Cranford's weigh less and cost less. 1/3 the price of squirrel steps. With the Timber hitch the Nut demonstrated they win the speed battle also. That said if I had to choose something other than the Treehopper it would be Wild Edge steps but it's hardwoods here so tree damage is not a problem. I worry more about getting busted climbing than how fast I can climb. It's not a drag race where the one that gets there first wins.
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The Best Public-Legal Climbing Method
- Thread starter Nutterbuster
- Start date
blzn04
Active Member
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2018
- Messages
- 117
After kicking it around since @DanO sent me the first prototype back in november of last year, I finally pulled the trigger and bought 8 of them. Bear in mind this happened about 3 days after I bought the LWCG minis to try. Even though I think that those are definitely the best stock sticks available (despite the fact that they are super expensive and not exactly as-promised) they still suck to pack and carry, especially since I am so accustomed to a small roll of bolts and a treehopper drill.
For those who havent done the math on 8 steps with straps and OCB buckles, they weigh roughly 4.5lbs, and fit in a 5 step wild edge step bag with room to spare. They fit inside every single backpack and fanny pack I own, and can be unpacked and slung over a shoulder (ready to climb) in less than a minute. They do not clank, slide around on the tree, or require the use of aiders. They can be completely silenced with inexpensive vet tape.
They're basically perfect.
I spent an awesome weekend with @denots and @kyler1945, and had a chance to video me and denots climbing the same tree. To get to 16ft, it took both of us 4.5 minutes. I unpacked, set, and climbed 8 steps in the time it took him to hang 2 sticks with 5 step aiders. It took him a total of 6.5 minutes to set all three sticks, and I am confident that I could have set another 4 steps in the same amount of time. Also, that climb was my very first ascent up a tree using the squirrel steps, while denots has climbed with his setup before. I think we could probably both better our time.
For my style of hunting (light, mobile, compact, simple, and safety conscious), I do not think there is a better public-legal method. Given the ease of strapping steps vs drilling, I can even see myself using these in places where bolts are legal, especially if I suspect I'll be climbing very young trees or pines.
I know a lot of you have heard my complaints regarding other public-legal methods, but I want to take a quick second to summarize my experiences with the substitute products I've tried.
The first thing I tried was Lone Wolf full-length sticks. Any full length stick is an absolute dog to pack without a treestand to strap them to. They got hung up dreadfully in palmetto flats and yaupon thickets, didn't fit well in my kayak, and were prone to swinging around and clanking. They were also the heaviest method I have ever tried.
I moved on the wild edge steps, which were definitely lighter and more compact. However, despite practicing nearly daily with them for several months, I found that they were just "fiddly" to set on a lot of trees.
Also, they didn't make sense weight-wise without some kind of aider. I am disinclined to use single step aiders, and vehemently opposed to using multistep aiders, especially with the wild edge steps. I have seen and heard about too many kick offs to trust those 20ft up and 2 miles back off a backwater slough.
And while Wild Edge advertises the steps as public-legal, I found that they frequently caused some ugly looking damage to some trees. If I am in a place where I think an encounter with an overly zealous DCNR employee is likely, I do not want to have sap oozing out of a tree! If I'm going through the hassle of carrying a public-legal method instead of bolts, I want 0 bark penetration.
I briefly experimented with bullman steps at saddlepalooza. I never hunted with them, but I found then thoroughly "meh," and didn't care for their slick feel and small step area. The curved strap slot also seemed weird and not conducive to getting them tight to a tree. They slid down a good bit when weight was applied.
Cranfords have probably proved the most satisfactory, but they are CHONKY little things weight-wise, the rope system can be fiddly, and they are hard to get tight on a tree. They are inexpensive though, and definitely usable.
I don't say all of this to bash the other alternatives. I'm just saying that they all had some shortcomings that made them frustrating for me to use. The first time I climbed with bolts, it felt natural and very safe, and they have never once inconvenienced me when it came time to load up and pound thickets. The couple of climbs and excursions I have made with squirrel steps have felt the same way.
I am much, MUCH happier with them than I have been with the cranfords and LWCG sticks I have been playing with. The only down side I can think of is price. They str not cheap.
However, compared to beast sticks, customized diy sticks, lwcg sticks, and other high-end climbing methods, they've not unreasonable. I wish I had just bought 15 of them to use as a platform and climbing method when I first started, and skipped all the other nonsense. I did talk to @DanO, and I believe he is offering a discount for folks buying 8 or more to help offset that high price.
I know that's a wall of text, but I havent been this pumped about a product since I got my first kestrel in the mail. WAY more excited about these than the LWCG sticks. Super pumped, and I think my enthusiasm rubbed off on the ever-skeptical @kyler1945 as well.
I'll be doing a video on them at some point this week. The video will include the "race" I had with Denots if the footage is usable (havent seen it yet.)
Very interested in this video. I hunt East texas pine thickets that are full of chest high yaupon. Im currently using 3 cut down 24" APIs and a 1 step moveable aider. I have also tried the WE steps with 5 step aider. I would have loved for this to work as advertised but the fiddle factor is so extreme and i cant feel comfortable that the steps wont loosen. And ive tried stretching the ropes and all that jazz. I feel supremely confident in my APIs and the 1 step aider and can get to 20 ft easily but the bulk/awkwardness of the sticks is really harshing my mellow when im trying to be stealthy.
Question: You are using an OCB boat buckle for Each of the steps? Have you tried just using a Cam strap or do you think this wont be tight enough. I know for the ROS it is needed but just curious about when using them as a Climbing Method. thanks
If you can tie the timber hatch faster than I can flick over a cam buckle, you are much more proficient than I am at it.
@kyler1945 clocked me at under 15 seconds to take a step out of the bag, unroll the strap, and click the buckle into place. And there's 0 comparision between how tight an OCB gets a squirrel step vs how tight you can get a cranfords with ropes. Add any type buckle (to make it tighter/quieter) and then the cranford is significantly heavier. Figure out how to use amsteel with a squirrel step, and you've probably cut the weight of that system in half.
The cranford has 0 advantage that I can think of other than price.
I don't think the cranfords are a bad option. I also don't think the lone wolf hand climber I used to use is a bad option. But I sold the climber, and will be listing the 12 cranfords I have tonight. Wanna make me an offer?
MOBIGBUCKS
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2015
- Messages
- 221
I’m definitely interested in your video Nutterbuster! Sounds awesome.
Only thing holding me back is $37 a step! Lol.
Only thing holding me back is $37 a step! Lol.
Working on adding a new option to the site for a package price. It is $33.99 for a SquirrelStep, strap, and OCB buckle plus free shipping if you order 8 or more SquirrelStep sets. If you place your order before I have the package pricing on the site, I'll refund the difference right away.
You can climb any way you chose but if I had to use a Cranford or Squirrel steps the $200 I could save makes the Cranford my choice. The savings would buy me a Mantis saddle or a Predator platform. As far as how fast you were clocked good for you,15 seconds used to be a ok 1/4 mile time.
I feel you 100%. $400 for 10 is steep, BUT...
$375 for a JX3 or $250 for a kestrel is steep compared to a $70 steel hang on.
A $2000 Citori is steep compared to a $300 Mossberg.
A $20 steak is steep compared to a $2 McBurger.
I would not have paid the money if there was a true substitute product, even though I love ole @DanO as much as the next guy. There's just nothing out there that fills that little ultralight niche without being a major PITA to climb with. I think the video will show that.
And at least you get a quality product for the money, instead of a somewhat misadvertised and poorly machined stick.
I get where you're coming from, and am glad you found something that works for you.
MOBIGBUCKS
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2015
- Messages
- 221
MOBIGBUCKS
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2015
- Messages
- 221
I definitely see where you are coming from and agree 100 percent. I’m Looking to lose the climbing stick bulk in some manner. I hate carrying those things
The ease of attachment is slightly in favor of SS’s, but not much compared to the timber hitch. In cold wet weather I’ll take the ocb for sure.
My initial hesitation was the fuss of the buckle, but it’s simply simple.
Is the difference there drastic? No.
Is the difference in how tight it goes on the tree without any difference in effort/focus/skill from you, or tree type or size drastic? I think sometimes maybe no, but over time yes - and it isn’t just an efficiency thing for me, it’s also safety. I know what to expect every time I step on the SS, and will never reset one because it wasn’t tight enough.
Is the difference in money drastic? Yes. Just like everything else in this hobby, and life in general, everything is a trade off. Each individual will do some thinking and weigh pros and cons, and decide what they want.
Cranfords were almost good enough for me and what I do, and why. Outside of price, I see only two ways to improve the squirrel step system. One I’ll share once/if I confirm, the other is if someone can figure out how to get a 3/4” wide step tight enough on the tree with rope.
I place this setup firmly behind bolts, and slightly ahead of one stick/rappel. And all 3 of these are head and shoulders above everything else. For me.
Something else to consider on the cranfords - material selection. If you’re pulling your steps every night, and you’re sanding rust off of them Every season and oiling then to prevent corrosion, they last. But at some point that hinge will seize up. Then they get way less fun to deal with. I don’t see that happening with the squirrel steps. I suspect across a five year run, they’re not as different in price as up front cost would suggest
Of the “luxury” items you listed, the Jx3 is by far the best value for the money. I’m still shocked the price is what it is every time I go through the setup with someone. Hell There’s 100.00 of rope and biners in there. Take that out and compare the cost of materials and hours of labor to a minimal saddle that is 3.00 in material and an hour of labor, if not done completely by machine.
Just like the squirrel steps. Until someone steps up and make a railroad tie of squirrel steps and starts lopping them off, you’re paying a machinist to feed his family. That ain’t nothing to sneeze at for having the lightest safest way up a tree.
A close second is a good ribeye though. Looks like steak tonight.
Louisianna is a truly marvelous place. It just looks like rain here.
denots
Well-Known Member
I'd gladly let go of an additional $200 to make my life easier. And I can promise you this $200 is worth it.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
I would absolutely go this route over lwcg mini sticks. I’m still going to experiment some more with the cranfords I have and the timber hitch method. I’m going to add this to the maybe next year list. I’m still not caught up from last years list.
You may as well order now. I played the same game with cranfords. Figured if they were good enough for Eberhart and Womack they were good enough for me.
If they'd have had squirrels steps back then, they'd have used them.
When you do your video (if you've got a spare step) would you do a short section on how you wrap them with camo form tape without it becoming a huge mess and wearing off/ turning into a sticky lint magnet... yours looked good in your ROS video and I can't seem to figure out how to do it where I don't feel like the tape is just gonna be peeling off in short order.You may as well order now. I played the same game with cranfords. Figured if they were good enough for Eberhart and Womack they were good enough for me.
If they'd have had squirrels steps back then, they'd have used them.
-Mike
I actually was outside climbing a light pole with the cranfords while you were typing this reply. I definitely think I like the timber hitch vs Woopie. I don’t really trust it but less fiddle factor for sure. I know you have some kind of perversion against aiders but seven steps with a single step aider will get me 23-25 feet without stretching.You may as well order now. I played the same game with cranfords. Figured if they were good enough for Eberhart and Womack they were good enough for me.
If they'd have had squirrels steps back then, they'd have used them.
I can do that as it's own video. Been meaning to do it actually.
I've just seen more climbing mishaps with aiders than any other method. 2 days ago a dude broke his finger climbing with one. Today the Southern Outdoorsman posted a video of one of them hitting the dirt. @sureshotscott had a mishap. @redsquirrel went back to just a knaider. @g2outdoors pulled his 5 step aider and wild edge step video.
I could go on. I see more folks screw aiders up than gaff out or break carbon bolts.