Starting the road of traditional bow, what do you recommend for beginner to focus on with limited time and budget?

[HuumanCreed]

Backstory,

I followed the principle, practice at double the distance of the longest shot you would take on a live animal. So I never plan to take a shot passed 25 yards (maybe 30 if the situation call for it in good conditions).

I was shooting my compound bow yesterday. I was able to get a fist size group at about 50 yards (yes, from a saddle at different positions at different target). Even with different types of arrow builds I was still grouping as long as I adjust the sights for each arrow based on weight/FOC/etc. Not bragging, just stating what lead to my decision. I just felt that I was at a good point in my skill level when it comes to accuracy, that I'm at a good point in what my bow and I can do before I have to seriously invest in time and money for major improvement (like a bow press, fletching jig, etc).

So I felt like I was at a decision point. Do I want to dedicate anymore of my limited hobby time to practicing shooting my compound bow or focus on another aspect of bowhunting. There were a lot of factors that I had to decide, because family come first and I couldn't just be gone hours in the wood 'doing stuff'. But It wasn't hard to take 15-20 mins here and there to fire a few arrows then go drink imaginary tea with my girls.

At first I considered moving toward improving my archery skills beyond hunting. Like get those target bows that have 3 ft. long stabilizers and lizard tongue arrow rest and magnifying peep sights. But wow just looking at some of the prices and the attention to details required for fine tuning bow to shoot pennies at 50 yards, I don't think I have the passion for that, I admired people that do because you can tell they care about every ounces that improve their balance and they can tell what is better simply based on how a bow 'feels'. I honestly have never been able to do that.

So I look at traditional bowhunting and I think its going to be my next focus. Its going to be a lot of research but I just have a renew zest just thinking about it. So I'm on a look out for a entry level bow like the Samick Sage on Ebay. Good/bad thing about being a lefty is that good deals on used bows don't happen a lot because there is not much out there and if someone has one, they have trouble selling it for high value!

So right now, I stripped by backup compound bow to bared and dialed all the way down to 25 lbs. Shooting at 10 yards with gloves until I find a traditional bow. In the mean time, what should I focus my research on to get a good starts?

Are common plastic vanes really that bad? If feathers, would I get decent performance from Amazon/eBay full feathered arrows?

What is a good beginner aiming technique? Fixed crawl is what I'm considering, instinctive sound like something that just HAPPENS as you keep shooting.

I'm 5 ft 8 in with 27.5 draw length. What size bow should I look into that 'stacking' feel the best?

Are the forms in shooting a trad the same as compound except a cant to the bow? I see a lot more head leaning into the bow compare to keeping head straight.

would using a biscuit in the beginning ok or will it teach me bad habit once I start shooting off the shelf?

Any and all help is appreciated! Thank you again to the great community.

 

[arrow30]

Galaxy Ember 60” Takedown Longbow

A classic look on a takedown longbow Beautiful wooden textures and traditional feeling Takes down for easy packing and storage Limbs are constructed of bamboo Backed and faced with black high strength fiberglass Shoots like a dream Includes 60" AMO bowstring Recommended brace height: 7-1/2” – 8”...

www.lancasterarchery.com

you dont want a biscket on a real bow, it will cause more problems .just shoot off of the shelf.
plastic feathers are not the best to use but you can get by with them for awhile , but real feathers are better in my opinion. and recommended.
dont plan on making very long shots with a trad bow, its gonna take awhile to get good enough to put a arrow in a small group without even thinking about it.
and i would not be thinking about any of that crawl stuff till you really learn to shoot weather you decide on split or three under.
you need to keep it simple. im really not into giving advise but i thought i would throw that out there. oh, keep it simple and have fun!

 

[gumby]

I know there are folks here that can answer your questions. I do know a couple things, shoot feathers, you might get by with plastic with a past center cut riser but even then feathers would be best. I going to answer this and ask at the same time, I just did a graph on four bows on draw cycle and stacking, each bow was 28 in. All four bows had a steady draw up to 28 inches, no peaks or dips, there was no stacking, so what is stacking supposed to be?

 

[arrow30]

stacking would be the bow pulling more than a couple pounds per inch of draw when you get back close to your draw length.
basicly more weight than you can handle . just like shooting a bow that is to heavy for you.

 

[HuumanCreed]

From what I understand with my limited experience. Its basically how the bow is shaped and stored energy. There is a 'sweet spot' that provide the most effective energy input/output before you are not gaining much despite the force required to pull. That's how you determined if a bow is smooth and the right shape for you. Like a limbs would only bent so much before its too hard to bend but if it doesnt bend enough, you are not maximizing the power potential of the bow. You know what, I feel like i said alot of big words but didnt really say anything....

Ok, stacking is when you reach a point in the draw that getting harder then it is worth. That is why shorter people with short draw length use shorter ATA bow, after a certain point, its not an effecient use of strength.

 

[Vtbow]

Buy a bow that fits you and isn't over powered(samick sage is very highly regarded for the price and you can get heavier limbs down the road) Get some arrows that fit the "zone" I like aluminum, they're easy to get in the zone, and cheap and rugged. Shoot ALOT. A REAL REAL LOT at like 10 yards. dont get too hung up on much, just shoot. When you hit right where you're aiming smile and be happy. keep doing it....

If you;re shooting off the shelf, you need fletching, if you;re going to use a rest(NOT A BISCUIT!, a flipper or bear weather rest or something of that sort), vanes are fine.

Did I mention Shoot A LOT and dont over think it?

 

[BTaylor]

I would recommend looking at some of the entry level ILF setups. You can get in to a good shooting bow for well under $500. It would also allow you to start with lower poundage limbs and move up in weight by changing limbs. Might want to consider signing up for Tom Clum Sr.'s online course too.

 

[BTaylor]

Here is a link to thread on Rokslide that has a good bit of info on ILF rigs.

Beginner ILF Recurve Under $500

I want to get an ILF recurve to start shooting around with, may try to hunt with it in the future but mainly just looking for a new discipline to dive into. Anyone have any recommendations on a solid ILF recurve setup for under $500?

www.rokslide.com

 

[HuumanCreed]

I heard that ILF bows are loud due to the design of limbs pockets. Any experiences? I would like to hunt with the bow someday.

 

[Joedirt199]

Get a copy of "shooting the stick bow" covers everything about traditional/olympic style archery. Consider it the bible of learning archery.

 

[Vtbow]

I heard that ILF bows are loud due to the design of limbs pockets. Any experiences? I would like to hunt with the bow someday.

The tradtech titan I had(ilf) was very quiet....it all depends on your tune and setup...

Dont worry about that now...spend a couple hundred bucks on a bow and start shooting....

 

[Joedirt199]

I started with a samick sage 30# and 45# limbs. 30s for practice and 45 for hunting. Shoots and sets up really easy. Very quiet once you get arrows and string sorted out.

 

[gumby]

If you go with Ilf, make sure you order limb pounds that match your riser length, unless stated they are rated for 25 inch risers by pound wt.

 

[Mike Burch]

I’ve shot traditional bows my whole life. From high dollar customs to old productions. What I’ve learned, they all will do the job if it fits you. Ive never owned one, but I’ve read the Black Hunter bows shoot nice and are easy on the wallet. They look nice! Just don’t over bow yourself.

I’m sorta of a bowaholic. They come and go here, I just like trying different bows. Some stayed longer than others, but I will eventually get the itch for a different one. Longbow or recurve.

I can‘t really help on an aiming technique. I would call what I do is a instinctive split vision. I just look at what I want to hit, I kinda see my arrow in my peripheral, and when the sight picture is good, it’s gone. I’m only confident out to 20-25 yards like this and I like it better even closer. I don’t target shoot tho, just bowhunting. I shoot split finger, but a lot of great shooters shoot 3 under and use some type of gap system and string walk you talk about. I’ve never gave it much of a try, but it definitely works for folks.

I would shoot off the shelf or a feather rest. I would think the whisker biscuit would block your view somewhat, but hey ya never know...I guess it would depend on your anchor point.

I have a 29.5” draw and like bows 60” and longer. With a 27.5” draw like yourself, I would think most 58” bows and up will fit you good, without much stack. Finger pinch is what gets me with shorter bows.

As for as 2 blades, I’ve liked the Magnus Stingers, STOS, and Simmons. Simmons are my favorite 2 blades..just a bigger cut. I mostly shoot the VPA 3 blades, because they seem to penetrate just as well and sharpen easy. But at the end of the day, they all will get it done if you do your part with a tuned setup in the boiler room. Here’s a few pics of different bows I’ve enjoyed hunting with over the years. Most all these were with the VPAs, Snuffers, Wensel Woodsmans, and Simmons.

 

[Mike Burch]

Here’s a Black Widow PSR I owned a while back. It was the shortest bow Ive owned at 56”. It actually shot pretty good at my draw. The next bow pictured is a Hill Country K2 3 piece recurve, and they are sweet shooting as well. Keep an eye out in the traditional bow classifieds around the net. A lot of good deals come around.

 

[HuumanCreed]

That's a lot of nice harvests. Curious, you never felt the itch to go compound? Haha, you are literally holding a different bow in each picture. Guess its true that its not the bow, its the hunter.

 

[Mike Burch]

That's a lot of nice harvests. Curious, you never felt the itch to go compound? Haha, you are literally holding a different bow in each picture. Guess its true that its not the bow, its the hunter.

Oh yeah, I’ve owned a couple compounds. Killed a few deer with them. They are deadly, for sure. I just like the simplicity of a stickbow. Just something about them. Built with very nice woods. Some are functional works of art. A lot of time are put into them.

Funny story, I was about 14 years old at the time, I was shooting my longbow and I was having trouble hitting good groups at distance. I told my old man about it. He said, “where are hitting good at right now?“ I said, “I’m good at 10-15 yards.” He said, “Well, just learn to get within 10-15 yards then!“ I’ve pretty much took that advice my whole life.

 

[tyson12590]

Amazon.com : SinoArt 60" Takedown Long Bow Archery Wooden Archery Bow Included Fur Rest Pad Stringer Tool Tab String Nocks Left Hand for Hunting or Target (Left Hand 35lbs) : Sports & Outdoors

The Samick Sage is a solid option for begginners. I prefer the black hunter. You can get it as a recurve or a longbow. If you have a moral issue with buying direct from china you can buy it from Lancaster Archery or Twig Archery for around $200. If you dont mind buying direct from china you can buy it for about $115 off amazon or ebay. I would recommend getting one in either 30 or 35lbs and then uprgrading to 45Lb limbs once your form is solid. You will not have any stacking issues with most 60" bows.

While a standard takedown bow (non ILF) is not ideal for shooting a fixed crawl it can be done on the black hunter. I used that very set up my first year and it worked quite well. It makes the bow a bit louder but thats the only down side. If you go with the fixed crawl, place your nock about .75" above center to reduce the vibration. Start with about a 1" crawl and see how it goes.

I recoomend trying to shoot instinctive and see how you do. If after a while you aren't getting the consistency you want then give string walking or gap shooting a try. They all work great but you have to find what you like and dont be afraid to experiement. I started with a fixed crawl and I liked it but I ended up switching to a very high anchor point (ring finger on corner of lip) where I am point-on at 20 yards and if my mind goes blank I can shoot instictive from that anchor very well. You have to find what works for you. As far as form, start with how you shoot your compound but add a very slight cant. If that doesnt work try different things.

As far as arrows, it depends on what draw weight you end up shooting. I like Gold tips because you can add weight to the back of the insert to adjust your FOC and overall arrow weight. If you end up between 45lbs and 50lbs you will likely be good with a 500 spine but that depends on many factors. Feathers are a must IMO.

Traditional archery is not for everybody but it is a very rewarding sport. Ive been hunting traditional for three seasons and Ive killed five deer and missed a few others . It has been a blast. At the very worst you can sell all your gear and only be out a little money if you end up not liking it. Chances are you will like it because there is something about shooting traditional that is addicting. There is tons of great traditional archery info on youtube so take adavantage of that. Best of luck and dont be afraid to post your questions as you go. Lastly, Traditional archery is a journey not a destination so dont get too caught up in the details just enjoy the experience.

 

[HuumanCreed]

Amazon.com : SinoArt 60" Takedown Long Bow Archery Wooden Archery Bow Included Fur Rest Pad Stringer Tool Tab String Nocks Left Hand for Hunting or Target (Left Hand 35lbs) : Sports & Outdoors

The Samick Sage is a solid option for begginners. I prefer the black hunter. You can get it as a recurve or a longbow. If you have a moral issue with buying direct from china you can buy it from Lancaster Archery or Twig Archery for around $200. If you dont mind buying direct from china you can buy it for about $115 off amazon or ebay. I would recommend getting one in either 30 or 35lbs and then uprgrading to 45Lb limbs once your form is solid. You will not have any stacking issues with most 60" bows.

While a standard takedown bow (non ILF) is not ideal for shooting a fixed crawl it can be done on the black hunter. I used that very set up my first year and it worked quite well. It makes the bow a bit louder but thats the only down side. If you go with the fixed crawl, place your nock about .75" above center to reduce the vibration. Start with about a 1" crawl and see how it goes.

I recoomend trying to shoot instinctive and see how you do. If after a while you aren't getting the consistency you want then give string walking or gap shooting a try. They all work great but you have to find what you like and dont be afraid to experiement. I started with a fixed crawl and I liked it but I ended up switching to a very high anchor point (ring finger on corner of lip) where I am point-on at 20 yards and if my mind goes blank I can shoot instictive from that anchor very well. You have to find what works for you. As far as form, start with how you shoot your compound but add a very slight cant. If that doesnt work try different things.

As far as arrows, it depends on what draw weight you end up shooting. I like Gold tips because you can add weight to the back of the insert to adjust your FOC and overall arrow weight. If you end up between 45lbs and 50lbs you will likely be good with a 500 spine but that depends on many factors. Feathers are a must IMO.

Traditional archery is not for everybody but it is a very rewarding sport. Ive been hunting traditional for three seasons and Ive killed five deer and missed a few others . It has been a blast. At the very worst you can sell all your gear and only be out a little money if you end up not liking it. Chances are you will like it because there is something about shooting traditional that is addicting. There is tons of great traditional archery info on youtube so take adavantage of that. Best of luck and dont be afraid to post your questions as you go. Lastly, Traditional archery is a journey not a destination so dont get too caught up in the details just enjoy the experience.

That's the plan. I dont feel the pressure to be good at it. Its a wonderful feeling knowing that I'm just shooting for fun. Plus now I have to learn a whole different tuning method, tune arrow, not bow.

 

[mattpsu1]

I would recommend looking at some of the entry level ILF setups. You can get in to a good shooting bow for well under $500. It would also allow you to start with lower poundage limbs and move up in weight by changing limbs. Might want to consider signing up for Tom Clum Sr.'s online course too.

Xs 100 on the Tom Clum Sr course. Tons of valuable information and it might help prevent from building bad habits and then having to relearn proper technique. I recently went through the course and I have been thoroughly impressed already. Shooting better already and I’m building a solid foundation to move forward on. And much more consistent. Get some bands and put in the work before you even pick up a bare bow and you will be much further ahead and be glad you did later