Knaider Swaider Wild Edge Treesqueeze?

[sethwright]

Getting my gear all practiced up for saddle hunting and plan to use 5 wild edge steps, a perch, and a knaider and swaider to get 25'+. I know it is doable from practicing in the yard on a climbing stick while waiting on my wild edge steps to get here. Every video i've watched and everything i've read says to keep more slack in your linemans belt while climbing with this method so you don't get kickouts. Has anyone come up with a "safe solution"? I am thinking about getting a tree squeeze to hook to which would make it operate more effectively like a harness in a treestand. Hook your step up, throw it around the tree above the step, and the climb up, reposition it above your next step, etc. Seems like it may take a little longer than a linemans belt, but atleast you wouldn't have all that slack. Anybody got a solution?

 

[NikoTheBowHunter]

I ditched my 5 step ladder and only use the knaider with my WE stepps. The further down the swaider/aider hangs from the WE step, more chance of kick out. The reason many say to use more rope, is to give your body more leverage on the foot to dig into the tree to help prevent kick outs. I never got comfortable with it and ditched it. Now I only use my 5 WE stepps and a knaider from doublesteps.com to get me about 25ft-ish with my platform. I place each step about 4 1/2 ft apart. I think if you used a tree squeeze with the linesmans belt you will run into a lot issues getting around branches depending on which tree you climb.

 

[sethwright]

I ditched my 5 step ladder and only use the knaider with my WE stepps. The further down the swaider/aider hangs from the WE step, more chance of kick out. The reason many say to use more rope, is to give your body more leverage on the foot to dig into the tree to help prevent kick outs. I never got comfortable with it and ditched it. Now I only use my 5 WE stepps and a knaider from doublesteps.com to get me about 25ft-ish with my platform. I place each step about 4 1/2 ft apart. I think if you used a tree squeeze with the linesmans belt you will run into a lot issues getting around branches depending on which tree you climb.

That was my thought was the tree squeeze would be carried but only used when I wasn't going to be going around any obstacles.

I used the knaider and swaider on a climbing stick in my yard over the weekend and I was super comfortable with it, i was at ground level so i didn't use my LB or anything, but going up that 5' I didn't feel unsecure at all. I think the main thing is not to get any twists in the swaider because I noticed when I did have a twist in it it wanted to pull my foot around the tree, a quick spin to get it straightened out cured the issue. I actually thought the knaider was the most solid of the 2, that model I have felt like i was standing on a concrete floor.

I originally was going to use sticks and a single step movable aider, and while the aider was easy to use, I would've just ended up using it like a swaider since I liked having it attached to my foot a lot better than stepping and finding the hole on the way down.

I will hopefully be experimenting with the knaier and swaider with an actual wild edge step this evening.

 

[Kurt]

I've been messing with a tree squeeze, and the tether with the K/S and WE steps
and haven't had much luck. You need the space in between the linesman to be able to advance fluidly. I didn't like the fact that I had to stop advancing on the K/S to advance the tree squeeze. . I found the same to be true trying to use the tether. It gets in the way. I'd rather be able to climb fluidly and in balance rather than fighting with other pieces that are supposed to increase my safety but are a distraction to my concentration and are also an impediment to my physical advancement. I find the K/S to be a better climbing system if the steps are tied on properly and the climber uses the linesman and his own climbing ability to maintain his balance over the steps. Remember the kickout is just the symptom of being off balance.

 

[ericabbott]

I've been messing with a tree squeeze, and the tether with the K/S and WE steps
and haven't had much luck. You need the space in between the linesman to be able to advance fluidly. I didn't like the fact that I had to stop advancing on the K/S to advance the tree squeeze. . I found the same to be true trying to use the tether. It gets in the way. I'd rather be able to climb fluidly and in balance rather than fighting with other pieces that are supposed to increase my safety but are a distraction to my concentration and are also an impediment to my physical advancement. I find the K/S to be a better climbing system if the steps are tied on properly and the climber uses the linesman and his own climbing ability to maintain his balance over the steps. Remember the kickout is just the symptom of being off balance.

Totally agree with not using a tether. Tried it and it caused more problems than it solved. I've been able to significantly reduce the kick-outs (using WE stepps and a 4 step aider) by first stepping down on the aider, then putting my foot against the tree. Reduces the amount of movement on your foot and the likelihood of you foot slipping to the side and off the tree.

 

[DConnorsIndy]

Good thread.

Tether is still the best option I can come up with - Anyone have success making it work or making it easier?

Anyone have feedback on the vertical lineman's belt from WEI?

 

[Kurt]

My last post was Oct. 2019 and to date I've not had any luck with climbing with anything but the linesman while using the K/S. Using the tether is still the safest way but it's slow and IMO gets in the way. I don't ever feel like I'll ever hit the ground because of the way I move the linesman when I climb. I feel like the only way I'd fall now is a complete failure of the step, and I can't see that happening. What is this vertical linesman belt to which you speak?

 

[Weldabeast]

No slack in tether .....I use my linesman long so I can lean back...is that considered slack? Long linesman is the key for me to be more solid/stable....with a long linesman I can climb with just my belt and grippy soled shoes...I would never attempt but playing in the back yard at ground level I can essentially 'walk' up the tree with my linesman set long and squeeze it by hand to help grip the tree.

 

[bowhunthard88]

I prefer the 5 WEI stepps and the k/s. I do run my lineman's rope long, and actually take my transitions while holding onto the lineman's on each side, not the tree. I find it much easier to advance this way. In order to reduce kick-outs I make sure, on my swaider, that my toe is into the tree and the strap runs up and makes contact with the inside of my knee. Always toe into the tree for the knaider OR swaider!

 

[PEEJAY]

Following. Sort of off topic...Do most of you use the WE ropes on the stepps or is anyone using something different and prefer that more. I used stepps with k/s last season but Im still trying to decide what climbing method im going to use this season. Haven't got to practice much i blew my back out twice this summer after turkey season

One of the issues I had with the knaider swaider was the step pulling off on one side because my biner and knee hook would slide over to the outside of the step. Is this why you keep the strap on the inside of your leg?

 

[bowhunthard88]

Following. Sort of off topic...Do most of you use the WE ropes on the stepps or is anyone using something different and prefer that more. I used stepps with k/s last season but Im still trying to decide what climbing method im going to use this season. Haven't got to practice much i blew my back out twice this summer after turkey season

One of the issues I had with the knaider swaider was the step pulling off on one side because my biner and knee hook would slide over to the outside of the step. Is this why you keep the strap on the inside of your leg?

I'm currently using the WEI ropes and personally see no reason to change, as long as you have stretched them prior to use! I have the center of my step hockey taped, and my swaider carabiner is shrink tubed! With this combo, I have absolutely no slipping!

The only reason that I run the swaider along the inside of my leg is because, once it's weight bearing, I can use it as an additional support/balance point slightly.

 

[Aaronpaul14]

I'm currently using the WEI ropes and personally see no reason to change, as long as you have stretched them prior to use! I have the center of my step hockey taped, and my swaider carabiner is shrink tubed! With this combo, I have absolutely no slipping!

Same thing for me but I hockey tape my swaider carabiner. Between that and making sure steps are as level as possible it should not slide.

 

[Kurt]

Following. Sort of off topic...Do most of you use the WE ropes on the stepps or is anyone using something different and prefer that more. I used stepps with k/s last season but Im still trying to decide what climbing method im going to use this season. Haven't got to practice much i blew my back out twice this summer after turkey season

One of the issues I had with the knaider swaider was the step pulling off on one side because my biner and knee hook would slide over to the outside of the step. Is this why you keep the strap on the inside of your leg?

On the cross bar of the step you need to put a couple of zip ties about an inch and a half apart and centered, pull em down tight and then give em a good wrap with electrical tape. Now give the whole cross bar a wrap with some camo vet tape from your local Tractor Supply. It should leave you with two bumps with a space to hook your swaider. This should keep things from sliding on ya. The knaider is short so sliding shouldn't be a problem. If it is then your not keeping your balance centered when you climb. I've done it this way from the beginning and can get in any tree so far.

 

[Kurt]

Same thing for me but I hockey tape my swaider carabiner. Between that and making sure steps are as level as possible it should not slide.

I did actually wrap my biner also. Mostly to silence it but your right on with the fact that it also helps with the sliding. Also wrapped the knaider hook for the same reasons.

 

[Kurt]

Following. Sort of off topic...Do most of you use the WE ropes on the stepps or is anyone using something different and prefer that more. I used stepps with k/s last season but Im still trying to decide what climbing method im going to use this season. Haven't got to practice much i blew my back out twice this summer after turkey season

One of the issues I had with the knaider swaider was the step pulling off on one side because my biner and knee hook would slide over to the outside of the step. Is this why you keep the strap on the inside of your leg?

I'm also still using the ropes they came with. Some folks were having trouble with the tie on but I never really had any problems. Once you learn the tie on it's pretty bomb proof. @Peterk1234 made a modification that swapped out the ropes for a cam strap that sounded like a good fix for those who didn't like the ropes.

 

[prvance]

I put 7/64 amsteel on mine. After getting them stretched they work fine and a lot more compact than the ropes. I do have to do a double loop on the tie off to keep from slipping. I also use a K/S but haven't wrapped my steps yet to keep from sliding to one side but I'm light at 160 so that may be the reason its not an issue for me.

 

[Kurt]

I put 7/64 amsteel on mine. After getting them stretched they work fine and a lot more compact than the ropes. I do have to do a double loop on the tie off to keep from slipping. I also use a K/S but haven't wrapped my steps yet to keep from sliding to one side but I'm light at 160 so that may be the reason its not an issue for me.

I used that vet tape to silence the steps. I wrapped the cross bar and the standoffs, but make sure you don't wrap where the the ropes tie on. I don't know what will happen if you do but my thought is it will bad, but I never did it so i don't know for sure.