Questions about saddles and longer traditional bows

[boxerboxer]

Actual questions are red for the guys that like reading less.

I just got my first saddle, a CGM Sidewinder, and this fall will be hunting out of it with a 68" longbow. There's some stuff I'd love to get some input on from more experienced guys.

When I talked to Jerry I believe he recommended chin height tether but I'm interested in what other trad guys like for tether height.

I'm also curious if anybody shooting a longer bow like mine use a back band. Jerry recommended it for comfort but I'm concerned it may get in the way of the string when shooting.

Finally, I always shoot with maybe 7-10 degrees of cant, partly because it allows me to look down the arrow and partly because my hill style bow has such a small shelf and it helps keep the arrow from coming off when I draw. If I keep the cant I probably want to stick with strong side shots and just work my way around the tree with a ROS to hit the angles, right?.

Finally, let me know if there's anything else you think I should know specifically related to shooting traditional bows from a saddle (or just for someone new to saddles in general I guess).

 

[GCTerpfan]

I have never shot a 68" bow from a saddle. Most of my recurves are 62" the longest I have shot is 64" but, I don't think you will have any problems with a 68" bow.

I run my tether a little higher then Jerry recommended, about forehead height usually but some setups require it a little higher and some a little lower. That's something you will have to play with and see what works for you. Each person and each saddle likes something different. Chin to forehead height is a good place to start.

I almost always use a back band however, I connect my backband directly to my bridge with small prusiks like Aerohunter used to do. I attached a picture to help make it clear. I am not sure why companies went away from this design, it gets in the way less for me this way. Most companies seem to be selling back bands that connect to the tether. In my experience these will get in the way unless you let them drop or move them down before drawing.

For me, I have to have my feet mostly square and my body completely square to the target. I am not a good enough shot with a trad bow to shoot with my body twisted around. Compound guys can pull this off and maybe some better than average trad guys but, I can't. I use a platform with three squirrel steps on the strap. One step is placed at 3:00, one at 9:00 and one at 12:00 (backside of tree). I try to setup to have a strong side (3:00) shot but, have the ability to move around the tree or turn around on my platform if other shots present themselves.

Other than that, just practice from the tree a lot. It helps you get comfortable and figure out what body positions you can shoot from.

 

[HuumanCreed]

Short draw is going to be your biggest concern, or to be honest, mine. I would get some type of clicking device or draw length indicator when you practice. This would help indicate if your form is breaking down due to the different positions your body is at when in a saddle. I never had to worried about this with my compound bow as the draw stopper is a hard wall. But I can tell that I short draw a lot with my trad bow until I used some type of indicator trigger/method.

But to be fair, it is not the end of the world. With how short the range is for a trad bow, as long as you are decently accurate, +/- an inch in draw length is not going to throw our aim by miles. But again, some method of draw length indicators will help with your form. But when in doubt, aim low, apparently most newbies (this was true for me) miss high.

 

[BTaylor]

I dont use a back band. I set up tether differently than @GCTerpfan as well. I almost never have mine above nose high and generally lower, roughly collarbone high. Tried higher and didnt like it for a number of reasons. I am almost exclusively a leaner though and that plays a part as well. I dont use steps alone or with a platform but I do hunt off of a mission platfrom or a stand so I have ample room to adjust feet and body position. I hunt with a 62" bow and the only thing I have to take into consideration is tree limb interference in relation to setting the platform or stand. Same will be true with a 68" bow. In most of the trees I climb it is a non-issue or easy to account for.

 

[Allegheny Tom]

I like collar bone height too. But I think which is the best height ( for comfort) depends on the saddle. Some saddles are more comfortable with a lower tether than other saddles. Recons seem to handle low tethers pretty well. Low tether will give you better elbow clearance but it usually means you'll need a shorter bridge. It also reduces how much free "leash" you'll have for travel around the tree.
Watch your upper limb clearance on the tree trunk if you are canting (for strong side shots).
I'm an advocate of a vertical bow, if you can shoot it accurately. But a good trad shooter should be able to shoot the bow in any position.

 

[BLR1970]

I also place the tether collarbone height with a short bridge, works great with my Recon sling and 60” hybrid longbow. Like said before just watch clearance on the limbs.

 

[NMSbowhunter]

I haven't hunted with my 68" longbow out of my saddle, but I did climb and practice with it some and did not see any problems. I took quite a few shots all around the tree as best I could. I was in a Recon sling saddle and on a ring of steps. Do a practice climb and take some shots and see how it goes for you.

 

[Allegheny Tom]

Question for trad shooters who shoot strictly from a ring of steps...
Do you feel crowded against the tree creating limited space for bow clearance?
I'm a platform guy and I usually have one step on each side of the tree, but I have practiced on a ROS and my shooting wasn't very good.
Seems to me that ROS are better suited for tech bow shooters. How many trad guys hunt ROS and can still shoot accurately after 5 or 10 hours on those things?

 

[GCTerpfan]

Question for trad shooters who shoot strictly from a ring of steps...
Do you feel crowded against the tree creating limited space for bow clearance?
I'm a platform guy and I usually have one step on each side of the tree, but I have practiced on a ROS and my shooting wasn't very good.
Seems to me that ROS are better suited for tech bow shooters. How many trad guys hunt ROS and can still shoot accurately after 5 or 10 hours on those things?

I hunted from a ROS for several years. I lean forward and far enough away from the tree that it has never been a problem.

 

[kbetts]

Question for trad shooters who shoot strictly from a ring of steps...
Do you feel crowded against the tree creating limited space for bow clearance?
I'm a platform guy and I usually have one step on each side of the tree, but I have practiced on a ROS and my shooting wasn't very good.
Seems to me that ROS are better suited for tech bow shooters. How many trad guys hunt ROS and can still shoot accurately after 5 or 10 hours on those things?

Has never been an issue. Two years ago is when I finally got my first platform. I still prefer a ROS.

As for the last question.....shoot'em inside 5 hours. I'm not spending 10 hrs in a tree. Promise.

 

[BTaylor]

Question for trad shooters who shoot strictly from a ring of steps...
Do you feel crowded against the tree creating limited space for bow clearance?
I'm a platform guy and I usually have one step on each side of the tree, but I have practiced on a ROS and my shooting wasn't very good.
Seems to me that ROS are better suited for tech bow shooters. How many trad guys hunt ROS and can still shoot accurately after 5 or 10 hours on those things?

Being a leaner, I want no part of being on a ROS. But it looks like it would make shooting difficult to me, esp if you need shoot weak side.

 

[GCTerpfan]

Being a leaner, I want no part of being on a ROS. But it looks like it would make shooting difficult to me, esp if you need shoot weak side.

There is no weak side with a ROS.

 

[HuumanCreed]

There is no weak side with a ROS.

But.......you have to be cognizant of the fixed tether length. You can adjust the tether to move the 'default' position, but remember it get shorter as you work your way around the tree. Until CGM come up with a 360 degree adjustable tether. Man...that sound cool.

 

[GCTerpfan]

But.......you have to be cognizant of the fixed tether length. You can adjust the tether to move the 'default' position, but remember it get shorter as you work your way around the tree. Until CGM come up with a 360 degree adjustable tether. Man...that sound cool.

I’ve never really had a tether length problem and I hunt some pretty big trees. I always moved to my right to shoot the weak side (right handed) I didn’t try to go the whole way around the tree.

My pack would sometimes get in the way which is one of the reasons I went to a platform. I turn and put my back to the tree to shoot that shot now.

 

[Allegheny Tom]

I’ve never really had a tether length problem and I hunt some pretty big trees. I always moved to my right to shoot the weak side (right handed) I didn’t try to go the whole way around the tree.....

This might be a detail that newbies may want to think about.
Are you guys, that reposition around the tree, particular about which direction you girth hitch your tether? Girth hitch gets tighter when moved in one direction but loosens when you move in the other direction.
This is a detail that I'm picky about.
As a right handed shooter I try to set-up to favor strong side shots. I seldom attempt a weak side shot unless I just turn on the platform.
I normally have my pack hanging on my right because I know I won't need to position to that side for a shot.
But I might need to reposition from the platform to my single step to my left for strong side shots (11 or 12 o'clock type shots).
I like the girth hitch to stay tight and in position straight up from the platform. I don't like it when it unexpectedly "follows" me around the tree. I've had it suddenly slip as it followed me and it gave me a major pucker. If I need more leash around the tree, I'll just lengthen my tether at the Ropeman or reach up and manually slide the girth around the tree. I feel that directional girth hitching keeps my tether under much better control.

 

[Jammintree]

There’s infinite ways to successfully set up on a tree and shoot a trad bow. There’s gonna be obstacles to be mindful of, no matter what. When I first started shooting my recurve from a saddle, I set up my platform / ring of steps about 2 feet off the ground. I created every situation imaginable: big trees, little trees, different kinds of leaning tree, trees with branches, etc etc. By dealing with all those situations at ground level and in my backyard I was able to grasp all the nuances and learn what to be mindful of with form, limb and string clearance. Just put lots of practice time in and you’ll be ready for the hunt.

And yes, I’m definitely deliberate about which way I girth hitch my tether. There’s one way I like it, but every once in a blue moon an odd set up happens where for some reason it’s beneficial to reverse directions.

 

[katiesmom]

This might be a detail that newbies may want to think about.
Are you guys, that reposition around the tree, particular about which direction you girth hitch your tether? Girth hitch gets tighter when moved in one direction but loosens when you move in the other direction.
This is a detail that I'm picky about.
As a right handed shooter I try to set-up to favor strong side shots. I seldom attempt a weak side shot unless I just turn on the platform.
I normally have my pack hanging on my right because I know I won't need to position to that side for a shot.
But I might need to reposition from the platform to my single step to my left for strong side shots (11 or 12 o'clock type shots).
I like the girth hitch to stay tight and in position straight up from the platform. I don't like it when it unexpectedly "follows" me around the tree. I've had it suddenly slip as it followed me and it gave me a major pucker. If I need more leash around the tree, I'll just lengthen my tether at the Ropeman or reach up and manually slide the girth around the tree. I feel that directional girth hitching keeps my tether under much better control.

I'm the same way. I fix my tether loop (Tethrd tether) so it faces toward the side I think deer/hog will come in. So that way it stays tight. I do not like it loose at all. If I'm facing out for a 6 o'clock shot it comes over my shoulder.

 

[Still Kicking]

I have never shot a 68" bow from a saddle. Most of my recurves are 62" the longest I have shot is 64" but, I don't think you will have any problems with a 68" bow.

I run my tether a little higher then Jerry recommended, about forehead height usually but some setups require it a little higher and some a little lower. That's something you will have to play with and see what works for you. Each person and each saddle likes something different. Chin to forehead height is a good place to start.

I almost always use a back band however, I connect my backband directly to my bridge with small prusiks like Aerohunter used to do. I attached a picture to help make it clear. I am not sure why companies went away from this design, it gets in the way less for me this way. Most companies seem to be selling back bands that connect to the tether. In my experience these will get in the way unless you let them drop or move them down before draw.

Total agreement here. I shoot 54" and 58" recurves with tether at forehead height and Aerohunter backband on the bridge. I don't cant by bow but like both feet flat on the platform.

 

[Mike Curtis]

I shoot longbows or self bows usually 66”. ROS no problem. If you lean into the shot as you should you can shoot what you like.

 

[boxerboxer]

I shoot longbows or self bows usually 66”. ROS no problem. If you lean into the shot as you should you can shoot what you like.

When you talk about leaning into the shot, are you talking about tilting your torso downward as you would if shooting downhill from a standing position? Basically making sure you don't artificially shorten your draw by tilting your bow arm downward but keeping your shoulders level?