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Some climbing spike questions answered on video!

Great video of mechanics and techniques....I wish I had the back to do it. Thanks for tutelage.


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The reason that this West Virginia hillbilly makes it look so easy in this video is because it is that easy. Practice and trust. Too many times the beginner tries to make the spurs work. Put the spur against the tree at the correct angle and stand up on it. If @flinginairos can do it....... anyone can. Great video Jared.
 
huck72412 said:
The reason that this West Virginia hillbilly makes it look so easy in this video is because it is that easy. Practice and trust. Too many times the beginner tries to make the spurs work. Put the spur against the tree at the correct angle and stand up on it. If @flinginairos can do it....... anyone can. Great video Jared.
Click to expand...

Yep! It really is easy as walking up the tree. If you can climb a ladder you can climb with spikes!


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Watched this one today. Top notch.

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We’ve needed a video on climbing w spurs that really covers it all, and you my friend did it! Great video thanks for the motivation!


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@flinginairos great video! It really shows how quiet and easy they are to use.

I don’t use them because of the potential effects to the tree. I just want to point out the potential issue they can have, I can remember learning about it in Dendrology and Forest Ecology in collge, and what factors effect the potential damage. Anytime you puncture the cambium layer (the only living part of the tree just below the bark), you have to be concerned with two things, Disease and Insects.
So, the factors that can effect the severity of the potential damage to the tree are
The time of year- Spring and summer will “heal” over faster than winter/fall. Longer the wound is exposed the more potential for insect/disease infestation.
The species of the tree- Some trees heal faster, some are more resistant to damage.
The size of the hole (depth does not matter)- How wide or tall the hole is, this is the amount of cambium is exposed, most things sub like 1/2” will “heal” in one growing season depending on some factor listed here.
Angle of the wounds- upward, perpendicular, downward, in order from least to most potential for issues.
Growth ring size- Thicker growth rings(longer growing season or better soil) the better, thinner growth rings(shorter growing season or poor soil) not so good. Growth rings can also be effected by where a tree is growing or if it is leaning. Typically the down hill or side that the tree is leaning to, will have thicker growth rings on that side. The uphill side or the side it is leaning from will have smaller growth rings. The growth rings will effect the “healing” rate.

Tree’s don’t heal like we do. We get a cut, our skin will scab then heal (return to function). A tree will develop something similar to a cyst, it will seal off the damaged area but it will never return to function.

Looking at that, as hunters using spurs for the most part, we put the worst angle of hole, in the worst time of year and if on a leaning trees on the worst side of the tree. So all this means is we have increased the likely hood of said tree to become exposed to disease and insect infestation.

It’s a lot like skinning/handling animals without gloves, some will accept the risk for potential diseases, some won’t.

It’s up to each person to make a decision on private lands.

Thanks,
Boswell
 
Boudreaux said:
@flinginairos great video! It really shows how quiet and easy they are to use.

I don’t use them because of the potential effects to the tree. I just want to point out the potential issue they can have, I can remember learning about it in Dendrology and Forest Ecology in collge, and what factors effect the potential damage. Anytime you puncture the cambium layer (the only living part of the tree just below the bark), you have to be concerned with two things, Disease and Insects.
So, the factors that can effect the severity of the potential damage to the tree are
The time of year- Spring and summer will “heal” over faster than winter/fall. Longer the wound is exposed the more potential for insect/disease infestation.
The species of the tree- Some trees heal faster, some are more resistant to damage.
The size of the hole (depth does not matter)- How wide or tall the hole is, this is the amount of cambium is exposed, most things sub like 1/2” will “heal” in one growing season depending on some factor listed here.
Angle of the wounds- upward, perpendicular, downward, in order from least to most potential for issues.
Growth ring size- Thicker growth rings(longer growing season or better soil) the better, thinner growth rings(shorter growing season or poor soil) not so good. Growth rings can also be effected by where a tree is growing or if it is leaning. Typically the down hill or side that the tree is leaning to, will have thicker growth rings on that side. The uphill side or the side it is leaning from will have smaller growth rings. The growth rings will effect the “healing” rate.

Tree’s don’t heal like we do. We get a cut, our skin will scab then heal (return to function). A tree will develop something similar to a cyst, it will seal off the damaged area but it will never return to function.

Looking at that, as hunters using spurs for the most part, we put the worst angle of hole, in the worst time of year and if on a leaning trees on the worst side of the tree. So all this means is we have increased the likely hood of said tree to become exposed to disease and insect infestation.

It’s a lot like skinning/handling animals without gloves, some will accept the risk for potential diseases, some won’t.

It’s up to each person to make a decision on private lands.

Thanks,
Boswell
Click to expand...

Thanks for that Info that’s good stuff to know!! Like I said in the video, that is a call you have to make yourself and do what feels right to you. Got a question for you that I have been curious about because I see it a lot, what kind of damage does a strap/chain do that is left on a tree to the point that it starts to grow around it? I see it all the time on public land where guys leave stands up for years.


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I don't disagree with Boswell but I know I have done worse damage with a climbing tree stand.

Even my saddle platform can leave a nasty cut into the layer.

Not to mention damage done with tree steps, tree bolts, bow/pack hangers, ratchet strap camera bases, poor cuts with a hand saw, etc.

All are vectors for disease and insects.

It's tough to be perfect. Agree that one needs to use their own judgement. It's tough to walk through the woods without stepping on living things.

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Ontariofarmer said:
I wish they were legal. Great video.


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Hi Ontario,
Hope you had a nice Easter. I just tried a search on the MNR site trying to find info on using Spurs. Nothing came up. Do you know the site?



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flinginairos said:
Thanks for that Info that’s good stuff to know!! Like I said in the video, that is a call you have to make yourself and do what feels right to you. Got a question for you that I have been curious about because I see it a lot, what kind of damage does a strap/chain do that is left on a tree to the point that it starts to grow around it? I see it all the time on public land where guys leave stands up for years.


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Click to expand...

That will girdle the tree. Same as a tourniquet on your leg that gets tighter and tighter over time. It cuts off the circulation and eventually it kills it. When you see the tree growing around the chain, it's close to killing it. The tree may survive if a portion of its circumference is not girdled. For instance if the chain is only grown into the tree half way around, but it may significantly weaken the tree and make it susceptible to disease and loss of canopy.


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BassBoysLLP said:
I don't believe they are prohibited in Ontario on crown lands.

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I hunt within 15 miles of home and they are prohibited on all the public land available to me - Conservation areas and provincial park reserves. I also hunt some private land including my own farm. Presets with bolts work great at home.

Maybe they are legal on crown land in Ontario but there is no crown land in my area. Mostly private farms, conservation areas and provincial park reserves.
I suppose if I had never asked then then may be allowed because I have never seen it in writing anywhere but I did ask.
I think even climbing sticks when they tighten up and slide against a tree do damage. These same lands that I hunt on have nailed on wooden stands everywhere too, which are much worse. Nothing is ever done about these stands. O well. Spurs look great and I was certainly tempted to us them but will not.
 
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They just look like they'd be a blast to use.


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flinginairos said:
Got a question for you that I have been curious about because I see it a lot, what kind of damage does a strap/chain do that is left on a tree to the point that it starts to grow around it?
Click to expand...
Good question, there is actually a term for that, its called edaphoecotropism when a tree grows around a foreign object. You see this a lot with old fences that have a tree grown around them. Because this a slow process, its not as bad for the tree as a puncture wound. My understanding it engulfs the foreign object with out exposing it the object to the cambium layer.
The worst thing that can happen is to try and remove the object after it is been partially engulfed, this could damage the tree and expose the cambium layer.
This is why most states where spikes and screw in steps are not allowed also have something about not leaving tree stands out all year.

BassBoysLLP said:
I know I have done worse damage with a climbing tree stand.

Even my saddle platform can leave a nasty cut into the layer.

Not to mention damage done with tree steps, tree bolts, bow/pack hangers, ratchet strap camera bases, poor cuts with a hand saw, etc.

All are vectors for disease and insects.

It's tough to be perfect. Agree that one needs to use their own judgement. It's tough to walk through the woods without stepping on living things.
Click to expand...

It’s impossile to be perfect. While climbing stands are not designed to puncture into the cambium layer, they can depending on the tree and the bark, the same with your platform. Spikes are designed to puncture though the cambium layer of the tree. You are correct, everything you listed above is exposing the tree for potential infection. It is up to each person to make that decision for themselves on what is acceptable.
To me, 2-3 holes for screw in hangers at a bad time of the year in a perpendicular hole is acceptable risk of possible infection to trees in my deer habitat. While adding and additional 10-15 in that tree with spurs, in the bad time of year and the worst angle is not.

It is up to each person to make the decision for themselves, I just try to give them more information to make the best decision that they can.

Thanks,
Boswell
 
fawnzy said:
Hi Ontario,
Hope you had a nice Easter. I just tried a search on the MNR site trying to find info on using Spurs. Nothing came up. Do you know the site?



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I will try to find that site. Had a great Easter with family and friends


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