I misstated, yes man it's simple. They're state records. Simply put.Then simply man, they're not state records.
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Rompola Buck Update
- Thread starter woodsdog2
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Among the other bucks Mitch has entered in the Michigan record books, Mitch had the Michigan state record for the largest archery killed typical buck that stood for 28 years. That state record buck scored 181-7/8" taken in Grand Traverse County, Michigan in 1985 stood until Robert Sopsich beat it with a 182-1/8" buck taken in 2013.
There's no doubt that hunting trophy bucks in northern Michigan is tough to do, but Mitch has been successful at succeeding at just that. Most Michigan hunters looking for trophy bucks will concentrate on the southern lower peninsula including John E. I'm sure if Mitch chose to hunt in the southern lower where good bucks are more plentiful his record tally would be much higher. Few huge bucks come out of northern Michigan.
There are many facts that point to the buck taken in 1998 being legit. The fact that Mitch is a terrific hunter, he's taken other record book bucks from the same area. Several of Mitch's book bucks bear a close resemblance of the monster buck taken in 1998 so there obviously genic traits that tend to show a gene pool of bucks with wide kind of oddly shaped antlers. If Grand Traverse County can produce a 180" buck, who's to say it can't produce anything bigger? The buck was seen and inspected by quite a few people including a Conservation Officer when it was a fresh kill. How do you fake the antlers on a fresh kill?? I can only imagine it would be a bit time consuming to fake a set of antlers so no one could tell they had been altered. Again, how do you do that on a fresh kill?? Three well respected CBM Scorers inspected it and measured it and swear it's not been altered. Plus I just can't believe a respected scorer himself and the Scoring Chairman of CBM would try to pass off a fake deer to his peers. It's just really hard to believe.
Then there's the facts that point to it being fake. Why would anyone refuse to clear their name when others cry foul and call it a fake? With the amount of money tied to a world record buck and the fame attached, who would pass that opportunity up? That's a pretty hard question to get past. The buck I killed this past season with my bow measured 147" and I chose not to enter it in CBM nor P&Y because there's no real point to it. It's not worth any money nor fame so I didn't see anything to gain from entering it and I can understand someone not wanting to enter a buck. A world record is totally different and that is the way most of us look at it. Why wouldn't you want to enter a new world record buck?? And that is really the only argument anyone can levy against the buck. Why not enter it in the record books, CBM or B&C? It wouldn't qualify for P&Y due to Mitch's bow having more than 65% let off which was a rule at that time. It seems to me there are more qualifying reasons that the buck might be legit than not, but for now we just don't know and maybe we never will...
Fun fact: I am probably one of the few on this site that has actually spoken to Mitch, not that is has any bearing on this topic. Back in the late 80's I killed a buck that scored in the mid 140's. My cousin that same year killed a nice buck that scored 160 but the scorer made a mistake on his scoring of that buck. My cousin urged me to get my buck re-scored so I called Mitch who was the Scoring Chairman at that time. CBM frowns on "shopping for scores" but Mitch okayed me to have another scorer double check the measurement of the first scorer, which yielded no change in the score.
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Excellent post Ricky. Even the simplest amongst us can reason it out. Thank you.
There are plenty of decent arguments for the alleged world record buck being fake, but the whole "how could ONE guy kill THAT many records" argument is weak... Look at Sean and Adam Konrad out of Saskatchewan. 2 brothers that have caught 10+ IGFA world record fish and a bunch of other provincial records. Everyone knows the lake they're doing it on... no one else is breaking their records... but they keep breaking their own records over and over and over. Greg Myerson who holds the striped bass world record is another example. Guy catches multiple 60 and 70+ pound bass every year. For anyone that doesn't know striped bass, a 50 pounder is considered a fish of a lifetime, and is about the equivalent of a legitimate (net 170" typical, net 195" non-typical) Boone and Crockett whitetail. I have seen thousands of striped bass get reeled in, and can count on one hand the number of 50+ pound fish I've seen, yet that one guy in Connecticut has caught 5 of them in a night... Sometimes there is just a person that is more dialed in than everyone else at a particular thing...
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Every kid dreams of being the star quarterback but few even get to quarterback a high school game. Fewer yet ever get to play in a college game. Still fewer reach the "cream of the crop" and make it in the NFL. And of those fewer yet ever reach legendary status. We have to face it, some guys got it, some guys don't.
Johnny Manziel
Tom Brady
Every kid dreams of being the star quarterback but few even get to quarterback a high school game. Fewer yet ever get to play in a college game. Still fewer reach the "cream of the crop" and make it in the NFL. And of those fewer yet ever reach legendary status. We have to face it, some guys got it, some guys don't.
Johnny Manziel
Tom Brady
Not that Tom Brady hasn’t been the focus of scandal and intrigue, lol.
Some how I keep getting drawn back into reading this. There are really good reasons to believe either way. You guys have given some good arguments for both. The only objection I can give to the fish argument is, you can't see what fish are in the lakes. Guys don't have trail cameras under water, or people observing fish along a busy highway. So is there is a surplus of 180" deer roaming the G.T. county public that us other Michigan guys need to know about? If MR came forth with some newer trophy's in the 150+ range from that area, it would make it more believable.
Some of you guys good at scoring take a look at this web site, and tell me what size bucks your seeing come out or GT county. May have to filter it to show just that county.
mibuckpole.com
Some of you guys good at scoring take a look at this web site, and tell me what size bucks your seeing come out or GT county. May have to filter it to show just that county.
Buckpole - MI Buck Pole
Filter Results Filter Results County Type of Photo Method Time of Day Date Range Property Filter Results County Type of Photo Method Time of Day Date Range Property
mibuckpole.com
Here is what the local scorer (screenshot from the article that started this thread) who scores many bucks a year had to say about the Rompola buck vs all of the deer in the county:
He calls a 150 buck a "freak of nature" in that county and somehow mitch was producing deer 30 to 70 inches larger than that all in a few years.... he has never in his life measured or seen a 25 inch spread deer from that county and Mitch claimed to have killed 5 deer in the same county over that in a few years
Another quote from Randy Rhoades:
Rhoads: I was the Regional Director for CBM (Commemorative Bucks of Michigan), and I saw all the official score sheets for more than 20 years. I never once put my hands on a Booner. Now, there have been some gross Booners, but not a legit 170-inch deer. We did have a few (170s) that later make it from nearby counties, but dang few. Every score sheet from the northwest side of Michigan – and that covers a huge area – came through me. We’re talking from the Mackinaw Bridge all the way down to Muskegon. I have a pretty good handle of what’s around.
Yet somehow Mitch is able to produce a deer 50 inches larger than any produced in a 20 year career and it just so happened to live on the property adjacent to his home...
Rhoads: I was the Regional Director for CBM (Commemorative Bucks of Michigan), and I saw all the official score sheets for more than 20 years. I never once put my hands on a Booner. Now, there have been some gross Booners, but not a legit 170-inch deer. We did have a few (170s) that later make it from nearby counties, but dang few. Every score sheet from the northwest side of Michigan – and that covers a huge area – came through me. We’re talking from the Mackinaw Bridge all the way down to Muskegon. I have a pretty good handle of what’s around.
Yet somehow Mitch is able to produce a deer 50 inches larger than any produced in a 20 year career and it just so happened to live on the property adjacent to his home...
There are way too many unanswered questions about this deer for me to believe it's real--questions, BTW, that could be easily answered by MR. I think the Rompola buck is the Piltdown Man of the deer world.
There's quite a few decent bucks coming from Grand Traverse County, more than I would have expected knowing the area. Most of the hunters posting on Buck Pole are most likely average Joes like you and me that most likely don't rise to the level of Mitch. How many 180" bucks to you need to stack up before you would believe one lives in a given county? One behind every tree, every square mile, 10% of deer harvested? If there were 180" deer behind every tree, you and I would be killing them too. Again, the only thing that casts doubt on Mitch's buck is he refused to enter it in the record books. All eye witness accounts of the deer claim it was legit. All of the naysayers only saw pictures of it. That includes me too. I would trust many eye witnesses that laid hands on it rather than what I might think I saw in a picture.
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Man the palmation on the left side of that top pic is absolutely amazing…. Looks just like a moose antler…… it must be fake!! Jk Jk fellas!!!
Is Rhodes one of those who were eye witnesses to the Rompola buck? How does he justify the 181" former state record buck coming from Grand Traverse County? Just because they aren't common doesn't mean they exist. I'm down in Berrien County, ag county and a 180" is rare as hen's teeth but they exist. Just because local scores don't see them every season isn't a disclaimer there isn't any here. Most scorers will likely never measure a 180" deer during their lifetime but they do exist.
He actually says in that interview that he personally examined the rack and it was weather checked and not legit... but that is his opinion
Noone is debating if 180s exist there.. but 220s? 1 guy getting 5 170-220 inch bucks in 7 years??
Sorry to come into this late, again, I posted WAY earlier cuz I lived outside of Traverse City when this happened. Im not reading all 15 pages of comments, but I remember at the time reading that one issue was his family was in the raising trophy bucks farm game. At the time, there was speculation of them transferring the bucks (he shot) from their farms. And again, this couldve been posted already but how come nobody else ever saw this buck before...or did they?
I have always thought this was the most logical of assumptive arguments...pen raised nearby and staged field photos.
Hmm....ok that is the most logical scenario if the buck was real. I mean if you're running the long game, the argument that 'no one ever seen the buck before' is plausible. I would hide the buck from public eye until its time. This would also explain why many of the bucks look similar. I'm very strongly against hormone treatment for farm raised bucks because I think that's taking things too far. But I can see how some of the bucks in these photo can pass as 'natural'.
Freak Show Bucks: A Hard Look at Breeding For Antlers
Craig Dougherty investigates the ugly side of deer farming, including this outrageous 561-inch buck.
www.outdoorlife.com
I have no dog in this 25 year old argument (or any inside information or old sources to cite) but I can remember a lot of "suggestion" at the time that the buck might have been pen raised and even had its antlers distorted while in velvet to achieve a world record status. I rarely see this mentioned anymore so I don't know if someone has scientifically debunked that theory in the meantime. If so, disregard the following.
If (and I'm only proposing one possible scenario here) the deer was pen raised and someone with a lot of tangible income to lose if it was certified as a new world record (i.e. the current record holder) did a little bit of investigative work and found some evidence of this . . . they could easily apply enough pressure to make it go away without needing to pay a large sum of money.
I'm just proposing that this is one plausible scenario that would explain the following "facts":
If (and I'm only proposing one possible scenario here) the deer was pen raised and someone with a lot of tangible income to lose if it was certified as a new world record (i.e. the current record holder) did a little bit of investigative work and found some evidence of this . . . they could easily apply enough pressure to make it go away without needing to pay a large sum of money.
I'm just proposing that this is one plausible scenario that would explain the following "facts":
- People who saw the deer right immediately after the recovery said the rack was real.
- CBM scorers who examined the rack say that is was real.
- No one else extremely populated area ever reported seeing this deer free roaming (or any of the previous or subsequent bucks taken for that matter) in the 3-5 years it would have to have been running wild while mature (assuming an age of 6-8 at the time of its demise). Let's remember that Grand Traverse county is anything but wilderness. There are very few places you can't drive to within a half mile of and the buck was claimed to have been shot either within the city limits or on property directly adjacent to the city limits (i.e. highly populated within 1/4 mile of arguably the heaviest traveled road in GT county).
- That a buck 60 inches bigger than anything previously seen from that area at that time frame was taken there. This is not an area with a large agricultural environment. Nutrition is generally accepted as a key to antler development. Deer in this area don't have access to that type of high nutrition foods.
- That the new potential world record holder suddenly decided that it wasn't worth certifying. No fame/no fortune.
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