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Menace Saddle?

Enkriss,

Maybe someone should tell Andrew Blair to change the Tethrd website for the FAQ section.....
 
Navigator said:
Enkriss,

How do you know it's made overseas? There is nothing on the Menace product page (although there is a Made in USA logo at bottom of webpage). From the customer support FAQ page:

How are you making your saddles?
We’ve partnered with several US manufacturers to engineer and build our saddles on American soil. Not only are we working with American companies, but we sought out an International Organization for Standardization (ISO) credentialed facilities to ensure state-of-the-art methods and quality control. Rest assured that each and every Tethrd Saddle is manufactured and inspected right here in the U.S.A.

We know that Eberhart stated that the ESS is made overseas (contrary to Tethrd's own marketing info above).
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The saddles and products they have that are made in the US seem to state it in the description(check out the phantom), unfortunately( and slighlty misleading) the origin of others do not seem to be listed anywhere on site.
 
VTbow,

In the Tethrd FAQ posted above, it states "Rest assured that each and every Tethrd Saddle is manufactured and inspected right here in the U.S.A." Also the Menace and ESS are referred to as saddles on the products page and in the ESS name itself. I see nothing on the FAQ stating some saddles are made overseas.
 
Navigator said:
VTbow,

In the Tethrd FAQ posted above, it states "Rest assured that each and every Tethrd Saddle is manufactured and inspected right here in the U.S.A." Also the Menace and ESS are referred to as saddles on the products page and in the ESS name itself. I see nothing on the FAQ stating some saddles are made overseas.
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Not to be accusational, but aren't you the one that pointed out that John E. stated in a youtube reply that the ESS was being assembled in China? A parallel can be drawn as we know the sys haulers and some other softgoods manufactureing was brought overseas(there was a thread a while back about stuff showing with with china or taiwan tags, I dont remember which) without any change to the description. IT appears they are playing the game and not mentioning point of origin on stuff not made in the USA, but going out of their way to point it out when it is.

Maybe we're on the same page in that its confusing and misleading and we just misunderstood each other?

ess.jpg
 
I pointed out the fact that prior to the ESS, all Tethrd saddles were made in the US consistent with Tethrd's FAQ response. But since the ESS, and now the Menace, are made overseas, I think the FTC would have an issue with Tethrd's response. Interestingly, Tethrd uses the Made in USA logo on all product webpages. So it seems odd that Tethrd emphatically states that ALL saddles are manufactured in the US, when they know they are not.

I think we are saying the same thing. Tethrd is playing games, especially putting the Tethrd Nation symbol (American Flag) on products not made in the USA.
 
Navigator said:
I pointed out the fact that prior to the ESS, all Tethrd saddles were made in the US consistent with Tethrd's FAQ response. But since the ESS, and now the Menace, are made overseas, I think the FTC would have an issue with Tethrd's response. Interestingly, Tethrd uses the Made in USA logo on all product webpages. So it seems odd that Tethrd emphatically states that ALL saddles are manufactured in the US, when they know they are not.

I think we are saying the same thing. Tethrd is playing games, especially putting the Tethrd Nation symbol (American Flag) on products not made in the USA.
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Agreed 100% . We are COMPLETELY on the same page.
 
Yeah the only origin information on the Menace (and ESS) product page is a made in USA logo....
 
Are you guys referring to the small Made in USA logo in the footer of the website? That's a global item that appears on every webpage, but should probably be removed. I agree FAQ should be updated and company of origin should be clear for every product, if nothing else so the haters can have another reason to hate on Tethrd. Yeesh.
 
d_rek said:
Are you guys referring to the small Made in USA logo in the footer of the website? That's a global item that appears on every webpage, but should probably be removed. I agree FAQ should be updated and company of origin should be clear for every product, if nothing else so the haters can have another reason to hate on Tethrd. Yeesh.
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I agree it's a "silly little thing" - but if most of the products you are selling are made in China, you probably shouldn't have a "Made in USA" logo on every page of the website...especially when you don't list country of origin for most products, and include statements like "all saddles are made in USA". Do they have "better things to do" than updating and redesigning their website? Sure they have other things to do and it's clear that certain sections simply haven't been touched in years, but it'd be better to spend the few minutes and get rid of misleading inaccuracies.
 
mattsteg said:
I agree it's a "silly little thing" - but if most of the products you are selling are made in China, you probably shouldn't have a "Made in USA" logo on every page of the website...especially when you don't list country of origin for most products, and include statements like "all saddles are made in USA". Do they have "better things to do" than updating and redesigning their website? Sure they have other things to do and it's clear that certain sections simply haven't been touched in years, but it'd be better to spend the few minutes and get rid of misleading inaccuracies.
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I don’t think it’s silly or little. Totally agree it should be updated and made clear. No argument there at all. Just seems like a lot are drinking Tethrd h8rade lately, and throwing them under the bus every chance they get.


Sent from d_mobile
 
d_rek,

"Probably" be removed? Can you honestly say that keeping the Made in USA logo is an oversight on Tethrd's behalf? So what does that logo mean at the bottom of every page? It seems they want all the benefits of advertising Made in USA without any of the responsibilities of adhering to it. It is my understanding that the Made in the USA was promoted by Tethrd in order to help establish itself as a company. Has Greg said anything at all about this given his military or former military background?

Tethrd updated that tag line on the bottom of the website in 2020 because it says "copyright 2020". They could have easily removed the Made in USA logo at the same time because they knew by 2020 not all of their products were made in the USA. It seems more intentional than an oversight.
 
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Navigator said:
d_rek,

"Probably" be removed? Can you honestly say that keeping the Made in USA logo is an oversight on Tethrd's behalf? So what does that logo mean at the bottom of every page? It seems they want all the benefits of advertising Made in USA without any of the responsibilities of adhering to it. It is my understanding that the Made in the USA was promoted by Tethrd in order to help establish itself as a company. Has Greg said anything at all about this given his military or former military background?
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I wouldn’t presume to know the opinions or politics of anyone at Tethrd concerning global manufacturing and supply chain, let alone a veterans prior service record or engagements with US military.

Can I honestly say anything about a company or any individual I know on deeply personal and intimate level? No. But I also don’t suspect any malice or non compliance either. Like I said most of you seem happy to throw spitballs from the back of the room. If that’s your prerogative then good for you. If you’re truly concerned about country of origin then clearly there are other ways to express your opinion of the product and company.


Sent from d_mobile
 
d_rek said:
..... If you’re truly concerned about country of origin then clearly there are other ways to express your opinion of the product and company.
Sent from d_mobile
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Regardless of what people may think of me and my opinion of Tethrd based on the last few years of happenings on this forum, I'm over the past and have moved on. I do find misleading advertising annoying, especially in a fast growing market where a lot of newbies aren't as verse to the products and manufacturers. Whether what is happening is meant or not, a company has a responsibility to their consumers(no matter what the company is) to represent their products the most honestly and clearly as possible. Its obvious made in the USA was part of their original marketing plan(which is should have been, and that's great!), but sometimes steering the ship in another direction means revisiting verbiage used and framing of product descriptions.

In all honesty and asking in a nice way, since tone cant be read via the web- I want to specify I'm genuinely curious if there is a better channel to share these concerns and information. What would you suggest is a better way to express these anomalies so new consumers are aware of some of these inconsistencies and be the most conscientious consumer possible?
 
d_rek,

That's why we have the FTC and its regulations to protect consumers from misleading Made in USA advertising.

For the record, I've tried two ways to give Tethrd the benefit of the doubt. I've emailed Tethrd when I received a product made in CHINA to discuss this issue, but Tethrd hasn't responded. And it has been just about a year since I emailed them.

Further, I contacted their customer service about this issue just two weeks ago when Eberhart said his saddle was made overseas and Tethrd still hasn't updated their FAQ or website. So call it what you want, malice, noncompliance, etc., but Tethrd is aware of the issue. Not sure what other way I am to express my opinion.
 
Vtbow said:
Regardless of what people may think of me and my opinion of Tethrd based on the last few years of happenings on this forum, I'm over the past and have moved on. I do find misleading advertising annoying, especially in a fast growing market where a lot of newbies aren't as verse to the products and manufacturers. Whether what is happening is meant or not, a company has a responsibility to their consumers(no matter what the company is) to represent their products the most honestly and clearly as possible. Its obvious made in the USA was part of their original marketing plan(which is should have been, and that's great!), but sometimes steering the ship in another direction means revisiting verbiage used and framing of product descriptions.

In all honesty and asking in a nice way, since tone cant be read via the web- I want to specify I'm genuinely curious if there is a better channel to share these concerns and information. What would you suggest is a better way to express these anomalies so new consumers are aware of some of these inconsistencies and be the most conscientious consumer possible?
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I suppose you have a point - a good one. And the SH forum is as good a place as any to discuss. And again i'm not disagreeing with anyone that the country or origin should be made clear, and the FAQ and other items on their website updated. I just don't personally read anything subversive or malicious into it, whereas others seem to think it's intentionally misleading. Guess it's a matter of perspective is all.

I also don't know what transpired between you and Tethrd in the past either, so that's all moot to me. I don't honestly have a desire to know (unless you want to cliffnotes me) but I can understand how prior experiences shape future interactions with a business. So don't think i'm bringing any prior judgement into the conversation, because i'm not.
 
d_rek said:
I suppose you have a point - a good one. And the SH forum is as good a place as any to discuss. And again i'm not disagreeing with anyone that the country or origin should be made clear, and the FAQ and other items on their website updated. I just don't personally read anything subversive or malicious into it, whereas others seem to think it's intentionally misleading. Guess it's a matter of perspective is all.

I also don't know what transpired between you and Tethrd in the past either, so that's all moot to me. I don't honestly have a desire to know (unless you want to cliffnotes me) but I can understand how prior experiences shape future interactions with a business. So don't think i'm bringing any prior judgement into the conversation, because i'm not.
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Cliff notes version was I have given them a pretty hard time on here about the predator gen 1 failure and not doing a better job alerting consumers of the failure or even educating the saddle community and new users of the difference between the two so those purchasing on the used market are aware of the issues and potential failures. It is kind of a taking responsibility for putting things out there--I"m aware of the cost involved with a recall, but after taking preorders, pushing delivery dates back for so long, and customers still TRUSTING them to deliver the products, IMO they owed it to their customers and potential consumers to be forthright and honest with the issues.

I"m happy to chat about any of this more via PM, but I want to keep this about the Menace so it doesnt get locked down. IT is probably a good low price point saddle for newbies that is at least designed better than the new Hawk one.

The "Made in the USA" marketing verbiage bothers me in a little the same way; just doesn't seem honest. Whether it is intentional or not, it was a business decision to put it there and advertise it and a business decision to manufacture things overseas. Can't have it both ways and they owe it to their brand loyal customers and new consumers to be forward with these types of things where a customers personal values may come into play when purchasing a product like the Menace.
 
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