How high is high enough with a saddle?

[Bwhana]

Height really should be irrelevant to the device, for the most part. The real key is you should know where the deer are coming from and see them way before they can ever see you and adjust accordingly while you have time. Movement at the wrong time is the issue, not movement.

As to deer showing up from behind or unexpected directions, that’s generally due to poor stand location choices. I intentionally put my back to an area downwind of me that is usually also blocked by terrain and almost never have deer come in and be caught off guard. I may be caught off guard while napping, but not direction.

The only reason I get higher with my climber is to see and shoot further with my rifle.

With a bow or crossbow, I do not go as high and keep it below 20 ft for better shot angles.

For the record, we have 1,000s of telephone pole trees here in the south and the lollipop situation is more of an excuse than reality for getting busted.

 

[sweats]

Most of the time for me during archery, not very high. Probably around 12 feet is the most frequent height. I'd like to be higher, but where I hunt is pretty thick and I'm not far off the trails I expect deer to travel.

Given how up close and personal it will be of the deer arrive, I'm not comfortable with the shot angle going much higher. If it's firearms season and I can setup somewhere with more visibility I'll go around 20 or 25 feet depending on other factors.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

 

[Alaska at Heart]

Just putting in my 2 cents. When I used a climber I always tried to be 20 to 25', now in a saddle I normally only get from 17' to 18' with 4 skeleton sticks and a 3 step aider on the bottom stick. I normally get 6' to 7 ft. with the bottom stick then around 40" with each remaining stick. I'll place my platform around a foot higher than the top of my last stick but sometime I place it even if I feel I might need the help with getting around the tree for a shot. Now with that said and I'm no expert with saddles since I've only been using them for the last 4 seasons. For me I feel that if I climb to small a tree I get picked off easier by deer. Yes the basketball size is what most people want but I do like and feel more hid in a tree that's about 20" or so in diameter. When setting up for a strong side shot the wider tree hasn't been an issue and it hides me better plus when my pack is hanging on the side I don't feel I'm making such a large bulge that looks abnormal on the side of the tree. I do climb all sizes of trees from 12" diameter up but I prefer the larger tree for better hiding. I did the same in my Summit when I used it so I had a wider backdrop in my stand. But like someone said earlier movement is the key. Try being a fidgety person and turkey hunt with no blind, just you, camo and a tree against your back. An old gobbler or hen can pick you off from a very long distance if you move. But I've also had them almost step on me when I stayed still. I've also killed deer as close as 8' on the ground with a pistol.
Good luck this year Guys and Gals. Hunting sure is fun and can be done multiple ways with success. That's what makes it fun trying different things to see if you can beat the game in their house. Been at it around 55 years and it's still fun.

Excellent reply.....and thank you for taking the time to post worthwhile content.

Sadly, some folks behave as though a new member to the forum is a complete newbie to bowhunting or hunting above the ground.....which ia a huge assumption. This site was highly recommended to me by some guys from other bowhunting forums as a place for sound and experienced saddle hunting information. I've been exploring and reading without doing much posting to 'take the temperature'. Like most sites, it seems to be a mixed bag between those who want to sound smart and funny to their friends.....and those who actually want to be helpful.

 

[kyler1945]

Excellent reply.....and thank you for taking the time to post worthwhile content.

Sadly, some folks behave as though a new member to the forum is a complete newbie to bowhunting or hunting above the ground.....which ia a huge assumption. This site was highly recommended to me by some guys from other bowhunting forums as a place for sound and experienced saddle hunting information. I've been exploring and reading without doing much posting to 'take the temperature'. Like most sites, it seems to be a mixed bag between those who want to sound smart and funny to their friends.....and those who actually want to be helpful.

We’re here to serve!

You’re asking a question that can’t be answered in any useful way. So you get zero to moderate utility responses.

Folks either think you’re focusing on the wrong things or framing the problem wrong. And addressing that.

Or they think the question is pointless, given the nearly infinite number of variables and circumstances that would dictate hunting height. And addressing that.



But you’re here to learn, so let’s do some learnin!

What state do you hunt in mostly?

Public or private?

Big woods? Piney woods? Thicket? Marsh? Swamp? What’s your typical topography and vegetation and terrain type?

Are you hunting particular deer or shooting the first one you see?

I can tell a lot about your personality already, but are you someone who pays attention to detail or are you more surface level?

How many deer have you killed with a bow?

How many years have you been hunting?

Once we have all that information I bet we can give you a much more detailed and thoughtful response to your question!

 

[Horn]

@kyler1945 is so much better at words than me! I was going to say the same thing.

I would add, are you dead set on the 360° of shooting? Is so higher is better

 

[Amccormick]

We’re here to serve!

You’re asking a question that can’t be answered in any useful way. So you get zero to moderate utility responses.

Folks either think you’re focusing on the wrong things or framing the problem wrong. And addressing that.

Or they think the question is pointless, given the nearly infinite number of variables and circumstances that would dictate hunting height. And addressing that.



But you’re here to learn, so let’s do some learnin!

What state do you hunt in mostly?

Public or private?

Big woods? Piney woods? Thicket? Marsh? Swamp? What’s your typical topography and vegetation and terrain type?

Are you hunting particular deer or shooting the first one you see?

I can tell a lot about your personality already, but are you someone who pays attention to detail or are you more surface level?

How many deer have you killed with a bow?

How many years have you been hunting?

Once we have all that information I bet we can give you a much more detailed and thoughtful response to your question!

All of that is irrelevant to the original question, and part of the other issue here that the OP just addressed. Who cares how many years he has been hunting or how many deer he has killed. He didn’t ask how to kill more deer. He asked how high do you think you need to be to get away with the movements that HAVE to be made when bow hunting. You have to take your bow off the hook and draw. No question about it. When a buck sneaks in on you and you don’t have time to prepare before it’s too late, how high do you think you should be so when that buck is standing in your shooting lane can you grab your bow and draw without him catching you?

 

[Amccormick]

So I’ll give it a shot.

Cover or no cover, 3 feet or 30. If you can see the deer the deer can see you. We all move around in the tree whether you want to believe it or not, we’ve all had missed opportunities at deer we didn’t even know were there because we have moved at the wrong time. With Slow easy movements I think you can get away with a lot no matter hight or cover. Make a conscious effort to keep your movements slow and smooth I think is the best you can hope for.

 

[kyler1945]

All of that is irrelevant to the original question, and part of the other issue here that the OP just addressed. Who cares how many years he has been hunting or how many deer he has killed. He didn’t ask how to kill more deer. He asked how high do you think you need to be to get away with the movements that HAVE to be made when bow hunting. You have to take your bow off the hook and draw. No question about it. When a buck sneaks in on you and you don’t have time to prepare before it’s too late, how high do you think you should be so when that buck is standing in your shooting lane can you grab your bow and draw without him catching you?

So no obstructions between the deer’s eyes and me?

Just simple geometry?


You’re probably wanting a minimum of a 70-80* angle to avoid detection drawing a bow.


Admittedly, I don’t hunt a lot of places, or circumstances, that a deer can sneak into shooting range without some cover to allow me to draw. But I’m not very good at bowhunting, and have not hunted a lot of different places, and I’m not very smart, so that may have something to do with why I never get those opportunities.

 

[Horn]

All of that is irrelevant to the original question, and part of the other issue here that the OP just addressed. Who cares how many years he has been hunting or how many deer he has killed. He didn’t ask how to kill more deer. He asked how high do you think you need to be to get away with the movements that HAVE to be made when bow hunting. You have to take your bow off the hook and draw. No question about it. When a buck sneaks in on you and you don’t have time to prepare before it’s too late, how high do you think you should be so when that buck is standing in your shooting lane can you grab your bow and draw without him catching you?

This also has tons of variables and no one is going to be able to give a concrete answer. Pressure, terrain, what's the animals demeanor, what's your experience level, are you over bowed? Ect.

That's why we need more specifics, so a more a specific response can be made. Not wide open questions that have and get broad answers

 

[Seekbigger]

Like every other topic on any forum, all we really get is the differing opinions of lots of guys and what works for them! Remember you asked for our opinions!!! What I do when I post a question is not get offended in what people think they know about me and just read the info given! I take what I feel is beneficial to my circumstance and let the rest go, remember all people have an opinion and just because I don’t agree with it doesn’t make them necessarily right or wrong.

To the op question, I am the guy that hunts in the nose bleed section lol, the guys that hunt with me say I am crazy for getting that high, but I realize that I sometimes move too much and being higher helps with that! I also feel that being higher seems to help with scent dispersal further away from the area I am expecting deer to come from, which in turns helps me if they circle around down wind of me. Using milkweed will and has proved this method to me many times, with the wind carrying my scent further away from my area before going to the ground where the deer are. So my favorite height is feet 20’ or better, I rarely hunt below that, but this is just my preference and what works for me! I’m not concerned with steep angles, I’ve never had a issue if you remember to shoot for the exit and practice that very thing at home! I just killed a doe this year where my feet were right about 28’ I shot the doe at 15 yards, so at that height basically right under me! I aimed for the exit which means my shot entered just above the midline of the body, went through the heart and exited through the armpit on the opposite side. She ran less that 40 yards! It mainly comes down to what each individual is comfortable with. There is tons of good Info on this forum and plenty of good guys willing to help, just remember you have to sort through each topic and tuck your feelings in deep enough to not be stepped on! God Bless

 

[Mr Price]

I have literally killed deer with my feet only l6' from the ground. All in the coverage

 

[Amccormick]

So no obstructions between the deer’s eyes and me?

Just simple geometry?


You’re probably wanting a minimum of a 70-80* angle to avoid detection drawing a bow.


Admittedly, I don’t hunt a lot of places, or circumstances, that a deer can sneak into shooting range without some cover to allow me to draw. But I’m not very good at bowhunting, and have not hunted a lot of different places, and I’m not very smart, so that may have something to do with why I never get those opportunities.

Now you have answered the question. Thank you. The rest of your post makes little sense to me but you have answered the question.

 

[OSUTodd]

Just to bring up a few more factors - is the animal still coming toward you, or has it passed by your location already? Is it alone or are there six pairs of eyes around you?

I also think you can get away with more movement while the deer is in motion. Your movement is easier for them to detect while they're standing still, staring in your direction.

All the factors mentioned, even when they're in your favor, don't produce a point where you 100% can or can't get away with movement. They just increase or decrease your chances of getting busted.

 

[1simplemann]

I wonder if folks who claim/believe they sit 'perfectly still' in a saddle, other treestand type or even from the ground, had a trail cam on video pointed at them during an entire hunt......or better yet several hunts......would they be surprised by what they saw when viewed the footage? Even it if is just turning our heads to scan the area for animal sightings.....we tend to move around. Hands are also a major culprit of movement that we tend to overlook. Quite frankly, no one goes into complete mime-mode from the moment they start hunting and holds their head straight while only moving their eyes......not until they see game anyway. So getting back to the origicinal question.....and thank you 1simpleman for actually addressing it.....how high do you typically shoot for on a typical hunt?

Your welcome. I didn't think it was that difficult a question. Basically it's all situational. Every tree is going to have that "sweet spot" hunting height. The trick is recognizing where that is. I start looking at that 20-24' range. I really like 22'. Sometimes I go lower, sometimes higher depending on the situation. However, It's been my experience, that the higher I go, the better. IMO it's exponential about the odds of getting picked in regards to how high you are. If you typically hunt @ 10' ladder stand then start hunting at 20' in a hang on, then some guys would think that you've decreased the odds of getting picked by half. I think it's more than that. It's been my experience that you can away a TON movement. That's why JE hunts so high. At 30', it's very hard to get picked unless your complete moron. However for me there's a point of diminishing returns the higher I go. 1st. The older I get, the more uncomfortable I am. I just don't like being that high and I'm comfortable at height. 2nd If you get too high, you can get above the tree canopy and can't see them coming. I hate being surprised. Being surprised leads to sudden movements. Sudden movements will get you picked. I try to stay below the canopy so I can see them coming and have time to prepare. 3rd It was mentioned already, shot angle. Too high reduces the angle but IMO 25' up is no biggie. Killed a bunch of them that high w/ no issues. 4th If you get too high the tree can be either too skinny to hide behind or too wimpy. It can get REALLY windy here in MT during the season. I like a solid tree otherwise I get mentally uncomfortable and have to get out. 5th If you get too high, the tree top or branches can move as you shift your weight or move. Years ago my mentor hunted one of my trees and mentioned that the branches would shake as you shifted your weight on the platform which was a dead give away. I never considered that. It was a perfect funnel. I never killed anything there but he killed a big 10pt there. That guy was a killer and sat like a church mouse. I always remembered that advice. I was in the right spot, right tree but too high. It's also going to be mentioned that you can go lower if you have cover. True statement. However if you can have cover and height? Better! I try to put as much in my favor as possible. Hope this helps.

 

[thedutchtouch]

This thread doesn't make a lot of sense. You open by saying that as an experienced hunter you know that climbing into cover is ideal, but ask us to disregard that, and also acknowledge that movement is a big way deer see us, but want to disregard that/ climb out of it and get annoyed when people point out that you can't really do that. Doesn't make a lot of sense, and then you come off pretty abrasive when people point out that the question asked is too simple to really mean anything, and other details likely matter more/factor in. This is a discussion forum, if you just want numbers for whatever reason and don't want to discuss/trade knowledge and opinions then just post a poll and ignore the replies I guess.

Now to attempt an actual answer to the questions posed: the height I climb depends on cover, shooting lanes, wind speed/direction, topography, etc. (Another one of those "unhelpful" answers I suppose.) I don't claim to be an expert, I've set up from 15-25 feet typically but I've been "invisible" at 7 feet and picked off at almost 30 before so... It depends. If it's a telephone pole tree situation I'm around 20 and sitting still, a few feet up or down isn't going to change much.

 

[TreeRecon]

I have killed most of my deer at 15' or less. I killed one 8' up in my saddle this season

It may be fun to go higher, but it can really mess up shot angles/opportunities.

 

[RDGARD]

I used to have to be above 20’ but it’s difficult carrying that many sticks so now I’m 16’ to 18’ and don’t seem like I get picked off anymore frequently. I have been picked by deer coming in behind me but was shaking a hand warmer.

 

[TreeRecon]

I used to have to be above 20’ but it’s difficult carrying that many sticks so now I’m 16’ to 18’ and don’t seem like I get picked off anymore frequently. I have been picked by deer coming in behind me but was shaking a hand warmer.

Last night I hunted out of a state stand. It was wooden and 5' off the ground lol. I had a spike buck at 5y and several more does under 10y. It's mostly about movement

 

[Maverick1]

Just below the canopy, however high that is.

 

[Empostarr]

My first year in a saddle, I found some hot sign along some trails running parallel to a corn field, about 40 yards into the woods. I only climbed to about 12-15 feet and had 4 deer come in right below me. One doe even browsed right at the base of my tree. I saw them coming and just sat motionless. The bigger doe saw me, but since I didn't move, she eventually calmed down and continued browsing.

Years before i had a climber or saddle, when you could bait in Michigan, I used a tree seat at ground height about 20-30 yards from a bait area. Back to the tree facing the bait, not the smartest setup. A doe and a fawn came in and looked right at me. I remained motionless. After stomping for about 30 seconds, they continued to browse and eat the bait. They didn't react until it was almost dark and I said "Hello", at which point the doe abandoned that fawn and took off like a bat out of hell.

Both instances reiterated to me that the most important thing is being still, especially once you see them coming. Does being higher up help see them sooner? For sure. But I've also been busted 20+ up a tree and turning only my head to scan the woods.