So you thought I was nuts when it came to the swaider/knaider.....

[Dylan9862003]

Wondering, what advantage does this have over the two rope cimb method where you move a girth hitch up? Someone brought it up above.

That's what I was asking too

 

[Peterk1234]

Wondering, what advantage does this have over the two rope cimb method where you move a girth hitch up? Someone brought it up above.

You have to show me what you are referring to because I have no idea. My idea here is to have five or six of these and use them instead of the WE Steps. Did somebody already try this and i missed it?

 

[skyjacker]

You still have the problem of kicks outs. Which is the same thing as slipping on a step. Actually a kick out is worse if your foot gets caught.

 

[Recurveaholic]

Slip your ring knaider swaider over Cranford rope steps?

I have thought about this several times just never had a chance to try it!

 

[Peterk1234]

You still have the problem of kicks outs. Which is the same thing as slipping on a step. Actually a kick out is worse if your foot gets caught.

I respectfully disagree. I have never had a kickout with the knaider/swaider, and I have climbed a lot of trees with the system. Does not matter if it is a fat or skinny tree, wet or dry, or what boots I wear. I was just out in a foot and half of snow, wearing snowmobile boots, climbed a tree that I have seen for the first time and it had two bends in it; no issue. So far, this seems to even jam me in harder to the tree. But I will not be able to tell for sure until I can make up a few and climb higher. Kickout is a function of bad form, specifically poor use of the linemans belt.

Keep the problems and issues coming. I need to to figure out where this will fail.

Pete

 

[Peterk1234]

More pics. First time with the linemans belt. Rock solid and locked in. I really need some daylight and a person to to video me. I am not sure I am explaining this idea correctly to you guys.

 

[blt348]

Real cool idea here. Can’t wait for a video to see it at work. I can see a longer version of the knaider and swaider working well here. May even get 20+ feet with only 3 ocb buckles, 6 hooks, 6 o rings and some 1” webbing. Talk about cheap and lightweight!!!!

Over center buckles gonna be hard to find very soon...


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[bj139]

Isn't this going to work about the same as several multiple step strap ladders?

 

[JumpingVampire]

Just use a 5 step aider with the LW hook. But this method looks like to much to fiddle with

 

[flinginairos]

Interesting. Following for the video!!


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[Tr33_n1nj@]

Looks cheaper and lighter than steps. For someone who is already comfortable using a knaider/swaider with WE / Primal, I’d give it a try. Seems like it’s basically the next step in the evolution from squirrel steps. Heck throw one of those on the strap if you must have a rest notch.

 

[Patriot]

I respectfully disagree. I have never had a kickout with the knaider/swaider, and I have climbed a lot of trees with the system. Does not matter if it is a fat or skinny tree, wet or dry, or what boots I wear. I was just out in a foot and half of snow, wearing snowmobile boots, climbed a tree that I have seen for the first time and it had two bends in it; no issue. So far, this seems to even jam me in harder to the tree. But I will not be able to tell for sure until I can make up a few and climb higher. Kickout is a function of bad form, specifically poor use of the linemans belt.

Keep the problems and issues coming. I need to to figure out where this will fail.

Pete

Pete can you expand on the bad form? Kick outs are my concern as well on the current common method of K/S with WE steps. What is the common mistake with the LB that increases likelihood of kickouts?

I’m a spur guy right now and used it all season but that is not without its own pucker moments!!

 

[Peterk1234]

Pete can you expand on the bad form? Kick outs are my concern as well on the current common method of K/S with WE steps. What is the common mistake with the LB that increases likelihood of kickouts?

I’m a spur guy right now and used it all season but that is not without its own pucker moments!!

I have a thread here somewhere about it. If I can ever find it I will send it to you. I keep threatening to make a video about it too

It all has to do about trusting your lineman and leaning back against it. Even some of the folks making the how to use knaider/swaider and other aider vids are doing it wrong at times. Next time you go out to your backyard try the following. Just do it a few feet off the ground at first, but do it over and over. As you climb just lean back and against the lineman and into the harness. Your brain is going to tell you "no" and will tell you to get as close to the tree and as vertical as possible. Ignore your brain. Just embrace it all and try to fall off the tree backwards. You are doing it right when you say to yourself, "This splice better not fail me because I will be screwed".

It is when you place your weight back against the lineman that you create stability. You become a tripod. Your leg(s) is one "pod", and each side of the lineman make up the other two. You will find that not only are you stable, and kickout nearly impossible, but your leg muscles are working not nearly as hard because you have distributed some of your weight against the lineman. This works both ascending and descending. You should not be relying on your arms to pull you up when climbing. Most of the time I am pushing off the tree with my arms because it creates even more stability.

I am constantly adjusting my lineman when ascending and descending. I will be on my swaider, and can tell as I am about to hook the knaider that I am a bit too far from the tree. I can still hook in but I would have to move my body toward the tree and this would slacken my lineman. That is a no go for me. I grab the rope, give it a tug which pulls the knee in toward the Step. Then I hook in. Same thing when going down. Most of the time It is too short when hooking the knaider. I stop, release the ropeman a bit, then hook in. When I am on a Step and about to tie another one I have to always shorten the lineman a lot, so I can safely tie the Step. I pull the rope in, getting me pretty close to the tree, lean back and tie in the Step. Then I add length, lean back again, and start to climb.

I do not like slack or light tension at any point in my lineman. There are moments when we are transitioning during a climb that requires it (when we move the lineman up or down). I try to make those moments last a fraction of a second though, because that is when I consider myself to be at risk. I find the lineman belt to be a wonderful climbing aid, as long as I am using it correctly.

One last thing. My goal is to always have the back of the lineman belt (the part that is on the tree) above horizontal. I know that if it is at this position, and should I have a fall, and that I am leaning back against it, that it should catch me so I do not fall to the ground. Obviously, it is not always in this position, but I try to move it as quick as I can. I consider a linemans belt that is below horizontal a high risk position.

 

[valerio024]

Without something to stand on how much higher than the first strap do you think you could get the second?


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[Peterk1234]

Without something to stand on how much higher than the first strap do you think you could get the second?


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It won't know for sure until I get a few more made up and really push it through its paces, but I am guessing I will get four feet per Tree Strap. Probably can get creative for more height, but I want to keep it safe and focus on another goal, which I did with the knaider/swaider; be able to still do it when I am over 60 years old. I'm 53 now, and time is flying.

I am not going for less "steps" with this. My goal is safety, speed, compact, less weight and no tree damage. If I can't tick off those boxes then WE Steps and knaider/swaider will continue to reign as King for me.

 

[colic]

I'm still confused at how you are not having to rethread the cam buckle every time you have to set a new strap. Those are always a pain in the neck to thread!

 

[Peterk1234]

I'm still confused at how you are not having to rethread the cam buckle every time you have to set a new strap. Those are always a pain in the neck to thread!

That will be easy. Flat hook will be used where the webbing is typically sewn to the buckle. Strap will be permanently threaded through the cam.

 

[colic]

That will be easy. Flat hook will be used where the webbing is typically sewn to the buckle. Strap will be permanently threaded through the cam.

Ah yes that what was in my head but I didn't see it in your picture. You're prototyping so no need right now. Makes sense, continue on! I'm really intrigued with this one Peter. Can't wait for a video.

 

[TFL]

this technique really bothers me, not saying it is wrong but, seems likely to fail
I can envision being on the third step,15 ft up, reaching up to hook your knee and having your connected foot slip,
it would loosen your lineman's belt with the slip, and you could very well wind up, upside down with your
foot still attached , by the strap,to the step or hook.

how do you plan to self rescue if you are in a predicament like that.
doesn't sound like a place I would want to be in

does this make sense or am I over thinking it

 

[robstewart]

Coming down makes me nervous too.

After having issues and not being comfortable coming down in the dark etc I switched to rappelling down. If I used this new system I don’t think that would change.




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