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SRT Climbing - Anchors, Hitches, Configurations

gcr0003

gcr0003

Well-Known Member
SH Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
8,060
I wanted to get some questions flowing about SRT. I found some old threads regarding the basics of SRT all the way back to 2017 but none of threads I glanced over went over much detail over just the basics (how many feet of rope, etc.). I would like to hear from some of you seasoned SRT guys that have used some form of SRT for a significant portion of their hunts. I am hoping we have some guys that still use SRT or used it enough in the past to offer up some good first hand experience. I'd love to keep the conversation geared toward SRT specifically the ins and outs without divulging into whether or not its useful or ideal in a hunting situation, or the best climbing method.

Some starter questions I have in mind are about anchors. A recent thread discussing the pros and cons of another method of rope climbing (the JRB Method) discussed the benefits of a basal anchor which SRT climbers can use. I too was able to see the benefits of using a basal anchor in a situation where your throwball goes up and over or around several limbs before reaching the limb you want to climb. Having it anchored to the trunk of the tree, from what I understand, allows you to climb the rope that is hanging over the single limb you want to climb without having to fish your throw ball/rope perfectly over that single limb without going around other limbs.
  1. How many of you have had situations where you used a basal anchor?
  2. How have you tied your basal anchor? Running bowling w/ yosemite follow through is one I see a lot or do you use a tether/lanyard specific to anchoring.
  3. Do you ever include a butterfly knot in you anchor for rescue? My thought would be it doesn't really hurt anything or add much to the system so you might as well?
  4. Have you ever been busted because of your basal anchor i.e. deer smelling your rope at the base of the tree? My thought is that you could increase the height of your anchor but that would likely out weigh the benefits of the self rescue and might not even help much at all.
The next thing I'd like to talk about is friction hitches, rope wrenchs, and other progress capture devices. I am curious about the different configurations y'all have tried and liked and also configurations you tried and didn't like. Feel free to share what hitches, devices, and combinations you have used. I have read a lot of positive things about SRT RADS / YOYO but I am not sure if that is the route I want to go. I am almost tempted to go a more friction hitch route, but not sure the exact set up I would go with at this time. I have climbing MRS (dDRT?) using a blakes hitch and foot loop on an ascender so my initial though go toward making something like that work.

I love picture too. I find it fascinating all the splices, hitches, and tenders @Brocky comes up with or makes. I am wondering what type of rope climbing he does. I am gonna go ahead and tag @redsquirrel (here your chance to sell me on your SRT stuff in the classifieds), I also think @JFin15 was doing quite a bit of rope climbing recently so I'd love any input you have as well. I have seen a lot of @bj139 videos trying different methods of SRT and I think @Treehopper2 @JCLINE84 might SRT or has SRT'd and @kyler1945 had a thread about RADS? @mtsrunner i think I saw you commenting on anchors the other day? Tag anyone else you know that has experience with these methods and might care to offer some experience to the conversation. Also, If there is a extensive SRT specific thread that I overlooked feel free to chew me out and then kindly send me a link!

1628272672485.png
 
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Base anchor:
In my past life, I have used these with a tensionless hitch but never with SRT solely because I don't carry enough rope to make this effective. It does offer advantages when there are multiple limbs involved but would require another rope purchase to accomplish.

Hitches and mechanicals:
I've climbed/descended using...
- Prusik cords
- Klemheist hitch w/ hollowblock
- Munter hitch
- Madrock
- 8 plate
- Kong Duck
- Ropeman 1
- Petzl hand ascender

(2) prusik cords and (1) carabiner are the cheapest option to go up/down but is also the slowest, especially on the descent. A munter hitch should absolutely be known by everyone for an emergency descent option. Initially I went up/down on a Madrock but have switched to a Duck going up an 8 plate going down. While nothing wrong with the Madrock, I was never comfortable with taking tension off of it when at height when moving around.

Prior to the Petzl hand ascender, I rigged my own hand ascender using a Ropeman 1 and a carabiner. While functional, it took more time to setup and I tended to give my finger a rope burn. I don't have any pictures of this setup but can take some if interested.

I'm a fan of the klemheist due to its simplicity in setup and operation as well as its ability to be loosened under load. I know that there are many other hitches out there but for me, KISS wins out on this one.
 
MNFarmHunter said:
Base anchor:
In my past life, I have used these with a tensionless hitch but never with SRT solely because I don't carry enough rope to make this effective. It does offer advantages when there are multiple limbs involved but would require another rope purchase to accomplish.

Hitches and mechanicals:
I've climbed/descended using...
- Prusik cords
- Klemheist hitch w/ hollowblock
- Munter hitch
- Madrock
- 8 plate
- Kong Duck
- Ropeman 1
- Petzl hand ascender

(2) prusik cords and (1) carabiner are the cheapest option to go up/down but is also the slowest, especially on the descent. A munter hitch should absolutely be known by everyone for an emergency descent option. Initially I went up/down on a Madrock but have switched to a Duck going up an 8 plate going down. While nothing wrong with the Madrock, I was never comfortable with taking tension off of it when at height when moving around.

Prior to the Petzl hand ascender, I rigged my own hand ascender using a Ropeman 1 and a carabiner. While functional, it took more time to setup and I tended to give my finger a rope burn. I don't have any pictures of this setup but can take some if interested.

I'm a fan of the klemheist due to its simplicity in setup and operation as well as its ability to be loosened under load. I know that there are many other hitches out there but for me, KISS wins out on this one.
Click to expand...
So what you settled with is a a petzl hand ascender (w/ a foot loop I presume) and a klemhiest?
Are all of your anchors are typically canopy anchors? Do you use as little rope as possible and therefore use a separate pull rope to get your rope down or do you use a butterfly knot on the main rope itself? My first thought was that if you threw your ball over say a 30ft limb and climbed you hunted at 20' you would need to climb up to 30' to hook your pull down rope if you were using a short rope unless you connected the rope before hand and just stored it somewhere while you were hunting so you could pull it down after. Do you typically re-tether into the tree once at your desired hunting height or do you stay on your SRT rope?
 
gcr0003 said:
I wanted to get some questions flowing about SRT. I found some old threads regarding the basics of SRT all the way back to 2017 but none of threads I glanced over went over much detail over just the basics (how many feet of rope, etc.). I would like to hear from some of you seasoned SRT guys that have used some form of SRT for a significant portion of their hunts. I am hoping we have some guys that still use SRT or used it enough in the past to offer up some good first hand experience. I'd love to keep the conversation geared toward SRT specifically the ins and outs without divulging into whether or not its useful or ideal in a hunting situation, or the best climbing method.

Some starter questions I have in mind are about anchors. A recent thread discussing the pros and cons of another method of rope climbing (the JRB Method) discussed the benefits of a basal anchor which SRT climbers can use. I too was able to see the benefits of using a basal anchor in a situation where your throwball goes up and over or around several limbs before reaching the limb you want to climb. Having it anchored to the trunk of the tree, from what I understand, allows you to climb the rope that is hanging over the single limb you want to climb without having to fish your throw ball/rope perfectly over that single limb without going around other limbs.
  1. How many of you have had situations where you used a basal anchor?
  2. How have you tied your basal anchor? Running bowling w/ yosemite follow through is one I see a lot or do you use a tether/lanyard specific to anchoring.
  3. Do you ever include a butterfly knot in you anchor for rescue? My thought would be it doesn't really hurt anything or add much to the system so you might as well?
  4. Have you ever been busted because of your basal anchor i.e. deer smelling your rope at the base of the tree? My thought is that you could increase the height of your anchor but that would likely out weigh the benefits of the self rescue and might not even help much at all.
The next thing I'd like to talk about is friction hitches, rope wrenchs, and other progress capture devices. I am curious about the different configurations y'all have tried and liked and also configurations you tried and didn't like. Feel free to share what hitches, devices, and combinations you have used. I have read a lot of positive things about SRT RADS / YOYO but I am not sure if that is the route I want to go. I am almost tempted to go a more friction hitch route, but not sure the exact set up I would go with at this time. I have climbing MRS (dDRT?) using a blakes hitch and foot loop on an ascender so my initial though go toward making something like that work.

I love picture too. I find it fascinating all the splices, hitches, and tenders @Brocky comes up with or makes. I am wondering what type of rope climbing he does. I am gonna go ahead and tag @redsquirrel (here your chance to sell me on your SRT stuff in the classifieds), I also think @JFin15 was doing quite a bit of rope climbing recently so I'd love any input you have as well. I have seen a lot of @bj139 videos trying different methods of SRT and I think @Treehopper2 @JCLINE84 might SRT or has SRT'd and @kyler1945 had a thread about RADS? @mtsrunner i think I saw you commenting on anchors the other day? Tag anyone else you know that has experience with these methods and might care to offer some experience to the conversation. Also, If there is a extensive SRT specific thread that I overlooked feel free to chew me out and then kindly send me a link!

View attachment 50549
Click to expand...

Thanks for starting this. I’ll be following it closely!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Sorry, should have been more specific.

I canopy anchor with 40' of C-IV using a rigging ring instead of a delta link. I found that the tag end would sometimes get hung up on the delta ring compared to the continuous radius of a rigging ring. The ring is currently 28mm and have a 40mm on order to see if I notice any difference. I also have 50' of Resc Tech that I was trying out but have decided to leave this rope as a backup. While about 2k# stronger and lighter, I found that my climbing style didn't work well with the Resc Tech.

With my presets, I use that line as my retrieval rope. Otherwise, I can use my bow hoist rope as the retrieval rope. Prior to the anchor end going up in the tree, I tie the retrieval line double overhand behind the knot.

For climbing, I use a Petzl hand ascender (with foot loop) and a Kong Duck to climb and hunt. The Duck replaced the Madrock due to my noted concerns of taking tension off the Madrock once at hunting height. When ready to rappel and with the Duck still connected, I attach my 8 plate to my line/bridge and take up the slack. Once the 8 plate is carrying my load, I disconnect the Duck. When rigged like a traditional 8, I use the klemheist as my safety. However, I've since started using my 8 plate side loaded (not sure the technical term) that self locks and don't use the klemheist for this. If I need to work hands-free, I 1/2 hitch the standing end around the 8 plate neck.

Typically, I will be hunting from my SRT line as I try to get my presets positioned so that I climb the side of the tree I want to hunt from. However, there are (2) presets that I could only get on the non-hunt side. For those trees, I'll climb, set my platform, step around the truck and use a "standard" tether to keep me on the side that I want. Once at height, the standing end of the rope gets pulled up and stuffed in my saddle pouch.
 
I should add one more note...until the next one.

In the argument between hitches vs. mechanicals, there is no right answer. Arguably, hitches are lighter, simpler, shouldn't damage your rope and are far cheaper. However, I have a bad habit of grabbing my tether when shifting from leaning to sitting to standing and the hitch just seems to be a natural thing to grab for. When using hitches, your hands should never touch them unless you are moving them. Therefore, I use mechanicals as this isn't really an issue but this comes at a cost of more weight, possible damage to ropes and significant cost (comparatively speaking).
 
MNFarmHunter said:
Sorry, should have been more specific.

I canopy anchor with 40' of C-IV using a rigging ring instead of a delta link. I found that the tag end would sometimes get hung up on the delta ring compared to the continuous radius of a rigging ring. The ring is currently 28mm and have a 40mm on order to see if I notice any difference. I also have 50' of Resc Tech that I was trying out but have decided to leave this rope as a backup. While about 2k# stronger and lighter, I found that my climbing style didn't work well with the Resc Tech.

With my presets, I use that line as my retrieval rope. Otherwise, I can use my bow hoist rope as the retrieval rope. Prior to the anchor end going up in the tree, I tie the retrieval line double overhand behind the knot.

For climbing, I use a Petzl hand ascender (with foot loop) and a Kong Duck to climb and hunt. The Duck replaced the Madrock due to my noted concerns of taking tension off the Madrock once at hunting height. When ready to rappel and with the Duck still connected, I attach my 8 plate to my line/bridge and take up the slack. Once the 8 plate is carrying my load, I disconnect the Duck. When rigged like a traditional 8, I use the klemheist as my safety. However, I've since started using my 8 plate side loaded (not sure the technical term) that self locks and don't use the klemheist for this. If I need to work hands-free, I 1/2 hitch the standing end around the 8 plate neck.

Typically, I will be hunting from my SRT line as I try to get my presets positioned so that I climb the side of the tree I want to hunt from. However, there are (2) presets that I could only get on the non-hunt side. For those trees, I'll climb, set my platform, step around the truck and use a "standard" tether to keep me on the side that I want. Once at height, the standing end of the rope gets pulled up and stuffed in my saddle pouch.
Click to expand...
I am not sure what you mean buy rigging ring? Do you mean a continuous ring, a thimble, or a rigging ring tree sling? Could you share a stock photo from website or something?

Thanks for clarifying are your climbing method. I am only assuming that because of your name you hunt your farm or a farm in MN? Is that correct. Do you just leave a paracord loop around the limb you want to hunt as your preset or something different? I have also heard of "false crotches" for presets? Do you know of a good resource for this method of preset? Have you used something similar before?
 
Correct. Since I hunt on private land, I have the luxury of putting presets wherever I want and leaving them there. I probably wouldn't do SRT on public land as I'm not good enough with a throwball to make it on the first, second or fifth throw.

I should also note that many of these things are either adapted from or directly taken from other members here. This is also what I've found works best for me though I am always experimenting and this may not be what I use when I finally get into the woods to hunt.

Picture thread!!!

This is how both ends of my SRT rope are setup. The dyna-glide looped end gets pulled up and over the limb with the preset paracord passing through the rigging ring so that the tag end threads through the ring as it gets pulled up to anchor.
20210806_152409.jpg

When anchoring in the canopy, you can anchor either on a big limb or small limb. It is simply a matter of where you end up girth hitching.
Big limb:
Big limb.png
Small limb:
Little Branch.png

For rappelling, this is how I'm currently running my 8 plate. When I need to go hands-free, I'll 1/2 hitch the standing end around the neck of the 8 plate:
20210801_104755.jpg
 
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Rope storage.

This is another point of contention. Some will wrap it around their arm in a loop, some will wrap it in a figure 8 and some will simply ball it up before stuffing it in a bag. Personally, I prefer the stuff sack method. All you need to do is take the end you won't use first, stick that into the bag then simply stuff the rest of the rope into the bag by feeding the line into the bag until everything is in there. Once back on the ground, I'll use the retrieval rope to bring my knot/ring down, stuff that immediately into my bag and keep stuffing the rope as I pull the rest out of the tree.

By doing it this way, you rope should never need to touch the ground (important in wet, muddy or snowy conditions). This method will also allow the rope to cleanly feed out of the bag without knots or twists. It'll look like a birds nest when you look at it but this is the best method I know of.
20210630_144617.jpg
 
I have climbed primarily SRT for the last several years (beginning with a cheap rock climbing type harness and conventional lock-on stands before I bought a saddle) and for the woods that I hunt it’s ideal. I use spurs from time to time as well, but I really enjoy the speed, light weight of the equipment, and the ease of adapting to a wide variety of trees.

If I have enough rope, I use a basal anchor. I wrap the end of the rooe opposite of my ‘climbing side’ around the trunk several times, and then tie a figure-eight-on-a-bight on the end, and then use a carabiner to attach this loop to the rope that goes up the tree, and the anchor is set. I don’t try to set up to be lowered like in the diagram. I haven’t seen deer spook from the basal anchor but I do take care to keep foreign odors off my rope.
 
Blacktail said:
If I have enough rope, I use a basal anchor. I wrap the end of the rooe opposite of my ‘climbing side’ around the trunk several times, and then tie a figure-eight-on-a-bight on the end, and then use a carabiner to attach this loop to the rope that goes up the tree, and the anchor is set.
Click to expand...
That's a tensionless hitch. They work very well as you're using your weight to tighten the wraps around the trunk like a boa constrictor. The end loop/carabiner are only there as a safety in the event the loops slip.
 
MNFarmHunter said:
That's a tensionless hitch. They work very well as you're using your weight to tighten the wraps around the trunk like a boa constrictor. The end loop/carabiner are only there as a safety in the event the loops slip.
Click to expand...

I never really thought of it like that but you’re right, it is a tensionless hitch, and the figure eight and carabiner addition is a backup
 
I use my Roperunner regardless of either a canopy or basal climbing process is the same. I use my platform and a cinched line to access the tree when I don't have a preset . I used the Rope Wrench for years and met Kevin Bingham when he was first developing it. We used to use a Kong Robot above the hitch to create the additional friction. When I reach the tree I just thread the Roperunner up from the bottom of the rope and don't have to disassemble and fumble with parts ( but have done it hundreds of times and it is second nature). I started out using double rope technique and it definitely is a good choice because I learned how to advance upward and all you had to do is throw over the lowest branch. I kinda do a hybrid technique that I advance through the canopy with srt.
 
I’ve experimented with several types of ascenders and belay devices. I once made a setup with just carabiners, prusiks, and a figure 8, just to see if I could, and it worked. I eventually settled on a Petzl Rig for my belay device. I have mostly used a Petzl basic or ascension and a rollclip carabiner (sometimes with a foot loop) for the ascender, but coincidentally I just received a CT Quick Roll yesterday and climbed a few trees with it. This CT Quick Roll is a hand ascender with an integral pulley so there’s one less thing to make noise compared to the ascension + roll clip. I still haven’t decided if I like it better than the ascension+roll clip. Either one of these gets attached to my saddle with a piece of webbing as a backup to my belay device. Maybe it’s not much of a backup but it’s cheap and light.

That Petzl Rig belay device is large and expensive, but I feel really safe hanging from it. I have a slight (perhaps just healthy) fear of heights so this is pretty important to me. It is so smooth going both up and down. It has a locking position, and it doesn’t have an anti-panic feature. I have a mad rock safeguard as well, but I don’t feel as good in it and it’s a little more jerky on the descent. I really like how small and packable it is, but I just don’t feel as safe while hanging from it. One of these days I’ll try an auto block on it and maybe that will change my opinion.

I often leave the foot loop in my pouch if I can reach the trunk with my feet while I climb, which is most of the time on conifers but not on the big gnarly oaks. I just keep my feet on the trunk and walk up it while I pull myself up with my ascender/belay device. But if I’m suspended outward from the trunk too far to touch it at any point in the climb, I clip a Petzl foot tape into the bottom of my ascender with a little old non-rated, non-gated aluminum carabiner.

I usually tether-in with a dedicated tether and stow my belay device and climbing rope, because I just want to clear out my ‘workspace’ as much as possible and I don’t want my climbing rope to restrict my mobility around the tree. Like I said, that Rig is big. It makes a lot of sense to use the climbing rope as a backup, though. I’ve been thinking of connecting it to my saddle with a ropeman or the like, while I hang from my tether.
 
Brocky said:
A couple more ring options, low friction ring and ART’s Tunnel Ring.
View attachment 50578
Click to expand...

On a second look…your using poachers knots instead of scaffold knots? Any particular reason why? I recently had a long, bitter battle to untie a scaffold and was thinking of using the poachers going forward….


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