New to saddles - are my ropes ok?

[boyne bowhunter]

One final thought and I'll step back. While I'm not generally a proponent of buying a saddle kit with all the ropes, I also don't advocate using gear for life support that there's any question as to the suitability of. As others have pointed out there's a lot of sources for buying rated climbing rope by the foot at a lot cheaper cost than the full saddle kit. Name brand, climb rated carabiners are also inexpensive. As others have said your life could depend on it.

Worse yet, if you only end up breaking your neck you're putting your loved ones in the position of having to wipe your butt for the rest of your life. Is that worth saving a few dollars?

 

[raisins]

Worse yet, if you only end up breaking your neck you're putting your loved ones in the position of having to wipe your butt for the rest of your life. Is that worth saving a few dollars?

i'd probably feel too guilty to eat mexican food if that were the case....and i love mexican food

therefore, i use good safety equipment so i can continue to eat mexican food

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

Again the ropes that came with the lone wolf, were used with their fall arrest harnesses (meaning it was drop tested) so as long as the rope is inspected and is in good condition, it is fine to use. It’s no different than any of us using the tether from one saddle company, with a different brand saddle.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

. “LW rope might be fine but it’s not rated for what we do, sure some of the gear we use isn’t rated”
Why wouldn’t it be rated for what we use it for? It’s used and tested in conjunction with a full body fall arrest harness so it has to be strong enough to arrest a fall…
Do you think oplux is rated for what we use it for? I agree with what y’all are saying about when I’m doubt buy new stuff! I agree but a man tying knots that he’s not familiar with can be just as dangerous as using his ropes from last season in my opinion. Not trying to harp on anyone but remember that tree stand companies always ship a tree strap, linesman strap and harness with their stands, those harnesses and ropes must pass the same drop tests. If anything the ropes saddle companies are selling might not pass those tests because as of now, standards aren’t in place for saddles. Just my two cents

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

overhand knot with nearly non-existent tag end

i am less concerned with the overhand knot, on good rope and with plenty of tag end it will be strong enough, but a figure 8 is better

the tag end is the left over little piece of rope that if it slips through your knot comes untied...for something like a tether, I want bare minimum 2 inches and actually run at least 3 inches


just because it came from lone wolf doesn't matter, i've seen questionable stuff from muddy and hunter safety systems also

also, there's no telling if they used a rated rope that was designed for climbing....rated black ropes are rare but do exist (bluewater assaultline, etc)

KM III Static Rope

KM III Static Rope is NFPA and CE certified, the KM III static line is perfect for rappelling, caving, top roping and life safety applications. KM III Static Rope unique filament polyester sheath is balanced with a unidirectional nylon core to limit rotation, bounce and stretch.

www.rope.com

MARLOW BLACK Abseiling Rope

If you love outdoor activities, then give the Black MARLOW Tactical Rope a try! ? A Defense force favorite that works hard!

sgtknots.com

STABLE BRAID BLACK - Samson Rope

A firm, polyester, double braided rope with high strength, low stretch, and excellent resistance to wear. Stable Braid Black is made of solution-dyed fiber.

samsonrope.com

Most rope manufacturers make black ropes rated to CE static rope standards (more than 5400 lbs break strength) above are just a few examples Bluewater makes assault line AND Pro Tac both of which are well above that 5400 lbs break strength. I agree with your assessment of the over hand knot but again for Lone Wolf, Muddy, or any of the companies that sell full body fall arrest harnesses, they have to provide the ropes or straps to be used with their systems for their drop tests… meaning the set up he has (when it’s in good condition) has already passed these drop tests.

 

[Plebe]

 

[Still Kicking]

I trust figure 8 knots, with a tail and stopper in the tail. Twenty feet don't sound that far but eight feet can kill you or do major damage. I've taken a bunch of rope rescue training and most of the instructors favor the figure 8 knots for life safety. If you listen to the stories of deaths in the fire service, caving, rock climbing, and forestry it increases your respect for equipment. I will never use a rope owned by anyone other than myself. Climb Safe!

 

[Horn]

Instead of guessing you could reach out to LW. Maybe they answer, maybe they don't but phone calls/emails are freebies.

I'm certainly not saying don't be safe or disagreeing with safety concerns others brought up.

@Fl Canopy Stalker , I think you had excellent insights and information, thanks.

 

[dk_ace]

KM III Static Rope

KM III Static Rope is NFPA and CE certified, the KM III static line is perfect for rappelling, caving, top roping and life safety applications. KM III Static Rope unique filament polyester sheath is balanced with a unidirectional nylon core to limit rotation, bounce and stretch.

www.rope.com

MARLOW BLACK Abseiling Rope

If you love outdoor activities, then give the Black MARLOW Tactical Rope a try! ? A Defense force favorite that works hard!

sgtknots.com

STABLE BRAID BLACK - Samson Rope

A firm, polyester, double braided rope with high strength, low stretch, and excellent resistance to wear. Stable Braid Black is made of solution-dyed fiber.

samsonrope.com

Most rope manufacturers make black ropes rated to CE static rope standards (more than 5400 lbs break strength) above are just a few examples Bluewater makes assault line AND Pro Tac both of which are well above that 5400 lbs break strength. I agree with your assessment of the over hand knot but again for Lone Wolf, Muddy, or any of the companies that sell full body fall arrest harnesses, they have to provide the ropes or straps to be used with their systems for their drop tests… meaning the set up he has (when it’s in good condition) has already passed these drop tests.

This is what I was thinking, but now this thread has me super conflicted….

I’ve tested that rope by putting my weight on it (slowly, haven’t fallen in it), and it never showed any signs of slipping. Saddle hunting when done correctly, as I understand it, never leaves any slack in the line. So I’m not understanding why this tether is fundamentally flawed.

Sounds like I have to choose between products that are actually tested and ones that are theoretically better but untested. Not a great choice…

D

 

[Plebe]

Instead of guessing you could reach out to LW. Maybe they answer, maybe they don't but phone calls/emails are freebies.

I'm certainly not saying don't be safe or disagreeing with safety concerns others brought up.

@Fl Canopy Stalker , I think you had excellent insights and information, thanks.

It's my understanding that LW no longer exists, so that adds to the problem.

 

[Horn]

I'm sorry about that, I stand corrected.

In that case I'd say buy new rope too

 

[philsanchez76]

One final thought and I'll step back. While I'm not generally a proponent of buying a saddle kit with all the ropes, I also don't advocate using gear for life support that there's any question as to the suitability of. As others have pointed out there's a lot of sources for buying rated climbing rope by the foot at a lot cheaper cost than the full saddle kit. Name brand, climb rated carabiners are also inexpensive. As others have said your life could depend on it.

Worse yet, if you only end up breaking your neck you're putting your loved ones in the position of having to wipe your butt for the rest of your life. Is that worth saving a few dollars?

That escalated quickly from ropes to butt wiping! @boyne bowhunter you know how to paint a picture! I totally agree. For 50 bucks or less get a professional certified rope from a trusted company and learn to tie a figure 8.

 

[Plebe]

I'm sorry about that

Me too. Climber belts are now..poof.

Lol, who knows how much LW rope I've pitched. I have a couple of their lines that I've kept around for dragging though. Never had one snap, despite some heavy loads, lol.

I bet with some work we could still figure out who made those ropes. And I bet they are rated...but won't bet my life on it.

 

[John RB]

I posted pics of the tree tether above. It looks exactly like the others I’ve seen that are tied, but maybe I don’t know what I’m looking at which is why I asked.

While I’m new to the saddle I’m not new to tree hunting. I don’t spend any time not tied in either.

D

Not withstanding the other good comments since mine...

Yes, I was responding to the pictures. That's what I meant when I said a picture is worth a thousand words.

That's an overhand loop knot i saw in black cord. It's not the right knot AND it's tied with inadequate tail. Visible Tail should be 10x the rope diameter, or a few inches. That tail might have been longer when it was tied. But u own the inspection process. Arborists inspect everything before they start a climb. We should minimally do it as often as possible.

On closer inspection, based on the size of your finger, that looks to be 6mm cord max. 6mm is not adequate for a tether assuming that's what i am looking at. And i think i see a prussik tied out of the same diameter cord which is not correct, it needs to be smaller. I would ditch this stuff. Your safety is worth it.

If ya don't buy a new system and want to build your own, start with a quality rope and cord. I like Sampson Canyon Elite in 9mm. I like Sterling 7mm utility cord on that rope. In terms of length, ya gotta decide if you're gonna rappel, even if in the future... i believe everyone should ... if you do, you'll need 40ft of rope, and more if u want a lineman's belt.



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[dk_ace]

Not withstanding the other good comments since mine...

Yes, I was responding to the pictures. That's what I meant when I said a picture is worth a thousand words.

That's an overhand loop knot i saw in black cord. It's not the right knot AND it's tied with inadequate tail. Visible Tail should be 10x the rope diameter, or a few inches. That tail might have been longer when it was tied. But u own the inspection process. Arborists inspect everything before they start a climb. We should minimally do it as often as possible.

On closer inspection, based on the size of your finger, that looks to be 6mm cord max. 6mm is not adequate for a tether assuming that's what i am looking at. And i think i see a prussik tied out of the same diameter cord which is not correct, it needs to be smaller. I would ditch this stuff. Your safety is worth it.

If ya don't buy a new system and want to build your own, start with a quality rope and cord. I like Sampson Canyon Elite in 9mm. I like Sterling 7mm utility cord on that rope. In terms of length, ya gotta decide if you're gonna rappel, even if in the future... i believe everyone should ... if you do, you'll need 40ft of rope, and more if u want a lineman's belt.



Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Ah, thanks I misread your original post.

Just to clear up a few things here for anyone reading this in the future if searching for something on LW ropes: the rope pictured is 8mm and the Prussic line is 6mm. The tail end is 3cm. Looking at stock photos of this tree rope, that tail end appears to be roughly the same length as it was originally. I can’t say whether or not it has slipped, but if it did it wasn’t much.

Sounds like this is the wrong tool for the job. Thank you all for your help, I’m glad I asked.

D

 

[John RB]

Ah, thanks I misread your original post.

Just to clear up a few things here for anyone reading this in the future if searching for something on LW ropes: the rope pictured is 8mm and the Prussic line is 6mm. The tail end is 3cm. Looking at stock photos of this tree rope, that tail end appears to be roughly the same length as it was originally. I can’t say whether or not it has slipped, but if it did it wasn’t much.

Sounds like this is the wrong tool for the job. Thank you all for your help, I’m glad I asked.

D

No problem. To be clear, this is the knot which got our attention: an overhand loop knot with a stub for a tail. Remember, besides helping you, this info could help the next person reading this. And so our input is that this isn't the best knot and that we want a nice long tail on any knot used for life safety. Cheers.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

 

[Hall17]

KM III Static Rope

KM III Static Rope is NFPA and CE certified, the KM III static line is perfect for rappelling, caving, top roping and life safety applications. KM III Static Rope unique filament polyester sheath is balanced with a unidirectional nylon core to limit rotation, bounce and stretch.

www.rope.com

MARLOW BLACK Abseiling Rope

If you love outdoor activities, then give the Black MARLOW Tactical Rope a try! ? A Defense force favorite that works hard!

sgtknots.com

STABLE BRAID BLACK - Samson Rope

A firm, polyester, double braided rope with high strength, low stretch, and excellent resistance to wear. Stable Braid Black is made of solution-dyed fiber.

samsonrope.com

Most rope manufacturers make black ropes rated to CE static rope standards (more than 5400 lbs break strength) above are just a few examples Bluewater makes assault line AND Pro Tac both of which are well above that 5400 lbs break strength. I agree with your assessment of the over hand knot but again for Lone Wolf, Muddy, or any of the companies that sell full body fall arrest harnesses, they have to provide the ropes or straps to be used with their systems for their drop tests… meaning the set up he has (when it’s in good condition) has already passed these drop tests.

Anyone using that KM III rope for anything?

I swear this is the rope that the Cruzr XC comes with for their stock bridge but could be wrong? I emailed them about it months ago with no response

The KM III rope always peaked my interest but not sure I’ve seen too many reviews on here about it

 

[josh9284]

Your lonewolf ropes are fine...I use mine with no problems. As stated above lone wolf uses static rope..which I also use for rappelling. They are over rated for what we use them for but I like the extra strength if my life is on it.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

Anyone using that KM III rope for anything?

I swear this is the rope that the Cruzr XC comes with for their stock bridge but could be wrong? I emailed them about it months ago with no response

The KM III rope always peaked my interest but not sure I’ve seen too many reviews on here about it

I believe you are correct about Cruzr using it, however I wouldn’t expect them to tell you all their secrets lol. It’s design is very similar to Bluewater protac, it’s just not as stiff as the Bluewater rope is. It’s very strong though and bends for knots pretty well for a kermantle cover style rope.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

It's my understanding that LW no longer exists, so that adds to the problem.

Ok yes they are out of business but no not really… Andres kept the title Lone Wolf when he sold the company. He had a non compete for several years, then he opened Lone Wolf Custom Gear. It’s my understanding that “Lone Wolf” was having to pay trademark royalties to Andres and when he reopened LWCG it confused people about the products they were buying, Lone Wolf is Novix Outdoors (think of the people who make trophyline platforms and sticks)… so yea you’re right, but they didn’t go out of business in the sense that they stopped making elevated hunting gear, they more or less rebranded