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Shot in the dark - coffee business

Free idea I had a few years back and couldnt sell the wife on. We have several Corps of Engineer lakes here that have an absurd amount of recreational boat traffic. What they dont have is my pontoon boat remodelled into a floating bbq/burger boat thru eat'em up joint. Fancied naming it Smoke on the water. Open Memorial day thru Labor Day and hunt all fall. If I was young and single, all y'all could kiss my bass, I'd be hanging on the lake.
 
Good luck to you @Red Beard you're a smart Dude, you're committed to the Lord, you're praying about it.... It will do fine. My neighbor started one over a year ago, she and her husband do well already and I'm assuming he financed the deal. The model that @peteherbst is following for his sounds very similar (bricks and mortar building, a lot of relevant selections but they also serve food stressing "allergen free" menu items.) They seem to be doing well and they're hours are M-F 7am to 2pm, Sat 8am-3pm and Closed Sundays. The whole family works there as well with the exception of one child who lives in NYC. I know the owner is considering adding a bike rental component to it next year as well. It is right smack dab in the middle of our Village. Another faith-based coffee shop also started up in a community next to ours. It used to be a bar and hotel and the current owners do have a drive thru too. It is an old building they have renovated and worked on and I believe many people support it because the building is so nostalgic. My point is it is doing extremely well too with an overall mission blessed by the big guy. Very anecdotal I know but again, both businesses seem to be doing great.
 
… and I'm assuming he financed the deal. …
Forgot to touch on this. 100% completely doable as a self financed option. I think we started ours for around 6k or maybe a little more. The main expense is your espresso machine. It is an extremely deep rabbit hole if you want it to be. But there are really good cheap options too.
 
Man that's awesome. Thank you for the input. What manner of insurance is necessary for a venture like that?
Lot of good info being posted. On the insurance side; You will want to check with an agent that offers a Business Owners Policy (BOP). These are usually fairly inexpensive and cover a bunch of things in one policy. Make sure you carry General Liability in the amount of 1,000,000 per occurrence/2,000,000 Aggregate. This may seem like a lot but its not, and in your case the difference between these limits and the cheapest limits is probably $130.00 a year ( I'm guessing). This covers someone who slips and falls, burns their mouth on coffee and/or gets food poisoning etc.... If you are going to have frozen food items on hand, have the agent quote you "SPOILAGE" on the policy. This is one of our most frequent claims when it comes to the food industry. Make sure you understand the "SPOILAGE Clause" with regards to the "SPOILAGE" endorsement. If you want to cover your machines, tables, chairs etc...... you will want the agent to add "contents" coverage to the policy as well. If you feel like its not with in your budget, you can just have the agent issue you a General Liability policy and then self insure, for the food items, machines, Supplies etc..... Not sure where you are located but Nationwide, Travelers, Hartford etc......... should all offer BOP policies. Once you get employees there are some other things to consider ie....... Workers Comp, Employment Practice Liability etc....... but these are the basics.

The biggest complaint I hear from the food industry is staff. However, that is the biggest complaint from most of my clients, regardless of the industry. Keep in mind that if you hire High School students to man the ice cream counter, you will have to deal with employees needing time off for tests, prom, football games, family vacations etc....... A lot of these will be brought to your attention via text on the day you are scheduled to go out of town with the family. I'm not picking on them as I have two of them, but its reality. Also, you are in the service industry which means people will expect you to be open on days that they are off ie........ holidays.
 
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Free idea I had a few years back and couldnt sell the wife on. We have several Corps of Engineer lakes here that have an absurd amount of recreational boat traffic. What they dont have is my pontoon boat remodelled into a floating bbq/burger boat thru eat'em up joint. Fancied naming it Smoke on the water. Open Memorial day thru Labor Day and hunt all fall. If I was young and single, all y'all could kiss my bass, I'd be hanging on the lake.
We have them down here that will deliver a pizza to you on a jet ski.
 
I started my business from "scratch" in 2004. I was the only employee at the time. While we are not large by any means, we now have two locations and average about 15 full time employees. Personally, I would tell you to really think about what it is you want to do and why you want to do it; if its a side hustle for fun money, then it shouldn't be too difficult or costly, if it doesn't work. If its for a career change and your family is going to live off of it, than that is a whole other animal. Also, are you doing it to make more money, free up time, control your own schedule or for relocation purposes etc........? Assuming its for a carrier change, I would tell you to put together a business plan, with an emphasis on the numbers, marketing and staffing. If nothing else, it will move it from a napkin to a spreadsheet and force you to think about it. Its also pretty cool to look back at and see how far you have come. I would also tell you to start out slow and stream line your expenses as much as possible. You can always spend more money, but its hard to get it back. Somebody has to do it, why not you?
 
I do not own a business but have been fortunate enough to learn what I feel is invaluable information over the 9 years I have spent at a 10 year old company. The two guys that own the company were willing to expose me to quite a bit at a young age.

Failing to plan is planning to fail. You can only shoot from the hip for so long before it negatively impacts your business.
While you might have to update/adjust your plan every quarter, year, etc, it keeps you on track with goals.
When our original plan was put together, we were trying to build our own facility (a huge milestone in our industry) in year 3-4, but it didn’t happen until year 8. Had we not been planning, we probably would not be in here today.

Plan conservatively (especially on expenses), regularly check your progress, and adjust when necessary.

This is obviously just my opinion. Definitely plenty of folks who have hit a lick or grown a successful business while flying by the seat of their pants.
 
Serious question. Do you like making coffee or have any experiences in it? I'm just asking because you seem to have a lot of interests and like working with your hands, things like carpentry, smiting, refurbishing, and crafting. Not saying you have to go to barista school or anything, but what make you considering coffee shop? Other people have bring up good points and different types of small business example. Do you like the concept of owning a small quiet business or is the actual making/serving of coffee is what appeals to you? A plan does sound good, especially the division of responsibility, just like marriage. Are you going to be behind the counter or manning the registry?
 
In my observation the bustling coffee shops around here are more about a "vibe" than the quality of their coffee. And location, location, location.

Coffee is after all a commodity. I know there is "good coffee" and "bad coffee" but there's enough good coffee selections in most places the product itself isn't your differentiator. Imo you gotta nail location and vibe, before your product even enters the discussion.

I've always wondered about the shops where a bunch of people sit on their laptops all morning. Restaurant finance 101 is to maximize your revenue per table, and coffee shops fly in the face of that. I would seriously charge rent for the squatters.

Find your local small business development center and get into some type of mentoring program if you can. There's a lot of minutiae that comes into owning a brick and mortar business and food service adds a whole other layer. Health codes, local ordinances, building codes, ADA compliance, all stuff you absolutely have to get right from the beginning, or it will sink you. You probably need a consultant/lawyer you can trust just on that stuff alone. You can budget for that now and know your good or attempt to DIY it and probably pay the price later. If you need help with the accounting/finance/admin side of things let me know, that's what I do for a living and I give new businesses a huge break in the beginning.

To whoever said you don't need a business plan, I would say that is pretty darn sketchy advice. You may not need a formalized plan you can take to the bank and get a loan with (unless you do, then you do). But you 1000% have to have the fundamentals planned out or you are almost guaranteed to fail. Your vision, basic proof of concept, marketing, competitors, a working financial model, cash flow projections, etc.. If you go into a business with any degree of complexity beyond a lemonade stand, you need that. The plan will change, but you are doomed to fail if you totally fail to plan.
 
In my observation the bustling coffee shops around here are more about a "vibe" than the quality of their coffee. And location, location, location.

Coffee is after all a commodity. I know there is "good coffee" and "bad coffee" but there's enough good coffee selections in most places the product itself isn't your differentiator. Imo you gotta nail location and vibe, before your product even enters the discussion.

I've always wondered about the shops where a bunch of people sit on their laptops all morning. Restaurant finance 101 is to maximize your revenue per table, and coffee shops fly in the face of that. I would seriously charge rent for the squatters.

Find your local small business development center and get into some type of mentoring program if you can. There's a lot of minutiae that comes into owning a brick and mortar business and food service adds a whole other layer. Health codes, local ordinances, building codes, ADA compliance, all stuff you absolutely have to get right from the beginning, or it will sink you. You probably need a consultant/lawyer you can trust just on that stuff alone. You can budget for that now and know your good or attempt to DIY it and probably pay the price later. If you need help with the accounting/finance/admin side of things let me know, that's what I do for a living and I give new businesses a huge break in the beginning.

To whoever said you don't need a business plan, I would say that is pretty darn sketchy advice. You may not need a formalized plan you can take to the bank and get a loan with (unless you do, then you do). But you 1000% have to have the fundamentals planned out or you are almost guaranteed to fail. Your vision, basic proof of concept, marketing, competitors, a working financial model, cash flow projections, etc.. If you go into a business with any degree of complexity beyond a lemonade stand, you need that. The plan will change, but you are doomed to fail if you totally fail to plan.
Business plans are needed when they involve building a location, getting loans, 100k in overhead, banks involved, etc. I could go on.

Everyone is their own person and approaches things differently. So it is a good practice for some and NEEDED for some situations. But I’m telling you that it is WAY simpler than people make it out to be from my experience.
 
Business plans are needed when they involve building a location, getting loans, 100k in overhead, banks involved, etc. I could go on.

Everyone is their own person and approaches things differently. So it is a good practice for some and NEEDED for some situations. But I’m telling you that it is WAY simpler than people make it out to be from my experience.

Yeah I get what you're saying, but at a minimum you need to prove you can be financially viable in a business with a lot of fixed overhead and high service costs. You can willy nilly your to a million bucks in revenue but if you're spending a million to get there, the math don't work. You have to understand your fundamental economics.
 
Yeah I get what you're saying, but at a minimum you need to prove you can be financially viable in a business with a lot of fixed overhead and high service costs. You can willy nilly your to a million bucks in revenue but if you're spending a million to get there, the math don't work. You have to understand your fundamental economics.
Yeah I think we’re talking completely different scales. We are nowhere near 1mil in revenue. And our monthly overhead is less than 10k. Micro business is more my speed. :sweatsmile:
 
Serious question. Do you like making coffee or have any experiences in it? I'm just asking because you seem to have a lot of interests and like working with your hands, things like carpentry, smiting, refurbishing, and crafting. Not saying you have to go to barista school or anything, but what make you considering coffee shop? Other people have bring up good points and different types of small business example. Do you like the concept of owning a small quiet business or is the actual making/serving of coffee is what appeals to you? A plan does sound good, especially the division of responsibility, just like marriage. Are you going to be behind the counter or manning the registry?
All good questions sir. Think you've got me pegged in as far as interests. I love working with my hands, love interface with people, love to tinker, and like repetitious activities. I like the idea of owning a small quiet business. Also, I LOVE COFFEE.

Some folks may eye-roll here, but the greatest draw for me in owning a business would be the ability to speak about God to patrons if they were receptive to it. I've been in an environment for far too long where one can be canned for holding faith related conversations. Think it would be nice to be able to put scripture up on my walls and give a blessing to everyone as I hand them a cup. :)

I'm also not opposed to other ideas folks have introduced here. Great stuff to think about! I mean, the return on investment for shaved ice sounds phenomenal.
 
Some folks may eye-roll here, but the greatest draw for me in owning a business would be the ability to speak about God to patrons if they were receptive to it. I've been in an environment for far too long where one can be canned for holding faith related conversations. Think it would be nice to be able to put scripture up on my walls and give a blessing to everyone as I hand them a cup. :)
Good for you @Red Beard, that’s the best mission statement there can be!!!
 
All good questions sir. Think you've got me pegged in as far as interests. I love working with my hands, love interface with people, love to tinker, and like repetitious activities. I like the idea of owning a small quiet business. Also, I LOVE COFFEE.

Some folks may eye-roll here, but the greatest draw for me in owning a business would be the ability to speak about God to patrons if they were receptive to it. I've been in an environment for far too long where one can be canned for holding faith related conversations. Think it would be nice to be able to put scripture up on my walls and give a blessing to everyone as I hand them a cup. :)

I'm also not opposed to other ideas folks have introduced here. Great stuff to think about! I mean, the return on investment for shaved ice sounds phenomenal.

You really should come to St Louis and check out my neighborhood coffee shop. It is faith community coffee shop. They have bible study every few nights along with other non-religious groups that meet regularly there. They even have a young pastor that works as a barista and teaches sermons on Sundays for small groups of about 20 to 25 people. I have lived in the neighborhood for 3 years and they get a new pastor every year. I think they help young pastors get experience before they move on other places. It is a pretty cool coffee shop.
 
I just had a thought - we have a local Christian coffee roaster. He's a decently big local presence, some local restaurants proudly feature his products, and he's doing everything out of his garage. Granted, it's a pretty big detached garage, but still.

Years ago I had the idea of getting my FFL and starting a side hustle doing Cerakote-ing and light gunsmithing. Then I met a buddy who does the same, plus retail, plus laser engraving. My main impediments are time, absolute lack of artistic skill, and the general political hostility towards the firearms industry at the moment. I still might do it to augment my retirement, just not as a side hustle.
 
I just had a thought - we have a local Christian coffee roaster. He's a decently big local presence, some local restaurants proudly feature his products, and he's doing everything out of his garage. Granted, it's a pretty big detached garage, but still.

Years ago I had the idea of getting my FFL and starting a side hustle doing Cerakote-ing and light gunsmithing. Then I met a buddy who does the same, plus retail, plus laser engraving. My main impediments are time, absolute lack of artistic skill, and the general political hostility towards the firearms industry at the moment. I still might do it to augment my retirement, just not as a side hustle.
My question is, why wait? Make the time and start doing it on the side and you might be surprised at what you’ll be able to make work financially.
 
My question is, why wait? Make the time and start doing it on the side and you might be surprised at what you’ll be able to make work financially.
Fair point. Right now, it's the time commitment. I'm exceedingly reluctant to take time away from my family. I've got a toddler and I'm lucky to see her for an hour before she goes to bed. When she gets old enough to participate in more of what I'm doing then that will open up a bunch of opportunities for me.
 
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