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H2 saddles & TMA news

Nutterbuster said:
Yall are a gloomy bunch of fellas today. :)

Alabama got thrown out there as a state that required TMA harnesses. Not true to my knowledge. They do specify that it has to be a full body harness, probably because TMA only certifies full body harnesses. TMA does this because people died using waist belts. If you're going to have slack in your system and a static tether, like most treestand hunters, a full body harness makes sense.

Acting like the TMA is a big, "cartel" is kinda silly. Sure, treestands are big compared to saddles. But the hunting industry is very, very small potatoes, and treestands are a very small piece of that pie. TMA is based out of Mississippi. That's your first hint it cant be all that. Summit is based out of Alabama. Small business. Cougar Claw Treestands is based out of Elberta, AL, which is a town you've never heard of. They build stands in their garage, and meet standards set by the TMA while doing so. TMA was a good thing when it came, imperfectly executed perhaps. But it looks like they're willing to change with the times, which is cool.

I think we'll be looking at Tethr'd and Trophyline (the biggest players) being available in box stores now. Saddles will become completely non-special, and the magic will be mostly gone. Good for some, sad for a few. I think the small guys will be fine. Doubtful that the standards will be unattainable for most. Some will get TMA approved, some won't. Won't make sense for small guys who are selling direct to consumer.

Curious to see what the standards look like. Doubt we'll see shoulder straps with Tethr'd and Trophyline having a little more muscle this time around.
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Interesting point about full body harness and falls when many of us one stick


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Ontariofarmer said:
Interesting point about full body harness and falls when many of us one stick


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Another interesting point - TMA if I remember right, required tree stand manufactures to include a waist belt before it became evident that a fall using one could maim or kill you as much as an actual fall.
 
Jay_Disarray said:
it does add a certain appeal to the naysayers who look at me in my tree diaper and scoff, im not worried about being in some exclusive club that saddle hunts, i love it and go all "im a vegan" on people when talking about saddle hunting. It excites me and i dont mind sharing my love of it with others
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Haha I got a good chuckle out of this. SH is becoming almost as bad as vegans, crossfit, and Keto.

How do you know if someone is a keto, crossfitting, saddlehunter?....


Oh, they'll tell you. Loudly and many times over.
 
I’d sure be interested how saddle manufacturers, TMA, insurance companies, et al, address the fact that in every climbing discipline, and every industry that involves working from height, none allow or condone only hanging from a friction hitch or ascender. And yet, in saddle hunting, tying off the end of a tether seems to be an afterthought for tying up slack out of the way, and sometimes as a ‘backup’. I don’t see how that will square.
 
kyler1945 said:
I’d sure be interested how saddle manufacturers, TMA, insurance companies, et al, address the fact that in every climbing discipline, and every industry that involves working from height, none allow or condone only hanging from a friction hitch or ascender. And yet, in saddle hunting, tying off the end of a tether seems to be an afterthought for tying up slack out of the way, and sometimes as a ‘backup’. I don’t see how that will square.
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Most of, if not all of the tree stand safety harnesses work the same way with prusiks being the only connection to the tree. So I would assume TMA has no issue with it.
 
and hunting, politics, what car they drive, gun they shoot, etc….. its the generation we live in. personally I share my weight loss journey with those that care - when I went from 250 down to 190 people asked. We ALL like to talk about what we like and do - don't think anyone is immune. hell how many have a wall of bucks or profile pics right here of them and a deer they shot?

He who is without sin can cast the first stone…...
 
BCHunter said:
Most of, if not all of the tree stand safety harnesses work the same way with prusiks being the only connection to the tree. So I would assume TMA has no issue with it.
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i agree, that it is likely not on the radar. The flawed logic there seems obvious to me.

I’m also not saying for sure that hanging from a hitch or ascender is any more dangerous when a proper risk analysis is done. I just find it odd that insurance/governing entities are willing to back a procedure that runs counter to every other discipline, with no math or science to back up the approach.
 
kyler1945 said:
I’d sure be interested how saddle manufacturers, TMA, insurance companies, et al, address the fact that in every climbing discipline, and every industry that involves working from height, none allow or condone only hanging from a friction hitch or ascender. And yet, in saddle hunting, tying off the end of a tether seems to be an afterthought for tying up slack out of the way, and sometimes as a ‘backup’. I don’t see how that will square.
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Yup, extremely good point. And if TMA reaches out to Wild Country about the ropeman use, are going to frown on its application and not approve it and what about Samson and Amsteel's use? Materials and hardware will have to be used exactly how they were designed to be before any governing body would put a stamp of approval on the package.
 
Lets have a party and invite lawyers and government agents to it, what could go wrong with that. If they do go TMA cert. that would mean that all saddles up until the stroke of the pen would be illegal and we would have to purchase a TMA saddle.
 
gumby said:
Lets have a party and invite lawyers and government agents to it, what could go wrong with that. If they do go TMA cert. that would mean that all saddles up until the stroke of the pen would be illegal and we would have to repurchase a TMA saddle.
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"Illegal"? how so? I can legally climb a tree and hunt without any harness. Guessing that would be state dependent, and whether on public or private.
 
it would also mean if you did not use it exactly how they said, that God forbid you needed to, any legal action would fail.
 
Jay_Disarray said:
I agree, however you do have to admit to someone with little knowledge or experience, that weight may carry a bit of weight. I guess i look at it as improving the mass appeal of saddle hunting, and im fine with it. I doubt much will really change in saddle hunting with a TMA stamp. the stamp isnt really for people like us, who are more experienced and knowledged in tree saddles and saddle safety.
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I can't/don't disagree with that at all. :grinning:
 
I expect some saddle company wants to sell at Cabelas
I really don’t care about bureaucracy I don’t care about a safety stamp from anyone. It only matters to Cabelas. If
You buy direct from the manufacturer the TMA is irrelevant

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Vtbow said:
Very true. Isn't that the case already though?
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to some degree yes. But it would mean manufacturers must build to overengineer demands are they would be liable almost without any legal play because they failed to make a "Safe" product. So they will comply and saddles will become over built and far more expensive. They would NOT be able to afford any liability insurance if they did not comply.
 
DaveT1963 said:
to some degree yes. But it would mean manufacturers must build to overengineer demands are they would be liable almost without any legal play because they failed to make a "Safe" product. So they will comply and saddles will become over built and far more expensive. They would NOT be able to afford any liability insurance if they did not comply.
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Ok, I can see that to some extent ... but overbuilt isnt necessarily "properly" used. Isn't specificity of directions included with the saddle and media put out by the company on "how-to" really the factor? How specific are they now? Do you think saddle producers could continue to sell/supply ropeman since the instructions included with those do not specify the application?
 
kubes14060 said:
Is there a fear that a "TMA Approved" saddle will be a reason to charge more for it?? What does TMA get out of putting their approval on something?
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Ding ding ding ding, we have a winner. Somebody saw the bottom line somewhere and figured out how much money has been spent in the last few years on saddle hunting equipment that didn’t have to pay a dime for TMA approval. Same thing government does right before it passes a new tax on something. Invite the people in from the new sector to discuss a few things then find a way to get “their cut” out of “what they are missing.” Personally I’d rather see these companies get together and make their own standards. It’s time for the SHMA (Saddle Hunter Manufacturers Association). We aren’t using the same equipment and it would make more sense than getting involved with a bigger established org, who didn’t give a rip until they saw the money they were missing.
 
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