Biggest Buck of my Life

[neonomad]

The good news about low percentage shots gone wrong is that it’s really only the deer that pays the serious price, our price is just hurt feelings. Although maybe if I took a Spitfire to the butt cheek Id reconsider.

 

[ThePennsylvanian]

Be a better hunter, get closer…

See now this........... be a better hunter...... from your perspective how close is close enough? Are you advocating for this to be law in your state, or are you just holding everyone in the hunting world to your standard of ethics? Not to start a internet holier than thou debate here you are just he one that made the comment. Nothing against you, I know many feel this way. And I'm also not arguing for taking those longer distance shots.
I'm 100% guarantee that if we take any one hunter and look at the way they hunt or the decisions they make or would make during a hunt you can find something that someone would think is unethical, myself included. For instance, I shoot a mossberg 4x4 chambered in 7mm remmag, this is a 500 yard rifle/caliber all day long shooting winchester xp 140gr BP. I've shot it @ that range 4-5 times a year since I bought the gun in 2008. Now I have never taken a shot at a deer but I did take a 280 yard shot this year to kill a buck in WV and a 325 yard shot to kill a doe on thanksgiving in WV. Now the amount of crap I've gotten because of that is actually kinda ridiculous. I shouldn't be taking shots that far, that's not really hunting, you shouldn't take shots unless they're close enough to make a follow up shot and so on..
Point being, you can't hold anyone but yourself to your standard....

 

[kyler1945]

Looks like a nice buck.

Sorry you lost him.

Glad someone else got a nice buck, and cleaned up the weak end of the herd by taking the wounded deer.

Pretty cool to be able to be that close the a big one all day.

I shoot thousands of shots a year, out to 100 yards. I’ve only taken a handful of shots at deer over 30 yards. There is evidence to support the notion that deer will react less to shots from long distance. Separate from them deciding to move on their own. But I think there’s probably a mathematical model we can set up where you’re more likely to hit where you’re aiming at 50 than at 15. Given that the possibilities exist, you get no whining from me.

Having said that, the outcome you experienced is far more likely at those distances than in the under 30 category.

Hope you get another one to stitch up the wound.

 

[ImThere]

Sorry you lost him.
You can tell archery guys and non archery guys
And those that don’t hunt out west. Lot of the 20 and under guys would eat tag soup year after year out west. Even the “best” hunters
Awesome how guys jumped on a beat you down after you lost a great buck. I’m sure they woke up with their chest stuck out this morning. Keyboard still smoking.


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[Bowmanmike]

Sorry you lost him.
You can tell archery guys and non archery guys
And those that don’t hunt out west. Lot of the 20 and under guys would eat tag soup year after year out west. Even the “best” hunters
Awesome how guys jumped on a beat you down after you lost a great buck. I’m sure they woke up with their chest stuck out this morning. Keyboard still smoking.


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The op didn't hunt out west either...

 

[John 35]

Looks like a nice buck.

Sorry you lost him.

Glad someone else got a nice buck, and cleaned up the weak end of the herd by taking the wounded deer.

Pretty cool to be able to be that close the a big one all day.

I shoot thousands of shots a year, out to 100 yards. I’ve only taken a handful of shots at deer over 30 yards. There is evidence to support the notion that deer will react less to shots from long distance. Separate from them deciding to move on their own. But I think there’s probably a mathematical model we can set up where you’re more likely to hit where you’re aiming at 50 than at 15. Given that the possibilities exist, you get no whining from me.

Having said that, the outcome you experienced is far more likely at those distances than in the under 30 category.

Hope you get another one to stitch up the wound.

More likely to hit where your aiming at 50 than 15? Are you saying they’ll here it more at close range?

 

[Plebe]

More likely to hit where your aiming at 50 than 15? Are you saying they’ll here it more at close range?

I can't speak for Kyle, but

I think in BowHunting October Whitetails they state a range of distances between which deer are most likely to react to a shot. 50yds would be well outside of that range. Now that's not a science based film nor modern, but those guys have more experience than me by far and there may be something to it. That has little to do with a deer moving on it's own accord, but it is an interesting take.

 

[TK161BOONER]

The op didn't hunt out west either...

Yes …you can only shoot past 20 yard out west according to Fred Bear.

 

[kyler1945]

More likely to hit where your aiming at 50 than 15? Are you saying they’ll here it more at close range?

Im saying do a thought experiment:

Pretend velociraptors still exist, and you’re in your corner of the woods you live in. You hear an unnatural noise(one you wouldn’t expect in your hood), coming from 20’ away. Think of your reaction.

Now, same scenario as above, but you hear the noise coming from 150’ away. Think of your reaction.


Think of the reaction both in terms of type, and degree.


Then remember, to deer, anything that eats deer meat is a velociraptor. And they’re materially better than you at pinpointing exact source/distance away of a sound.


This isn’t an always or never thing, either. It’s just really easy to see a scenario like I described in previous post. Hence, I have to give grace to the OP and assume he could know that, and act accordingly.

Mostly, I think arguing what to do in regards to killing animals and bringing the word ethics or morals into it is pointless at best, and harmful at worst. I’d rather see someone say they think your idea or action is stupid. At least there’s no implications of value of a human life there.

 

[BuckeyeBowman]

For me bow hunting whitetails is up close and personal. Just the way I like to do it. Plus the public land I hunt is so brushy it would be hard to take a confident shot out to 30 yards. I can’t cut shooting lanes and have tied back small trees and branches with paracord to help out. My goal is to outsmart the deer and get them to come in close, if I can make that happen then I feel like I succeeded. I work hard scouting, finding out where to set up and play the wind to better my odds. In my woods I wouldn’t shoot past 25 yards, too many sticks and branches that can make a great shot not so great and not worth it to me to wound a deer. That’s just how I hunt and do t really care how others do it but I try to respect everyone. Plus nothing much better than having deer so close you can see the blink and they have no idea you’re there.

 

[John 35]

Im saying do a thought experiment:

Pretend velociraptors still exist, and you’re in your corner of the woods you live in. You hear an unnatural noise(one you wouldn’t expect in your hood), coming from 20’ away. Think of your reaction.

Now, same scenario as above, but you hear the noise coming from 150’ away. Think of your reaction.


Think of the reaction both in terms of type, and degree.


Then remember, to deer, anything that eats deer meat is a velociraptor. And they’re materially better than you at pinpointing exact source/distance away of a sound.


This isn’t an always or never thing, either. It’s just really easy to see a scenario like I described in previous post. Hence, I have to give grace to the OP and assume he could know that, and act accordingly.

Mostly, I think arguing what to do in regards to killing animals and bringing the word ethics or morals into it is pointless at best, and harmful at worst. I’d rather see someone say they think your idea or action is stupid. At least there’s no implications of value of a human life there.

In my honest opinion the closer you are to a deer the better your chances are for a clean kill, excepting the scenario were your shooting straight down out of a tree. The whole discussion of ethics gets a little murky. There are more effective/ethical weapons than bows for killing deer but I love bow hunting. I know from Jurassic Park that the raptor you hear is just a ruse to distract from the one you missed.

 

[Reagan H.]

I think it is also important to know the stature of a deer at the time of the shot. I watched a video on it somewhere, but if a deer has its head down feeding or something like that, its muscles are already contracted and capable of making a bigger move because of it. With a standing deer it doesn't get that head start.

 

[kyler1945]

In my honest opinion the closer you are to a deer the better your chances are for a clean kill, excepting the scenario were your shooting straight down out of a tree. The whole discussion of ethics gets a little murky. There are more effective/ethical weapons than bows for killing deer but I love bow hunting. I know from Jurassic Park that the raptor you hear is just a ruse to distract from the one you missed.

Im not saying you can’t construct a scenario where the deer being closer isn’t better. Im not even saying most of the time the deer being further away is better.

You’re missing the real point of what I’m saying.

I’m saying that because you can construct a LOT of scenarios where a deer being 50 yards away has better odds of being dead than one 10 yards away, an outside observer owes the OP the benefit of the doubt. At least he deserves not to be made a moral outcast.

For what it’s worth, I’ll take the straight down shot all day over 50 yards.

I will hit +-1.5” on 990 out of 1000 shots. A deers heart is about 3” in diameter, not even counting the big pipes attached to it. I shoot arrows that will either sever a spinal cord or go top to bottom through a deer every time, or both. It’s simply a can’t miss shot for me. I wouldn’t do it at some weird angle where I can’t be balanced. But the risks with that shot have little to do with angles and odds, and more to do with shooter competency and terminal performance of arrows.



Let’s be clear, I like to steer people to the middle on this stuff. Not right and wrong. I just think most people are too lazy and ignorant and distracted to operate at margins. (I don’t attach negative connotations to those words either). But if someone wants to operate at the margins, I ain’t here to make em feel less than.

 

[ImThere]

The op didn't hunt out west either...

Didn’t say he did. I was making a comment about how ranges differ in different parts of the country.

I also, as a hunter, hate how we jump on one another. We get pummeled enough by non hunters, peta and anyone else

We couldn’t say that sucks, better luck next time.

We’re rough on one another. That’s all I was saying.


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[Plebe]

Im saying do a thought experiment:

Pretend velociraptors still exist, and you’re in your corner of the woods you live in. You hear an unnatural noise(one you wouldn’t expect in your hood), coming from 20’ away. Think of your reaction.

Now, same scenario as above, but you hear the noise coming from 150’ away. Think of your reaction.


Think of the reaction both in terms of type, and degree.


Then remember, to deer, anything that eats deer meat is a velociraptor. And they’re materially better than you at pinpointing exact source/distance away of a sound.


This isn’t an always or never thing, either. It’s just really easy to see a scenario like I described in previous post. Hence, I have to give grace to the OP and assume he could know that, and act accordingly.

Mostly, I think arguing what to do in regards to killing animals and bringing the word ethics or morals into it is pointless at best, and harmful at worst. I’d rather see someone say they think your idea or action is stupid. At least there’s no implications of value of a human life there.

I'm not sure people would rather be called "stupid" than be "wrong". That'd be an interesting study. Could be true.

Sometimes even when someone won't admit they are/were wrong, they know or come to realize they should adjust.

"Stupid" is kind of like, just fighting words.

But, pride takes a hit either way and for sure folks really don't like to be told what to do or think either, so I see how it could go the other way.

This is why developing a good culture is important. That way you call yourself a dummy and beat yourself up for making the wrong decision instead of digging a foxhole.

OP has stated the point of this thread is to remind everyone not to rush the shot. That's a good lesson to bear in mind. That can happen without stupidly or ethical wrongdoing.

But I think assessing the scenario of a 50yd shot is a good exercise on it's own and even if no-one budges, it's better to take that head on than dismiss it.

 

[kyler1945]

I'm not sure people would rather be called "stupid" than be "wrong". That'd be an interesting study. Could be true.

Sometimes even when someone won't admit they are/were wrong, they know or come to realize they should adjust.

"Stupid" is kind of like, just fighting words.

But, pride takes a hit either way and for sure folks really don't like to be told what to do or think either, so I see how it could go the other way.

This is why developing a good culture is important. That way you call yourself a dummy and beat yourself up for making the wrong decision instead of digging a foxhole.

OP has stated the point of this thread is to remind everyone not to rush the shot. That's a good lesson to bear in mind. That can happen without stupidly or ethical wrongdoing.

But I think assessing the scenario of a 50yd shot is a good exercise on it's own and even if no-one budges, it's better to take that head on than dismiss it.

You kind of hit it. I wonder if every interaction would be best started with “do you want advice or comfort?”.

 

[elk yinzer]

I'm not so sure people don't post inflammatory stuff just for attention. Like I have to tell my kids, not all attention is good attention.

 

[John 35]

Im saying do a thought experiment:

Pretend velociraptors still exist, and you’re in your corner of the woods you live in. You hear an unnatural noise(one you wouldn’t expect in your hood), coming from 20’ away. Think of your reaction.

Now, same scenario as above, but you hear the noise coming from 150’ away. Think of your reaction.


Think of the reaction both in terms of type, and degree.


Then remember, to deer, anything that eats deer meat is a velociraptor. And they’re materially better than you at pinpointing exact source/distance away of a sound.


This isn’t an always or never thing, either. It’s just really easy to see a scenario like I described in previous post. Hence, I have to give grace to the OP and assume he could know that, and act accordingly.

Mostly, I think arguing what to do in regards to killing animals and bringing the word ethics or morals into it is pointless at best, and harmful at worst. I’d rather see someone say they think your idea or action is stupid. At least there’s no implications of value of a human life there.

The last paragraph in this reply gets more bizarre the more I think about it. There’s no component of morals and ethics in hunting? Where did the part about human life come from? I don’t think we should start calling each other stupid lol.

 

[kyler1945]

The last paragraph in this reply gets more bizarre the more I think about it. There’s no component of morals and ethics in hunting? Where did the part about human life come from? I don’t think we should start calling each other stupid lol.

Why is it unethical to shoot a deer at 50 yards with a bow?

If the answer is “the odds of wounding or painful death are high compared to closer distances, so it’s unethical.”

Do I really need to play connect the dots from there to see how silly that argument is?

 

[LongRange101]

I would hope we stop arguing about the distance at this point. If you are not comfortable shooting any distance do not do it. My failure was not the distance it was my decision to release the arrow and not the situation to do so. Patience failure.