Hey everyone. This is my third season learning to hunt solo. I'm a middle-aged dude who decided to try this out after a lifetime of fly fishing. I live outside West Philly and work in the West Chester/ Downingtown area. I mainly hunt in SGL 52. I've been out four Saturdays so far in that SGL. On my first sit, I saw five doe. On my second sit, I saw two fork bucks. I didn't have an antlerless tag at the time but now do. On my third and fourth hunts, I saw nada. Should I keep hunting this plot, or look elsewhere? I am trying to hunt as much as I can with a full-time job, and SGL 52 is about 55 minutes from my house in Ardmore and 20 minutes from my office, which is doable. Where generally should I scout? What sign am I looking for in the run-up to the rut? Should I find another SGL? I don't plan on quitting yet, as I enjoy just sitting in the woods, but I'd really like to get a deer in the next season or two. Thanks.
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How to productively hunt in October, SE PA, still without my first deer.
- Thread starter caddis75
- Start date
We're hunting in the same area man. I'm in my second year and I've started seeing more deer than last year but it's definitely a tough area to hunt. I just posted a pretty lengthy thread asking for help myself. I would say don't focus on the same area. I scout my way in and find fresh sign for an evening hunt. If I see and miss out on a shot after that first sit, any sit after that kills my chances in that area. One of the things I struggle with the most is honing in too much on the last place I saw deer and not the next place. There's a ton of great information available on podcasts and youtube I think it's all about putting the pieces together and making sure you learn from whenever you fail. I'm not afraid to make a mistake as long as I learn from it.
I am also a newbie, season 3 here, but slightly south of you in Maryland. I've had some limited success, but still working to prove they weren't flukes (I shot a doe last year and a spike this year, both on opening weekend/beginning of season). I've really been trying to hold to @kyler1945's advice to keep walking until I find deer or scout my throughout an area and decide it's not worth hunting. The hang and hope mentality resulted in me having a lot of decent sits where I was enjoying the woods last year, but never close enough to deer to shoot them, and to be honest, I got in to this to eat venison, not to birdwatch (though to be honest I've enjoyed that aspect of it as well, just not wanting that to be the ONLY part I enjoy lol). It's been difficult adjusting to the "keep scouting, bump deer, then decide if you're hunting them" mentality because everything on YouTube makes it seem like if you bump a deer your hunt is over. Maybe if you're targeting one monster buck, but I'm targeting anything that doesn't have spots (and I assume you are as well) and they seem to come back/more come thru later once I've found a decent spot.
That and focusing my energy on archery only areas has really helped, even during gun season I've been hunting bow only, I think both the deer and myself enjoy less hunters in those woods.
What is a typical hunt for you, do you walk in before dark, climb a tree and stay there? Do you scout around all day? Some combo? Give us some more details and some of the people I've learned from will likely be a long to be more helpful soon.
That and focusing my energy on archery only areas has really helped, even during gun season I've been hunting bow only, I think both the deer and myself enjoy less hunters in those woods.
What is a typical hunt for you, do you walk in before dark, climb a tree and stay there? Do you scout around all day? Some combo? Give us some more details and some of the people I've learned from will likely be a long to be more helpful soon.
Thanks all,
Season one- I sort of just walked around the woods a lot. I saw one buck.
Season two- I spent a lot of time walking and looking for rubs, scat, and bedding. Most days, I'd pick a place that looks ok and with a favorable wind and walk around for a few hours; then, if I found a favorable tree, I'd post up for a few hours. I stuck with SGL 52 because I got familiar with it. Towards the rut, I returned to a few places I found and had some success seeing deer. I only had a license for antlered deer last year. And I only saw one deer with more than two on a side, but couldn't take the shot. I saw plenty of fork bucks, but I was dumb and didn't fill out the pink slip correctly that year.
After the season, I scouted after a snowfall and found a doe bedding area.
Season three- I got a new job in a school and have to work the football games, so it's been hard to get up at 3, then drive out, hike in, etc. So this year, I haven't done a morning sit. I sat near the doe bedding area I found just to observe. I saw five doe one day at 2 pm and two forks the next week at 4 pm. On my third hunt, I tried a different part of the park, a steep drainage area, hiked 7 miles, found some rubs and fresh scat, and decided to sit by some oak trees for a few hours near the top of the mountain. Yesterday, my fourth day, I decided to see where the fork bucks were walking from, so I followed a deer trail down a sort of slice. I was sitting from 1-4, decided to hike down the mountain to see, then hiked back up, and someone was at my spot, lol. So I walked around for a bit, sat on a stump till dark, and drove home.
Season one- I sort of just walked around the woods a lot. I saw one buck.
Season two- I spent a lot of time walking and looking for rubs, scat, and bedding. Most days, I'd pick a place that looks ok and with a favorable wind and walk around for a few hours; then, if I found a favorable tree, I'd post up for a few hours. I stuck with SGL 52 because I got familiar with it. Towards the rut, I returned to a few places I found and had some success seeing deer. I only had a license for antlered deer last year. And I only saw one deer with more than two on a side, but couldn't take the shot. I saw plenty of fork bucks, but I was dumb and didn't fill out the pink slip correctly that year.
After the season, I scouted after a snowfall and found a doe bedding area.
Season three- I got a new job in a school and have to work the football games, so it's been hard to get up at 3, then drive out, hike in, etc. So this year, I haven't done a morning sit. I sat near the doe bedding area I found just to observe. I saw five doe one day at 2 pm and two forks the next week at 4 pm. On my third hunt, I tried a different part of the park, a steep drainage area, hiked 7 miles, found some rubs and fresh scat, and decided to sit by some oak trees for a few hours near the top of the mountain. Yesterday, my fourth day, I decided to see where the fork bucks were walking from, so I followed a deer trail down a sort of slice. I was sitting from 1-4, decided to hike down the mountain to see, then hiked back up, and someone was at my spot, lol. So I walked around for a bit, sat on a stump till dark, and drove home.
I see both of you are new and looking to get better, I like that! I know Greg made another post and I’m wondering if we could get some seasoned guys together for a discussion and maybe go over the topo of the area you two are hunting. It’s a lot to type, so I wonder if a video chat could be easier.
I would love that!
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If you are seeing deer, you are doing something right. Here is my advice. I looked at the topo map for the area and it seems to be hilly terrain. Find the creeks that run through the valleys. Follow these into the wind until you find deer feeding sign under oak trees. You may find acorns under a lot of the trees. Many will be untouched. You may have thousands of oaks in the area, but you are looking for the deer's preferred trees. You are looking for signs of disturbed leaves, tracks, notched acorn caps, acorns, and fresh deer poop under the drip line of the tree. If you find one hot tree you are set. These trees can also be found by sitting quietly and listening for dropping acorns and barking squirrels.
Set up and hunt over it the day you find it of as soon as possible. If I don't have a spot in mind, I will do this in the morning and walk until I find what I am looking for. Then I will hunt it that evening. Don't overthink things. If you don't find a hot tree, keep going until you do. Change locations if you have too.
Below is a video by Warren Womack. He is very successful in hunting on public land. Check out all his videos. This one shows you what you will be looking for. Once you learn what you are looking for, you will immediately recognize it when you see it. One tip is when you find a hot tree, note what elevation the tree is on and look along that elevation line for more trees. Often, trees will drop mast along the same elevation where trees 50 feet above or below will not.
(390) Primary Feed Tree - YouTube
Set up and hunt over it the day you find it of as soon as possible. If I don't have a spot in mind, I will do this in the morning and walk until I find what I am looking for. Then I will hunt it that evening. Don't overthink things. If you don't find a hot tree, keep going until you do. Change locations if you have too.
Below is a video by Warren Womack. He is very successful in hunting on public land. Check out all his videos. This one shows you what you will be looking for. Once you learn what you are looking for, you will immediately recognize it when you see it. One tip is when you find a hot tree, note what elevation the tree is on and look along that elevation line for more trees. Often, trees will drop mast along the same elevation where trees 50 feet above or below will not.
(390) Primary Feed Tree - YouTube
Thank you.
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You are welcome. Another word of advice is to shoot the first legal deer you have a good shot on. Too many people put unrealistic expectations on themselves, and it doesn't do them any good. Any deer with a bow is a trophy. You want to get a deer or two under your belt and get some experience. If it happens to be a big buck, all the better but a nice healthy doe is just as good. Also, remember to have fun. The world of the whitetail deer is constantly changing and if you want to be successful you have to learn to change and adapt with it throughout the season. Roll with the punches and enjoy the process. Good luck.
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I’m not great at killing deer but I’ve had some success as an out of stater in PA.
Womack has been mentioned and it’s worth a few reviews to then apply to where you hunt.
I’d encourage you to drive , an hour opens up some good state game lands (SGL) options in your state , prioritize hunting during the work week.
It’s been years since I have been to SE PA, but from memory it is a bit tough as you are wedged between populated areas and the ag land of Lancaster co . I’d look for small pieces that you can access in ways other than the big P for parking signs on game land maps
also look into DMAP permits , my understanding is these are areas designated as having high populations of Deer, either scientifically or arbitrarily; by the game commission , may help you connect the dots with sign- scouting - deer density
Text or PM the other member learning in your area, you both might encourage each other , share some info and success
good luck and keep at it you are already are headed in the right direction.
Womack has been mentioned and it’s worth a few reviews to then apply to where you hunt.
I’d encourage you to drive , an hour opens up some good state game lands (SGL) options in your state , prioritize hunting during the work week.
It’s been years since I have been to SE PA, but from memory it is a bit tough as you are wedged between populated areas and the ag land of Lancaster co . I’d look for small pieces that you can access in ways other than the big P for parking signs on game land maps
also look into DMAP permits , my understanding is these are areas designated as having high populations of Deer, either scientifically or arbitrarily; by the game commission , may help you connect the dots with sign- scouting - deer density
Text or PM the other member learning in your area, you both might encourage each other , share some info and success
good luck and keep at it you are already are headed in the right direction.
Tag me in here and I’ll be happy to type up some advice if I get a chance during lunch tomorrow. I’ve hunted south, central and now north Jersey throughout my entire life so I’m sure I have something that can translate over to help you. If you have an aerial map of where you’re hunting that would help. There is no easy button but I can probably show you where to put some boots on the ground.
Ok so here is my advice in generalities, you'll have to take it and adopt it to your specific area. For starters, as a beginner, you should never expect to be able to walk into woods that you have never been and shoot a deer. This may not be you but I'm throwing it out there in case youtube has given anyone that impression. Someday hopefully you'll develop that skill but let's start simple. Your first task is scouting. When should you scout? Realistically, all year long. Practically, once you are tagged out or the day the season ends should start your most invasive scouting. You want to find areas that have deer sign and explore as many nooks and crannies as you can. The more you understand an area the easier you can adapt as needed once the season starts. I understand it is too late for this for the current season so I recommend you do some less invasive scouting. I think you guys still don't have Sunday hunting so Sundays are a good day to scout. If you have to go midday on Saturday I will do that as well. If there is sign there are other hunters currently hunting I will move on to a different area so I don't disturb them if I'm out there on a hunting day. So what should you be scouting? The internet is full of advice but start simple. You want to find transition areas around thicker cover. Sometimes it will be from brush around a swamp, sometimes cattails around a marsh. Sometimes it will be a briar patch. This is the reason I asked for an aerial photo of where you are hunting. You can not pick out all of these areas on an aerial but you can find a bunch of them. Once you find them you have to put boots on the ground to walk the transition and look for deer sign. Once you have boots on the ground you will find other areas that you couldn't see on the map. As you are walking these transitions you will start to find things like rubs, scrapes, poop, tracks and trails. For now I would primarily focus on the trails/tracks/poop. That will show you that deer are using that area. Find a good spot along the transition and pick a tree that can cover the bulk of the sign to come back to. It is important to be along the transition because deer will often follow it. Now go find another one. Once you have 4 or 5 spots like this I would start rotating you sits through them. Don't worry about if you spooked the deer out of there. One trip through and they will come back for sure. I do like to try to scout just before rain if I can but that is a bonus. When you come back to hunt make sure you enter silently and set up your tree as silent as possible. It is ok to make some natural sounding noise but you don't want to be banging metal together. I'm a big fan of scentlok and reducing my scent footprint but if you are not doing that make sure the wind isn't blowing from your tree into the bedding area. You will not see deer every sit so do not get discouraged or give up on a spot because of that. Trust your scouting. I know some areas around here have a lot of open hardwoods or more open terrain in the hilly areas. If you are hunting an area like this I suggest you stay away from these areas and find the thicker areas I mention. Deer that bed in those areas have multiple advantages over you. The main reason I avoid hunting these areas anymore is that it is very hard to pattern the exact deer movement. If you are bowhunting you need the deer to walk through a 40 yard window around your tree. In open hardwoods there are too many paths of least resistance for the deer to follow and it is much harder to pin down there exact path on any given day. The spots that I do hunt in these areas are generally spots that I have narrowed down over time from many observations. Observation while you are in the stand is key. If you pick a tree and notice a trend in deer movement that is out of your range then you should consider moving. I don't necessarily move my spot based off a one time observation of movement but I see them do the same thing a second time you bet I'll be there the next time. As far as prepping for the rut, I'd still focus on these transition areas. The bucks will start cruising them for does and they are as good as anywhere to set up. If you can find a transition area that couples with a terrain feature that will force the deer to move within your bow range that only increases your odds. During the rut, if you see a buck chase a hot doe by out of range the first thing you should do as soon as you're sure they're gone is move within range of that trail. It is highly likely the doe is coming into estrous and another buck will pick up her trail and follow it. If you have to move, do it quick and be prepared. 11 years ago I had a monster run by me at 4 yards as I was trying to screw in a step. By the time I had my bow he was out of range. Last year I had a nice 8 pointer at 10 yards on the other side of my tree just as I was about to start up the new tree. This time I had my bow in hand but it was quiet and he just knew something was up. He turned around and walked off with brush between us the whole time. I shot one 2 days later in the same spot that is quite possibly the same deer.
I'm sorry if that ran on a bit. If anyone wants me to clarify on anything just let me know.
To the OP, it sounds like there are deer in your area. I would hang in there but probably do some scouting to get back on them. If you overhunt a spot you could push them out. That is why I recommend having a number of spots to rotate through. To me scouting is just as fun as hunting. I love finding new spots. The anticipation of hunting these spots is just as exciting as the hunt. The odds are against me that that spot will be the one I kill a buck in that year, but when it all comes together it is an awesome feeling. Over time you will build up enough spots and start to learn which ones are good and which ones aren't. They don't all pan out. The more time you do it the better you will be. You always want to shoot every deer you legally can. The only way to get good at shooting deer is to shoot deer. I used to suffer from buck fever really bad. I lost count of exactly how many deer I shot but I think I'm in the mid 90s at this point. I bet it took me until somewhere between deer 60-70 until I really started to get control of my buck fever. The point being... you gotta keep doing it to get good. I hope this helps!
I'm sorry if that ran on a bit. If anyone wants me to clarify on anything just let me know.
To the OP, it sounds like there are deer in your area. I would hang in there but probably do some scouting to get back on them. If you overhunt a spot you could push them out. That is why I recommend having a number of spots to rotate through. To me scouting is just as fun as hunting. I love finding new spots. The anticipation of hunting these spots is just as exciting as the hunt. The odds are against me that that spot will be the one I kill a buck in that year, but when it all comes together it is an awesome feeling. Over time you will build up enough spots and start to learn which ones are good and which ones aren't. They don't all pan out. The more time you do it the better you will be. You always want to shoot every deer you legally can. The only way to get good at shooting deer is to shoot deer. I used to suffer from buck fever really bad. I lost count of exactly how many deer I shot but I think I'm in the mid 90s at this point. I bet it took me until somewhere between deer 60-70 until I really started to get control of my buck fever. The point being... you gotta keep doing it to get good. I hope this helps!
This made me think of a couple other things to add.
1. I'm giving you advice that I think will help you kill any deer, not necessarily a buck.
2. If you get a group of seasoned hunters together, they are likely to have some things they agree on. They are also more likely to have more things that they strongly disagree on. That is ok, there is more than one way to do this. In the end everyone has to take whatever knowledge is out there and learn to apply it to their own experiences to develop their own methods. That is why I say shoot as many deer as you can and spend as much time scouting and hunting as you can because nothing can truly replace the experiences. A good example is you don't know exactly when and how much movement you can get away with when a buck is standing 5 yards from your tree until you've lived it
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This @redsquirrel fella should write a book! Listen to him, he seems to do ok filling the freezer.
I grew up hunting in Pa and still do today and it is rough on public land but to be successful year after year and it takes some time to learn an area let alone learn to hunt effectively. Don’t get too frustrated, you are seeing deer which a lot of people on Pa public don’t even do. I have a buddy that hunts exclusively public lands and hunts for his buck hard one week out of the year and brags about getting it after only a few sits. What he doesn’t mention is he is a great hunter, I have been hunting with him since we were kids, he also spends more time in the woods than most people spend on their couch. His rule of thumb is easy. Find sign and hunt it. His last two bucks on public land (that get hammered with hunters) were taken less than 1/4 mile from his truck and both were wall hangers. He spends a lot of time walking around small game hunting with his dog and looking for deer sigh.
on public land find the Doe, you have done that. The buck will be there soon enough. Find some heavily used trails between food and bedding areas and set up on them. In a few weeks those heavily used trails will be highways for bucks finding doe. Right now it’s better to walk around and find these areas rather than sit all day in an area you are not sure about. Spend the last hour and first hour of the day sitting on sign.
Think about those doe you found, where were they coming from? Where were they headed? What time did you see them? Figure out where they might be going to bed or to feed and start plotting out their route. Every doe finds a buck sometime thru the rutt, every buck finds a few doe. Stay with the doe and the bucks will be looking for them just like you.
I shoot half my deer out of a tree and the other half while walking around. I like to sneak and scout and spend the rut in a tree on main deer highway and around areas of high doe density. I love it when it rains, sneaking thru the woods on a rainy day can be a great way to get close to bedding areas without making much noise. I play the wind everywhere I go, try to never let the wind touch the back of your neck while you are walking. Sneaking up and over ridges to see down the other side, don’t skyline yourself. Walk up deep creek beds and pop up to look around every 50 yards. Pay attention to heavily used trails and what they connect. Spotlighting can be fun and what else are you doing after hours.
always remember, you can’t beat a deers nose.
I grew up hunting in Pa and still do today and it is rough on public land but to be successful year after year and it takes some time to learn an area let alone learn to hunt effectively. Don’t get too frustrated, you are seeing deer which a lot of people on Pa public don’t even do. I have a buddy that hunts exclusively public lands and hunts for his buck hard one week out of the year and brags about getting it after only a few sits. What he doesn’t mention is he is a great hunter, I have been hunting with him since we were kids, he also spends more time in the woods than most people spend on their couch. His rule of thumb is easy. Find sign and hunt it. His last two bucks on public land (that get hammered with hunters) were taken less than 1/4 mile from his truck and both were wall hangers. He spends a lot of time walking around small game hunting with his dog and looking for deer sigh.
on public land find the Doe, you have done that. The buck will be there soon enough. Find some heavily used trails between food and bedding areas and set up on them. In a few weeks those heavily used trails will be highways for bucks finding doe. Right now it’s better to walk around and find these areas rather than sit all day in an area you are not sure about. Spend the last hour and first hour of the day sitting on sign.
Think about those doe you found, where were they coming from? Where were they headed? What time did you see them? Figure out where they might be going to bed or to feed and start plotting out their route. Every doe finds a buck sometime thru the rutt, every buck finds a few doe. Stay with the doe and the bucks will be looking for them just like you.
I shoot half my deer out of a tree and the other half while walking around. I like to sneak and scout and spend the rut in a tree on main deer highway and around areas of high doe density. I love it when it rains, sneaking thru the woods on a rainy day can be a great way to get close to bedding areas without making much noise. I play the wind everywhere I go, try to never let the wind touch the back of your neck while you are walking. Sneaking up and over ridges to see down the other side, don’t skyline yourself. Walk up deep creek beds and pop up to look around every 50 yards. Pay attention to heavily used trails and what they connect. Spotlighting can be fun and what else are you doing after hours.
always remember, you can’t beat a deers nose.
Thank you to everyone. Your advice means a lot to me, one day I'll explain it. Anyhow. You've convinced me to do some scouting after work tomorrow, that'll give me 1.5 to 2 hours at French Creek State Park. It's about 20 minutes east of where I normally hunt, bigger, with less pressure.
I just took a quick look on onX. Not much helpful on the aerial they have of that place to narrow it down. It looks pretty hilly. I’d focus on trying to find bedding cover up on the bluffs and hunt the transitions as I described. It’s definitely going to be a boots on the ground place to find those spots. You can focus on terrain features like points and saddles but I would expect that is where a lot of hunters go because it’s easy to recognize on the map.
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At the end of the day fellas, this is hunting not shooting. Learning the woods is something few people do anymore, not because of any other reason than it’s hard work. Keep putting in the effort and it will happen. Just make sure you enjoy it along the way. A hunt doesn’t need to be successful to bag a deer. Gaining knowledge and learning to hunt in hard areas like PA public woods separate you from the one day/first day guys that get lucky because someone smoking a cigar up the valley on Nov 26th spooked some buck off his bed into them. 90% or more hunters in PA get their deer based on luck and being in the right place at the right time and they couldn't tell why they were sitting there except that they sit there every year or it’s grandpas old spot. Then there is the other 10%. You are becoming a woodsman and a hunter, it doesn’t happen over night, it doesn’t happen every hunt but it will happen and the more time you spend in the woods learning, the more frequently you will come across deer.
i hunt with some great hunters. True hunters. I watched from a hillside as a new hunter my dad track a deer in archery quietly and efficiently. He didn’t realize I could see him from where I was. It took him 2 hours to go 100 yards and I watched the deer in front of him walking along like there was no one behind them. When he finally got close to them he leaned up against a tree and watch them for an hour. I being young wondered what the heck he was doing. They moved along and I met up with him after dark and asked why he didn’t shoot one. He said well… I smelled deer, got the wind right and wanted to see how close I could get. It wasn’t until I was within 30 yards of them that I actually realized they were there and saw them and I just wanted to enjoy watching the deer my nose led me too. This is coming from a guy that filled the freezer because we had too to survive, not because he wanted to. Enjoying the moment is a successful hunt. It is lesson that took me a long time to learn.
i hunt with some great hunters. True hunters. I watched from a hillside as a new hunter my dad track a deer in archery quietly and efficiently. He didn’t realize I could see him from where I was. It took him 2 hours to go 100 yards and I watched the deer in front of him walking along like there was no one behind them. When he finally got close to them he leaned up against a tree and watch them for an hour. I being young wondered what the heck he was doing. They moved along and I met up with him after dark and asked why he didn’t shoot one. He said well… I smelled deer, got the wind right and wanted to see how close I could get. It wasn’t until I was within 30 yards of them that I actually realized they were there and saw them and I just wanted to enjoy watching the deer my nose led me too. This is coming from a guy that filled the freezer because we had too to survive, not because he wanted to. Enjoying the moment is a successful hunt. It is lesson that took me a long time to learn.