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Trust issues

MattMan81 said:
I am pretty amazed at the percentage from ladder stands. Maybe it's a false security.
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What exactly would make you consider a ladder stand safer?

I always had in the back of my mind that it's a single ratchet strap holding the whole thing on that sits out in the elements quite a bit. I also find the transition from the ladder onto the platform section awkward and could definitely see a chance to lose your balance and fall there.

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The other thing too is there are bad people out there. A friend had all his straps cut almost all the way thru on private land. He notice it before he started to climb. It could have been bad. So it's a good idea to check things out if you leave your stuff in the woods.
 
re: pie chart above and percentages- i wonder if those charts reflect more "percentage of hunters that use this type of equiment" than anything else and accidents/ human error are relatively consistent throughout the types of hunter/stand? regardless of the percentages, a safety first mindset goes a long way- especially small stuff like always having a second tether/ LB to go around tree limbs instead of climbing without one for " just a second", or staying clipped in to your safety harness/ saddle at all times at height, or checking your ropes and knots o nthe ground before climbing and the like. as far as modding equipment goes- yeah, that's your own risk. I dont think i could modify something and then sell it, or buy something modded that my life may depend on, but that's jsut me, we all accept certain risks simply by hunting or climbing a tree (even with stock, unmodded stuff). use backups if it makes you feel safer, just make sure that they can't tangle and somehow make you LESS safe, and practice with them so they don't get in the way when you want to take a shot.
 
rutjr said:
The other thing too is there are bad people out there. A friend had all his straps cut almost all the way thru on private land. He notice it before he started to climb. It could have been bad. So it's a good idea to check things out if you leave your stuff in the woods.
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One of the most significant reasons I wish to give saddle hunting a try.
Can't steal or sabotage whats not there
I lease land most years and have encountered unpleasent situations with people who had hunted the land in years past 90%+ never with permission
Once I lease land with the permission of the land owner I now thoroughly post it as leaving no doubt its now off limits learned the hard way on that one
Ever since I hunted my first piece of private land I made it a point if at all possible to meet and introduce myself to the neighboring land owners and exchange ph#s 95% of the time such meetings went well but the other 5% not so much
Because I once encountered a ladder stand having been cut loose and removed from the tree and damaged badly enough to ruin it I now make a point to do a stand check of all my ladder stands prior to using them and for years now lock my hang ons to the tree and leave the bottom 4-5 tree steps out
I also post signs saying property under 7/24/365 trail cam surveillance and yes I actually put trail cams up for security and especially well hidden ones covering roads that give access to the lease
Some trespassers are smart enough to cover their faces but most don't cover their vehicle plates and you can not disguise a vehicle type.
Sad state of affairs we live in today
 
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DroptineKrazy said:
I don't think they really trust the strap holding their tree stand on. Most people do wear a safety harness.
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Yes and no
I feel based on my experience that a significant % of hunters trust their stands attachment systems for at least some of thier hunts and admittedly not often but at least for small portions of thier time on stand.
My best guess us 65-70% of the people I know who hunt out of elevated tree stands wear a FAS of some type MOST but not all of the time how often they don't I'm not sure but by their own admission its more than 1x a season
Also based on my asking about 30% of my friends and at least some other hunters I've asked do not use a safety line along with a linemans while ascending and descending from their tree stands and I asked if that means that for the moment when the risk of falling is greatest when you transition from your climbing system to thier stand thay aren't tied off as they have no safety rope so they must be on stand to attach thier FAS to the tree most avoided answering me directly yes or no.

It is only my opinion but I feel the only reason there aren't far more falls from treestands every year is nothing more than blind dumb luck. As at least half the people I have spoken to over the last 5 maybe 7 years admitted to me that forgetting to bring thier FAS/FBS wouldn't stop them from hunting which to me indicates at least sometimes they hunt without a FAS of and kind.

I once hunted without any FAS of any kind then 27 or 28 years ago I had what was best described as an "Significant Emotional Event" while climbing a huge multi trunked shag bark hickory and I exaggerate not one sintilla it was a small miracle I emerged from that "Event" with nothing more than the worst bunch of scratches in my life and a few slivers. Once on the ground the reality of the bullet I just dodged set in
I would have fallen over 20 feet hit several stout branches on my way down
It had been a very cold the last two weeks and the top few inches of ground was frozen as hard as a packed gravel road
The high of that day wasn't even above 30* and the low that night was going to be in the high teens
Cell phones weren't a factor then so I had no way to summon help
I was well over a mile in any direction from any home
I was single and hunting alone no one knew where I was or even how to find me
No one would've noticed I had failed to return to my motel room
I had no ability with me to start a fire
In short if after the fall if my injuries were bad enough and odds are they more likely than not they would've been and I couldn't get back to my truck my odds of survival were at best VERY grim.
I no longer hunt without a FAS
3-4 years ago transitioned from a FBH to a REI rock climbing harness that serves also as my linemans attachment
I have gone so far as to buy my friends who hunt really good Hunters Safety Systems FBH's and most tell me they wear them but sadly a few do not sighting they use climbing stands or ladder stands and don't need a FBH.
I can only pray the odds don't one day catch up with them
 
The most important thing is your safety. End of story. The only person responsible for your safety is you. You need to do what ever it takes to gain the confidence by being in the saddle as much as possible. Dont worry about how many hours or sits you have, worry about doing and learn what it takes make you safe and comfortable with the gear you choose for your setup. We can all offer pointers and stats but only can build your setup and learn how to safely use use it. Dont get complacent, know your gear, always inspect every piece of life safety equipment BEFORE you put your safety on the line! Be safe happy hanging, and just get out there, now is a great time to set up a cold weather setup for your style!
 
ThePennsylvanian said:
The most important thing is your safety. End of story. The only person responsible for your safety is you. You need to do what ever it takes to gain the confidence by being in the saddle as much as possible. Dont worry about how many hours or sits you have, worry about doing and learn what it takes make you safe and comfortable with the gear you choose for your setup. We can all offer pointers and stats but only can build your setup and learn how to safely use use it. Dont get complacent, know your gear, always inspect every piece of life safety equipment BEFORE you put your safety on the line! Be safe happy hanging, and just get out there, now is a great time to set up a cold weather setup for your style!
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People can get so familiar that they get sloppy. I watched a youtube video (will post link later if I can find it) about a parachutist that filmed other jumpers. He was so familiar/complacent/can't happen to him that he put his battery pack on his back thought it was his parachute and jumped out without it. I didn't watch the video but he basically filmed himself all the way down. I bet he'd been jumping for years.
 
rutjr said:
The other thing too is there are bad people out there. A friend had all his straps cut almost all the way thru on private land. He notice it before he started to climb. It could have been bad. So it's a good idea to check things out if you leave your stuff in the woods.
Click to expand...
I have seen this as well, people get ugly and sabotage stands. Its really a shame.
 
thedutchtouch said:
re: pie chart above and percentages- i wonder if those charts reflect more "percentage of hunters that use this type of equiment" than anything else and accidents/ human error are relatively consistent throughout the types of hunter/stand? regardless of the percentages, a safety first mindset goes a long way- especially small stuff like always having a second tether/ LB to go around tree limbs instead of climbing without one for " just a second", or staying clipped in to your safety harness/ saddle at all times at height, or checking your ropes and knots o nthe ground before climbing and the like. as far as modding equipment goes- yeah, that's your own risk. I dont think i could modify something and then sell it, or buy something modded that my life may depend on, but that's jsut me, we all accept certain risks simply by hunting or climbing a tree (even with stock, unmodded stuff). use backups if it makes you feel safer, just make sure that they can't tangle and somehow make you LESS safe, and practice with them so they don't get in the way when you want to take a shot.
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The stats in the articles did not correlate the data to number of people using a particular method. They simply categorized the accidents by type and activity. The articles intend to stress the importance of using a safety harness at height and a safety line when climbing. Stats show that there are still many people that don’t and they roll the dice every time they leave the ground.
I found the ascending / descending fall stats very eye opening since those apply to saddle hunting also.
 
I think the only time I got nervous was the first time I used a piece of Amsteel for my tether. It was no bigger than a pencil lead under load.. I finally ditched it for a larger diameter lower quality rope that my eye found acceptable.
 
poorcharlie said:
I’m definitely hooked on saddle hunting. I started at the tail end of this season and I’m still struggling with confidence in hanging from ropes/carabiners and being supported by mesh and webbing. I’ve got about 22 hr in the saddle so far. Hopefully the conference comes with experience. It feels better to lean as it doesn’t feel like all my weight is on the saddle and tether but sitting is nice when my feet and legs need a break. Anyone else have these struggles starting out?
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I believe as you learn to trust your equipment, it’ll get better. I used to feel that way about hang on stands. I go from the climbing stick to the stand and be half shaking from fear of the 1” strap eventually giving out, but honestly I never had that in the saddle. From the minute I strapped one on and hooked to that tether, I felt a calm knowing that barring catastrophic failure there is not much of a way to fall. My wife started hunting with me a couple years ago and she liked the two man ladder stand. She refused to get into one of our hang on stands. She took to saddles quickly and started hanging upside down and swinging back and forth like a kid her first time in one.
 
Mike Curtis said:
I think the only time I got nervous was the first time I used a piece of Amsteel for my tether. It was no bigger than a pencil lead under load.. I finally ditched it for a larger diameter lower quality rope that my eye found acceptable.
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It’s funny you say that, I was a little freaked out about oplux the first time I tried it, I badly wanted to go back to my sterling HTP 10mm... my dump pouch space thanks me for going to the 8mm though
 
I was having issues with the sharp bend out on by carabiners. I bought a petzl roller carabiner and that solved that problem for me. Secondly I did not trust amsteel as a bridge. I know it’s strong, I don’t like how it looks. I moved to a fixed bridge with 2 sewn eyes and use petzl rings to secure it to my loops. Now that everything is ridiculously over rated I feel the safest I’ve felt. It’s more equipment but the feeling of safe is worth the .25 lb of weight gain


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ShortFuse said:
I was having issues with the sharp bend out on by carabiners. I bought a petzl roller carabiner and that solved that problem for me. Secondly I did not trust amsteel as a bridge. I know it’s strong, I don’t like how it looks. I moved to a fixed bridge with 2 sewn eyes and use petzl rings to secure it to my loops. Now that everything is ridiculously over rated I feel the safest I’ve felt. It’s more equipment but the feeling of safe is worth the .25 lb of weight gain


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What's your bridge made out of? Did you repurpose a hitch cord? Length and diameter?
 
ShortFuse said:
I’m using kermantle static 11mm as bridge with 2 sewn eyes and petzl rings to attach to loops


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Did you have it sewn for you custom? What's the length?

I'm considering tying a non-adjustable bridge on mine. I hardly ever change anything on it.
 
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