRB.

 

[John RB]

'Appreciate the comments boys. I tagged my buck last weekend, sitting in a tree i never climbed b4, which i quietly snuck to at noon in a known doe travel corridor, and used a throwball to get into, and sitting on a mismatched pair of JRB Ascender Hitches (cuz i am testing a variant and the side by side test is such a good test). I was only halfway up when the first buck walked by. He saw me but i froze and waited him out. And when the gang came back 5.5 hours later, it happened very fast, in just a few seconds, and glad i was holding and ready. There were 3 bucks chasing a doe on a full run. I timed my 2 fast dog barks pretty well and brought the last and biggest down to a walk, broadside 7 yds. Was an excellent day. My streak of 4+ year olds continues. And so I am gonna use my planned vacation days this week on a grouse hunting event in the deep woods of PA for a few days. Internet reception will be sporadic to rare in case anyone is expecting a response to anything here. Good luck hunting and be safe.

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