@kyler1945 I was about to ask if you'd gone soft after reading post 14 but then you called us monkeys again in post 17 so all remains right with the world. Lol hope you and the new addition are doing well.
Your dad sounds like he had a wealth of knowledge. I thought that way as well at one point…..I think the market is saturated, based on the number of guys posting that they're going back to stands. I believe all the lightweight stands are competing directly with saddles.
...And something I've wanted to post here for a long time: When I was a kid back in the 1960's, tons of products were marked "patent pending". I asked my dad who worked in manufacturing most of his life what "patent pending" meant--he said "that means they'll never get a patent".
It’s a giant sham
@kyler1945 I was about to ask if you'd gone soft after reading post 14 but then you called us monkeys again in post 17 so all remains right with the world. Lol hope you and the new addition are doing well.
I re-listened to the 2021 Steve / Matt Rinella podcast last night and the more I stew on it the more I agree with Matt. The younger generation is growing up with the content and potential viewership associated with the activity in a way that I / we did not, and it’s a bit of a shame IMO. The genies out of the bottle don’t know there’s much that can be done but the animals and the habitat are increasingly a commercial product. I’m a hypocrite who’s both team Meateater / Winke / Youtube, but also team Matt.Yup.
People ain’t skeered of the dark anymore. You can just follow the magic pocket brick, or call a friend who could be 30 miles away to get you.
The big risk, or perceived risk, of run and gun public hunting has been removed. Plus there’s a stronger incentive than pre-internet/smartphone to say you did it and have people pat you on the back virtually.
Take away phones, and all of it collapses to people who like the process not the results or rewards.
That’s not a value judgement either - we are all the same monkeys.
I believe the laws were started in good faith but like nearly everything else that involves politicians and lawyers, it quickly turns into a farce that favors the wealthy. Not everyone is willing to license out their”innovations” nor do they have to. Furthermore the idea is supposed to new and non obvious. Are pockets that are sewn into the side of the saddle new or non obvious? How far of a tail you leave in an amsteel splice… is that new or non obvious? Daisy chains with a hook? How about boat cleats as an attachment method? What about having a concave shape? Oh wait straps sewn into the top panel and bottom panel, using ladder locks for panel management? Everything I just listed is either patent pending or has been approved by the US patent office over the last 4 years. I can give you examples of each being put out publicly and used on this site or by other saddle companies YEARS before these patents were applied for. Tell me how it’s designed to protect true innovation and not just a wording game performed by lawyers. The patent office doesn’t do it’s due diligence. It checks against existing patents, asks a couple questions and then approves it. When you try to protest it prior to approval, they refuse to allow it and then they tell you, it can be hashed out in court. I’ve been through the process and it’s a farce. At one time, yes it was required and probably truly a protection, now it’s a game of money and lawyers. Nothing more, nothing less.I’d be interested to see why you think that.
The fact of the matter is that starting a business making and selling a product that isn’t truly unique is very risky, and has low upside. Our current IP laws reflect the value we put on innovation and creativity. And lawyers are just the editors of our ideals.
Starting a saddle making company today might make you a million dollars. You might also get sued, and rightfully so, and lose all but 10% of it.
You could instead start a saddle selling company, and make 10% margin selling the patent owner’s product, or licensing their IP, and eliminate risk. While being more realistic about the actual value being offered to the consumer.
True innovation is easy to protect in this country. And true innovation is very valuable. It makes stroking the 6 figure check for good international IP protection easy to do.
Thinking this way requires a lot of humility though, and recognizing that what we might think is a “good” product, is not a truly “unique” one.
But I bet you noodling catfish in a thong would get a lot of views on GrindrI re-listened to the 2021 Steve / Matt Rinella podcast last night and the more I stew on it the more I agree with Matt. The younger generation is growing up with the content and potential viewership associated with the activity in a way that I / we did not, and it’s a bit of a shame IMO. The genies out of the bottle don’t know there’s much that can be done but the animals and the habitat are increasingly a commercial product. I’m a hypocrite who’s both team Meateater / Winke / Youtube, but also team Matt.
And agree, as much as I love it I’d be very hesitant to attempt a business in the outdoor space. And I’m no Hannah Barron.
I hate to be one of those guys that goes on about how long they've been saddle hunting, but well I have been. I got into Saddle hunting way back in 2007 after finding that original thread on AT and then piecing the puzzle together with a lot of help from the original Saddle hunting Youtube star, BoudreauxBoswell.
This was when Trophyline was stopping production and saddles were few and far between and don't get me started on how hard it was to procure a LW Assassin all those years back.
Boy have things changed. I can't keep up with all the different saddles and platform options but I have to think we're getting close to a market saturation and we'll see some players start to drop off.
Which manufacturers do you think will be able to continue to innovate and stay profitable? Have we reached peak saddle?
I believe the laws were started in good faith but like nearly everything else that involves politicians and lawyers, it quickly turns into a farce that favors the wealthy. Not everyone is willing to license out their”innovations” nor do they have to. Furthermore the idea is supposed to new and non obvious. Are pockets that are sewn into the side of the saddle new or non obvious? How far of a tail you leave in an amsteel splice… is that new or non obvious? Daisy chains with a hook? How about boat cleats as an attachment method? What about having a concave shape? Oh wait straps sewn into the top panel and bottom panel, using ladder locks for panel management? Everything I just listed is either patent pending or has been approved by the US patent office over the last 4 years. I can give you examples of each being put out publicly and used on this site or by other saddle companies YEARS before these patents were applied for. Tell me how it’s designed to protect true innovation and not just a wording game performed by lawyers. The patent office doesn’t do it’s due diligence. It checks against existing patents, asks a couple questions and then approves it. When you try to protest it prior to approval, they refuse to allow it and then they tell you, it can be hashed out in court. I’ve been through the process and it’s a farce. At one time, yes it was required and probably truly a protection, now it’s a game of money and lawyers. Nothing more, nothing less.
I think I’d agree. My guess is that the number of people who buy a deer license that have never heard of a tree saddle, met anyone who uses a tree saddle, or has and laughs at them, is much much bigger than anyone using a saddle. And always will be.
I was telling this guy who hunts for bear in an area that I hunt that I don't have a stand setup in one area, I move around and hunt out of my saddle.
A few weeks later I was talking to the land owner and he asked me if I had horses, I said no and he said, I didn't think so. It turns out he was talking to the bear hunter and the bear hunter told him that I was hunting off a horse (from the saddle ). I was walking in to hunt and had my saddle on that day so I showed him my saddle setup.
Probably that he had underestimated him. What a genius! A mobile elevated position that masks the sound of you moving? And makes you look like a non-threatening tourist!!Haha I suspect that would be the response of most people. Think of what was going through that guys head before your conversation!
100%IP law is meant to protect true innovation. Shrinking a treestand to shoeboex size or putting an anti wedgie device on a harness is not innovation, it's iteration.
IP law is meant to protect true innovation. Shrinking a treestand to shoeboex size or putting an anti wedgie device on a harness is not innovation, it's iteration.