I would definitely make the switch to two blade heads. Given your setup, I wouldn't prioritize maximizing cutting surface over minimizing energy required to penetrate the target.
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Lack of penetration has me going to a two blade.
- Thread starter Flee
- Start date
I would definitely make the switch to two blade heads. Given your setup, I wouldn't prioritize maximizing cutting surface over minimizing energy required to penetrate the target.
I think two blade could definitely make for better results. A lot easier to slip between stuff and less energy lost upon impact, especially if it’s fixed.
Last year I had a shot on a buck with poor penetration. My arrow penetrated 10 inches which was enough to get both lungs( shot was also a little high but at my saddle height and the range I thought it was a good shot) but no exit wound. My deer made it about 125 yds maybe and I found him the next morning. I also fixed my arrows going to a Victory VAP 250, a Masai 200gr single bevel, Ethics outsert and footer, TAW about 700gr. I hunt 20yds and in with 2 kills at 25yds over 30 years of bow hunting. I have a Bowtech Reign 6 at 70#s with a 27 inch draw. I think your line of thought is on track.
I was talking to a blood tracker the other day, his take on this would be simple. During our conversation his perspective was: "People try to show off to their friends on how good of a shot they are by putting it right in the crease. Lungs are huge, stay off the shoulder. They would be better off center punching a deer and coming back in the morning, way less likely to lose a deer."
The heavy arrow thing goes along with preaching "vital V". Yeah, a high heart/low lung shot is ideal, but I think your line of thinking makes a lot of sense.
I think you are fine with what you got, just bad luck on that shot. Lungs are huge, don't crowd the shoulder.
I used to use 2 pins, 20 and 40 and did just fine. Now I shoot a recurve with no pins. 39lbs@30" and I'm shooting a vpa 3 blade. 545gr and around 175fps. Let the book worms do the math, but I have no concerns out to 30yds.
@Nutterbuster is my spirit animal. My noodle/twizzlers keep blowing through and passing through deer as well. And even with a Rage
Depends on the definition of "centerpunch." Center of the vitals? Absolutely. Center of the body increasing the odds of a slower, messier recovery? That's not necessarily great either, whether from a meat quality/spoilage perspective or from a recovery perspective, depending on e.g. weather, landownership distribution, availability of trackers, etc.
Both are probably overreactions to competing tendencies. If you give someone a bow and tell them to shoot a deer, maybe with a quick overview of where the vitals are, there's a natural tendency to aim a bit far back, especially with the odd angle that creates that "vital V" in the first place. If you then identify this as well as the gap further forward that people are needlessly avoiding...then you start preaching to pull the aim point further forward.
If you go to either extreme, you for sure would want to adjust your arrow setup accordingly. And there's a good chance that the best way to go is a middle ground, not crowding the shoulder but avoiding the natural tendency to center everything.
No way I can shoot a huge cut rage with my arrow speed. Even if I were shooting a 375gr total arrow weight and my speed increased the KE and momentum wouldn’t be enough for those expandables. End for me 1 or 2 out of every 10 guys have a horror story with blades breaking off. I’m not knocking those that use them at all but for me I like the security of fixed blades.@Nutterbuster is my spirit animal. My noodle/twizzlers keep blowing through and passing through deer as well. And even with a Rage
You mean you're not gonna switch to...
Rage X-treme 4-Blade | Rage Broadheads
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That is the key. It's all about the equipment and situation. I'm pulling 66lbs with a 414 gr arrow going about 280 fps shooting smaller deer in the South. I have even tested this on five Illinois deer and it has worked with perfect pass throughs.
He did say that a few inches off the shoulder was best, but as far as losing deer goes, center of the deer is better than a shoulder hit. Yes there are a lot of implications, but this is from a guy in Michigan where most nights in the hunting season are 45 degrees or colder.
I didn't say "center punch", but I'd have to assume they meant "center punch the vitals". Center of the deer would put you in the stomach, which is probably the worst hit imaginable (at least the small intestine has a lot of blood vessels to absorb nutrients and so they will at least bleed to death in a few hours). The blue circle is what I would consider "center punching", which is just on the backside of the "vital v". That circle is where I instinctively aim on broadside deer. Really, I could've extended it back a bit also.
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@Flee, how many deer have you lost total and how did you lose each one? How many have you successfully killed?
Lost deer are part of the game. No predator on earth has a 100% success rate. Sometimes you have to just not let it get in your head and shoot another deer
Lost deer are part of the game. No predator on earth has a 100% success rate. Sometimes you have to just not let it get in your head and shoot another deer
Absolutely. A gut shot deer is a dead deer. Unless you have serious coyote issues, as long as you don't go in too soon and bump the deer, and don't get the trail rained/snowed over, you stand a good chance of recovery (especially with a dog...without one the blood trail may be a challenge) as the deer will not go far if not pushed. It's gonna bed down.
My wife and her cousin, within the past few years, have both hit deer a bit back where coyotes were on the trail in under an hour. Her shot was liver and a lung, and recovered in fairly short order (with a bite outta the ham). His wasn't recovered as the coyotes bumped the deer enough that the trail was lost, and he couldn't get a callback from any trackers.
A shoulder-hit deer may survive, and recovery can be an absolute nightmare of course.
It's a game of telephone, but the guy you quoted was quoting a guy who used the term, and also alluded to waiting overnight, and the center of the deer.
I realize it’s part of the game. I’ve lost 3-4 over the years. I’ve killed a bunch over the years. I think my biggest issue is that I thought a good fixed head would still have gotten enough penetration through the shoulder if I was a little forward and hit it.(which I did). At least enough to have made a kill.
I think a lot of people in the next season or two are gonna realize that hype is hype. Whether it's saddles, scent lok, heavy arrows, expensive high-carbon steel broadheads, whatever. Nothing guarantees success.
Take them arrows and stick another deer a little further back! Roll tide and all that!
Jake from THP lost one to a shoulder hit after they've been preaching heavy arrow over the last couple of years, blamed part of it on the broadhead curling over.... Not saying I've never done anything wrong, but a shoulder isn't a good idea, no matter what arrow setup you're using.
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