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2TC guys… rappel or not?
- Thread starter dramsey25
- Start date
I 2TC down now 100%. I played around with rappel early on, but I hated fooling with the quick link and all that extra rope and don't even get me started on a pull-down rope, lol. The climb down is easier and faster than the climb up since you have gravity working for you on the way down. The trick is to make the same 18 or so inch moves and not try to go to fast. Also, on the way down make sure to not let the top tether overlap the foot tether or you can't move it and have to reposition. You get the hang of it pretty fast.
I'm pretty interested to see the stats. Wonder if the metrics change over time. I.e., I imagine there are some (myself included) who started off rappelling and then ended up ditching the rappel gear for whatever reason in favor of 2TC down.
Boom. My point exactly. @NMSbowhunter beat me by a minute.
2TC back down for me, rappel was intriguing, but I was waiting to spend the money on it and after hearing @NMSbowhunter and others ditch their rappel setup in favor of strictly 2TC I decided I could use the funds I would have spent on a rappel setup on something more useful
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Rappel, rappel, rappel.
Get the half-line system, or modify your current system to match it and save yourself a lot of headache. Climbing on a long tether using a belay/descent devices gives you a quick way to the ground is something bad happens, or you need a emergency bathroom visit. If you have SRT gear you can get back up easier to where you left off.
Leave a preset when you come out of the tree so you can SRT back up it if you hunt that tree again. New trees I 2TC the first time unless its easy to get a throwball in a crotch, then SRT it the next time. Having both systems in the pack doesnt hurt you weight wise anyways. For 2TC all you would be doing is adding a hand ascender, which I also use for 2TC. For SRT its really nothing to carry the footloop tether in case you're paracord loop came out of the tree or you want to move a tree over.
Get the half-line system, or modify your current system to match it and save yourself a lot of headache. Climbing on a long tether using a belay/descent devices gives you a quick way to the ground is something bad happens, or you need a emergency bathroom visit. If you have SRT gear you can get back up easier to where you left off.
Leave a preset when you come out of the tree so you can SRT back up it if you hunt that tree again. New trees I 2TC the first time unless its easy to get a throwball in a crotch, then SRT it the next time. Having both systems in the pack doesnt hurt you weight wise anyways. For 2TC all you would be doing is adding a hand ascender, which I also use for 2TC. For SRT its really nothing to carry the footloop tether in case you're paracord loop came out of the tree or you want to move a tree over.
Do you have a picture of your set up? I'm familiar with most of what you mentioned but what is a half-line? Also, you are carrying a(multiple?) throwball with you? Are you carrying a throw cube? How much line?
When I was doing DRT, I found I needed at least 2 throwballs to get over tricky limbs, isolate a limb or most importantly, unstick the first throw ball.
I typically rappel. I bring 50ft of 8mm rope with two WLR hitches that live on it everywhere I go incase I want to rope climb a tree. I also use it as a pull up rope, 1 end for my bag, 1 end for my bow. I typically tie an alpine butterfly loop near center and then use a carabiner to connect to itself. The other half of the rope is used to pull it down after rappel. I can 2TC down extremely easily but find myself rappelling a good percent of the time since I already have stuff out.
Ill get a picture later.
Half-line system is 30ft of 8 or 9mm rope, a sterling F4 device, and paracord/dynaglide. The climb rope has attachement points at the loop end and the tail end so you can attach the paracord/dynaglide so you can make the rope longer for pulling it up the tree so you dont need 60 feet to go 30ft high. The attachment point of the loop end is for your pull down rope.
You can replace the rope sizes/devices with if you already have the grigri/madrock.
Heres a video of it:
As for the throwballs, if i'm cold rolling a hunt, ill have 60ft of paracord and one throwball. Im only looking for easy crotches to SRT in that situation.
Prehunt scouting/setting up trees, Im bringing 2 throwballs, 100-150 of line and maybe my extension pole
Rappell down all the time. I use a different tether for climbing and the actual hunt
Ok, yes, I saw that video when it came out and liked the idea. I need to go rewatch it. Those guys got me into DRT.
Random 2tc/rappel thoughts
I discovered JRBs Maverick hitch late season last year and was reluctantly drawn to using it. Since my season got cut short I didn’t end up fully incorporating it into any of my hunts. I have since used it on several climbs at home and have been enjoying the effortless exploding knot. I think this is a pivotal shift in the way the game is played when it comes to rappelling. Despite the concern of unintentional explosion of the hitch during rappel, I personally deemed it acceptable of use moving forward.
Since I predominately 2TC i have tried climbing with the mavericks hitch locked out on top and my standard tether on bottom. On the rappel side Ive been running a WLR and a figure 8. I don’t love the clutter of the hitch + figure 8 and I move my hitch a lot on my top tether while climbing which is not easy to do with the figure 8 In line. I’m curious to see pictures of other immediate rappel solutions that involve a hitch and figure 8, hitch and ATC, or even hitch and carabiner (even though I’ve probably seen most of them). Maybe something that works for you could work for me too.
I climb with 2 tethers and then rappel on a 50 ft length of Oplux girthed to the tree with a butterfly around halfway. I add the figure 8 in before rappel. I’ve done this for years regardless of the method of ascent. If no good solution to immediate rappel for top tether exist I may do one of the following, which isn’t for off from what I already do.
One option would be to stick to this system and simply replace my butterfly knot with the mavericks. It doesn’t give me the immediate rappel luxury, but it keeps my climbing system simple and adds the ability to quickly retrieve and stow my rappel rope after a hunt. This is still a net positive.
Another option would be to replace the top tether with the rappel rope but without the figure 8. I still don’t love 8mm for the way I 2TC but it would be more manageable without the figure 8 inline. My figure 8 typically stays on my saddle regardless.
Thanks for the thoughts and ideas.
I discovered JRBs Maverick hitch late season last year and was reluctantly drawn to using it. Since my season got cut short I didn’t end up fully incorporating it into any of my hunts. I have since used it on several climbs at home and have been enjoying the effortless exploding knot. I think this is a pivotal shift in the way the game is played when it comes to rappelling. Despite the concern of unintentional explosion of the hitch during rappel, I personally deemed it acceptable of use moving forward.
Since I predominately 2TC i have tried climbing with the mavericks hitch locked out on top and my standard tether on bottom. On the rappel side Ive been running a WLR and a figure 8. I don’t love the clutter of the hitch + figure 8 and I move my hitch a lot on my top tether while climbing which is not easy to do with the figure 8 In line. I’m curious to see pictures of other immediate rappel solutions that involve a hitch and figure 8, hitch and ATC, or even hitch and carabiner (even though I’ve probably seen most of them). Maybe something that works for you could work for me too.
I climb with 2 tethers and then rappel on a 50 ft length of Oplux girthed to the tree with a butterfly around halfway. I add the figure 8 in before rappel. I’ve done this for years regardless of the method of ascent. If no good solution to immediate rappel for top tether exist I may do one of the following, which isn’t for off from what I already do.
One option would be to stick to this system and simply replace my butterfly knot with the mavericks. It doesn’t give me the immediate rappel luxury, but it keeps my climbing system simple and adds the ability to quickly retrieve and stow my rappel rope after a hunt. This is still a net positive.
Another option would be to replace the top tether with the rappel rope but without the figure 8. I still don’t love 8mm for the way I 2TC but it would be more manageable without the figure 8 inline. My figure 8 typically stays on my saddle regardless.
Thanks for the thoughts and ideas.
See bolded - How do you make sure you don't accidentally pull on the pull-down rope or yank on the 'release' knott before you make it to the bottom?
I really don't know if I worded that correctly, but hopefully you know what I'm trying to say.
If you have weight on the rappel line then it’s cinched to the tree. The pull down line is to help get it to release after you get to the ground. This explosion hitch that is being talked about I have no idea and I’m not sure I want anything that explodes when it comes to climbing gear. Lol.
I was just using a rappel rope with a delta link, no exploding hitches or anything fancy. There was zero chance of it coming loose unexpectedly.
I knew I shouldn’t have mentioned the Maverick hitch.
The intent was to get more thoughts on rappel rope as top tether.
The intent was to get more thoughts on rappel rope as top tether.
I’ve been using the Maverick for a few months now and what I have found to be most efficient for me is to have the rappel rope tied to the tree with the maverick hitch as my bottom tether. I run two bridges and use the second for rappel so having the rappel rope on bottom while 2tcing leaves me able to descend at any point during the climb - just pop off the garda, switch weight from top tether/bridge to bottom tether/bridge and come down. For me, it’s easier to set my foot tether on each move vs my top tether so using the maverick lower makes it easier for me to move as I make my way up. My rappel rope is 60’ so if I end up lower than 30’ (95% of my hunts) I’ll tie the maverick mid rope which allows me to use either end for lowering my bow and/or pack.
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I’m still working out the kinks with 2TC but 2TCing down is too easy. If ever I go back to one sticking I might still 2TC down. Barring emergency hypotheticals, the only fun thing about rappelling is a quick descent. There are many reasons I don’t like rappelling but one is that the net time to descend on and stow 2 tethers vs. 35’+ of rope is just plain faster.