Heavy Arrows & High FOC Vs. Lightweight Fast Arrows

[Kernal1984]

If you couldn’t get heavy arrows to fly either your bow isn’t setup or correctly or you didn’t play around enough with point weight and different arrow spines. It really is a huge investment in time to find an arrow setup your bow likes and then nock tune all of them and then shoot them all with broadheads to see which ones fly the best.

I shot my bow more this year getting my arrows dialed than I did the last 5 years combined. It was well worth it in the end and I learned a lot.

 

[FisherHawk]

If you have never hunted in the wind and practiced in the wind, you probably do not understand the effects of the surface area of a large broadhead. If they work for you great.

 

[Kernal1984]

If it’s that windy out to effect my arrow flight significantly under 35 yds I’m not gonna be hanging out in a tree in the woods

 

[DroptineKrazy]

One more thing that is rarely touched on in regards to this subject and that is the difference in the size of the whitetails in the southern part of our country as apposed to the size of the deer in the north. Iv'e seen some of the deer that @Nutterbuster has shot and the deer in my area are born that big But seriously though. The biggest recorded deer ever taken in my home state of Maine is #355 pounds dressed weight. I dare say you would need a much heavier set up to kill a deer that size,especially with a bad hit, than a deer from say Alabama.

 

[Kernal1984]

One more thing that is rarely touched on in regards to this subject and that is the difference in the size of the whitetails in the southern part of our country as apposed to the size of the deer in the north. Iv'e seen some of the deer that @Nutterbuster has shot and the deer in my area are born that big But seriously though. The biggest recorded deer ever taken in my home state of Maine is #355 pounds dressed weight. I dare say you would need a much heavier set up to kill a deer that size,especially with a bad hit, than a deer from say Alabama.

Lived in Florida for 2 years and the rest of my time has been in Indiana, I was pretty confused about the first few deer I saw down there lol

 

[raisins]

One more thing that is rarely touched on in regards to this subject and that is the difference in the size of the whitetails in the southern part of our country as apposed to the size of the deer in the north. Iv'e seen some of the deer that @Nutterbuster has shot and the deer in my area are born that big But seriously though. The biggest recorded deer ever taken in my home state of Maine is #355 pounds dressed weight. I dare say you would need a much heavier set up to kill a deer that size,especially with a bad hit, than a deer from say Alabama.

You see this in WV based upon elevation. The does at the highest elevations are as big as bucks at lower elevations. I scared a doe this year that was so big she looked like a mule. I was thinking "I bet she could kill me in hand to hoof combat!".

 

[JakeFromVirginia]

Did you play with the different spines? 29.5" draw you probably need a stiffer arrow.
What's the grains per inch on the FMJ? You won't get your FOC up if your weight is in the back.

I did started with 340 then did 300 and a 240 arrow. Had the ethics archery RF test field points. the pin gaps were insane for me. I prefer to be able to shoot a live animal out to 50 yards. Many critize it I know but I’ve seen plenty make a clean 50 yard kill when weather is right, shot is broadside etc. I’ve take 3 deer; one at 40, ~35 yards, and one at <1 yard as it was right under my stand (that was actually my worst shot as I had never practiced that extreme an angle).

 

[JakeFromVirginia]

You see this in WV based upon elevation. The does at the highest elevations are as big as bucks at lower elevations. I scared a doe this year that was so big she looked like a mule. I was thinking "I bet she could kill me in hand to hoof combat!".

im in the Appalachia’s and it’s crazy how bigger the deer are compared to the farm deer even if the mountain deer have smaller antlers (I get the biological reasons for that but still funny).

 

[jakhammer]

My arrows tow 372g with Jakhammer 100g x 1.75 cutting diameter. - shooting 70 lbs at 315 fps
Any arrow I put in the vitals and I watch them go down. I have had 2 spine shots with this setup that did not kill the deer. I shot one the next day and my buddy shot the other 2 days later.
I am glad to see this post as I plan on adding more weight. Going to a 125g head with an FOC arrow and may add a weighted insert.
I am doing this for 2 reason - first is to gain kinetic energy so those spine shots will sever the spine and second is arrow flight - sometimes my arrows fishtail (1 or 2 out of 10) I also bought a bitzenberg and am going to refletch with helical vanes instead of straight.

 

[TommyDee]

I don't have enough experience to weigh in significantly, 1 for 1 with a swhacker 3 blade at 65#, 30", 100g. So I'm light and fast. But, it was 30yd, and the deer stopped, looked right at me, and jumped the string. Very happy to get a passthru and, fast kill...but I wonder if in this situation with heavy arrow, Would a slow heavy arrow resulted in a spine shot, or full duck and miss? If we're talking whitetail, isn't their reaction time a serious consideration? Especially if you stop one, and they're looking right back at You?

 

[DroptineKrazy]

My arrows tow 372g with Jakhammer 100g x 1.75 cutting diameter. - shooting 70 lbs at 315 fps
Any arrow I put in the vitals and I watch them go down. I have had 2 spine shots with this setup that did not kill the deer. I shot one the next day and my buddy shot the other 2 days later.
I am glad to see this post as I plan on adding more weight. Going to a 125g head with an FOC arrow and may add a weighted insert.
I am doing this for 2 reason - first is to gain kinetic energy so those spine shots will sever the spine and second is arrow flight - sometimes my arrows fishtail (1 or 2 out of 10) I also bought a bitzenberg and am going to refletch with helical vanes instead of straight.

I think your headed in the right direction. I shot a huge doe once and hit her in the spine. She dropped on the spot and never even kicked.

 

[jakhammer]

If you couldn’t get heavy arrows to fly either your bow isn’t setup or correctly or you didn’t play around enough with point weight and different arrow spines. It really is a huge investment in time to find an arrow setup your bow likes and then nock tune all of them and then shoot them all with broadheads to see which ones fly the best.

I shot my bow more this year getting my arrows dialed than I did the last 5 years combined. It was well worth it in the end and I learned a lot.

you made me look up nock tuning - Thanks I learned something and I have been shooting a bow over 50 years.

 

[jakhammer]

I don't have enough experience to weigh in significantly, 1 for 1 with a swhacker 3 blade at 65#, 30", 100g. So I'm light and fast. But, it was 30yd, and the deer stopped, looked right at me, and jumped the string. Very happy to get a passthru and, fast kill...but I wonder if in this situation with heavy arrow, Would a slow heavy arrow resulted in a spine shot, or full duck and miss? If we're talking whitetail, isn't their reaction time a serious consideration? Especially if you stop one, and they're looking right back at You?

your bow will be quieter with a heavier arrow

 

[Kernal1984]

I don't have enough experience to weigh in significantly, 1 for 1 with a swhacker 3 blade at 65#, 30", 100g. So I'm light and fast. But, it was 30yd, and the deer stopped, looked right at me, and jumped the string. Very happy to get a passthru and, fast kill...but I wonder if in this situation with heavy arrow, Would a slow heavy arrow resulted in a spine shot, or full duck and miss? If we're talking whitetail, isn't their reaction time a serious consideration? Especially if you stop one, and they're looking right back at You?

I’ll just leave this here.

 

[raisins]

I don't have enough experience to weigh in significantly, 1 for 1 with a swhacker 3 blade at 65#, 30", 100g. So I'm light and fast. But, it was 30yd, and the deer stopped, looked right at me, and jumped the string. Very happy to get a passthru and, fast kill...but I wonder if in this situation with heavy arrow, Would a slow heavy arrow resulted in a spine shot, or full duck and miss? If we're talking whitetail, isn't their reaction time a serious consideration? Especially if you stop one, and they're looking right back at You?

It is a lot more rare for a relaxed deer to jump the string enough for it to matter. If a deer spots you and is hyped up, then it will jump the string on even a longbow shooting a heavy log arrow (and that setup is quieter than any compound) because the deer is waiting to react to a threat and their hearing is good enough to hear any bow. I wonder if they react much more strongly to a louder bow given the exact same body language/internal state? I don't know and that would be a hard experiment to pull off.

 

[MattMan81]

Someone posted something on here I think the other day about deer eye sight. They said deer see in almost what we call slow motion. So it may not even be the noise. It could be you shooting, the bow, the arrow movement that makes them React.

 

[Kernal1984]

It is a lot more rare for a relaxed deer to jump the string enough for it to matter. If a deer spots you and is hyped up, then it will jump the string on even a longbow shooting a heavy log arrow (and that setup is quieter than any compound) because the deer is waiting to react to a threat and their hearing is good enough to hear any bow. I wonder if they react much more strongly to a louder bow given the exact same body language/internal state? I don't know and that would be a hard experiment to pull off.

The video above is all about string jumping and has videos of animals being shot with slow heavy setups and light fast setups. Good info.

I know my POA is different with an alert deer vs one that’s clueless.

 

[DroptineKrazy]

I always aim for the top of the heart so if the deer reacts it gives me the most margin of error. Most 3d archery targets have the 10 ring in the middle of the lungs. Wrong spot to aim imho.

 

[Weldabeast]

@Red Beard and I both scored twofers with heavy foc arrows this season... My arrow zipped thru deer #1 and entered deer#2....I didn't get a good enough look at deer#2 to determine how well the arrow penetrated or even where the arrow hit the deer... But it was stuck in there enough to were I never found my arrow...... He had much better luck... Maybe he will throw in his experience. Not sure if that is a positive or a negative for heavy arrows or not. I keep it under 30 and I know no matter what the animal is gonna jump. My bow is somewhere near 55pd draw, 28" draw length, and 29"arrow. I know it shoots slower than 200fps because the 200ezv insert tells me so. .I am accurate and confident with them so I happy....another benefit (major benefit) is the heavier u go the quieter ur bow becomes

 

[Pooh]

I sniffed the dust, but before I had ever heard of the RF. I spined up added 100gr up front. I'm somwhere around 540. It's a plain 340 spine with an extra 100 grains up front. I did not insert tune or nock tune, but I will next time. I've walkways shot G5 Montecs or ST mags.

In 6 years I bonked 2 does, center scapula hits, so it warranted change. Switched arrow set ups 2 & 1/2 years ago and won't go back. The first deer I shot with the new arrow was center scapula (not on purpose) and the arrow passed through. Only change was the arrow, broadheads didn't change.