Figure of 8 progress capture???

[MNFarmHunter]

Eventually I'll get a separate rope for SRT and the safeguard will stay with that and an 8 will go with my normal rappel rope but in the meantime the safeguard does double duty. The safeguard works great when rappelling due to the constant tension on the line. The issue for me is when you slacken the line such as when shifting positions while on your platform. The loss of tension can cause the safeguard to slip until tension is reapplied.

I use the safeguard while climbing SRT but once on the platform, I back it up with a klemheist for that reason.

 

[Weldabeast]

View attachment 48518

So similar....give it a try if u feel comfortable/confident..u may find u don't need the extra doodad

 

[MNFarmHunter]

Here's where the nerd in me kicks in an wonders...

A munter hitch only required a carabiner so that's one less part yet used the friction against itself for braking. Therefore, which is better for rope overall: physical abrasion against itself plus any thermal heating of the carabiner or thermal heating of the 8?

For our purposes it probably doesn't matter with clean rope since we're not fast roping or dropping/dragging our rope through dist and sand.

 

[Weldabeast]

Here's where the nerd in me kicks in an wonders...

A munter hitch only required a carabiner so that's one less part yet used the friction against itself for braking. Therefore, which is better for rope overall: physical abrasion against itself plus any thermal heating of the carabiner or thermal heating of the 8?

For our purposes it probably doesn't matter with clean rope since we're not fast roping or dropping/dragging our rope through dist and sand.

Nerd.....

The aluminum biner does get warm....I don't think it's warm enough to change/effect anything. @Treehopper2 when I use everything configured like in the pic I feel that both the monster munter and the prusik are sharing the work if u have the prusik tension and munter tension just right.....did u experience that also with the way u have it set up?

 

[Treehopper2]

Nerd.....

The aluminum biner does get warm....I don't think it's warm enough to change/effect anything. @Treehopper2 when I use everything configured like in the pic I feel that both the monster munter and the prusik are sharing the work if u have the prusik tension and munter tension just right.....did u experience that also with the way u have it set up?

I tried to keep the tension barely on the prusik but you can share the load between the two.
As for the backup we may not have trouble with it now but throw in low light conditions and cold weather that lock up may not be so easy I feel some kind of backup is needed.


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[Weldabeast]

I tried to keep the tension barely on the prusik but you can share the load between the two.
As for the backup we may not have trouble with it now but throw in low light conditions and cold weather that lock up may not be so easy I feel some kind of backup is needed.


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Agreed.....just the right tension and it's on the verge....moving freely but ready to bite as soon as ur hand pressure changes....makes me feel better

I used the monster munter only and using leg wraps as my break and it worked fine but I feel much better now having added the backup....the leg wraps were time consuming and a bunch of extra movement

 

[MNFarmHunter]

I swear I need to be earning royalties or endorsements on this but this is why I like the klemheist.

Messing around with the prusik, klemheist and autoblock, I've let go and let each of them catch me using the munter or safeguard. The autoblock made me pucker with the munter as is didn't catch very well but that could've been my error. The prusik bit down so hard I had to do a 2TC self-rescue to free the jam. The klemheist caught instantly and released just as easily.

The hardest thing for me is that if there's an emergency to completely let go of everything. You have to trust your safety to stop you. If you do what comes naturally and start grabbing at things, you'll either get a glove/finger sucked into some place it shouldn't be or you'll grab and defeat the very thing saving you.

 

[Treehopper2]

Agreed.....just the right tension and it's on the verge....moving freely but ready to bite as soon as ur hand pressure changes....makes me feel better

I used the monster munter only and using leg wraps as my break and it worked fine but I feel much better now having added the backup....the leg wraps were time consuming and a bunch of extra movement

You can definitely control the tension better with the prusik and brake hand working together.

I would like to share my reasoning for looking into this system so others can be aware of a possible safeguard issue.
Like most of you I tried the safeguard it’s a handy little tool for rappelling and at first I thought I had found the end all until I had a problem with it.
First let me say this
I’m not trying to say the safeguard is bad or my issue was it’s fault I’m sure I did something wrong to cause my problem but I just want others to be aware it can happen.
So I was rappelling down my left hand on the safeguard handle my right hand on my brake. As I’m going down some how when I went to try and stop I let up on the safeguard handle to slow down and my rope was hung on the handle keeping it open. Again I’m not blaming the device I did something wrong to cause this I’m just not sure what so I just want others to be aware it can happen.


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[MNFarmHunter]

So I was rappelling down my left hand on the safeguard handle my right hand on my brake. As I’m going down some how when I went to try and stop I let up on the safeguard handle to slow down and my rope was hung on the handle keeping it open. Again I’m not blaming the device I did something wrong to cause this I’m just not sure what so I just want others to be aware it can happen.


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I've had this happen too. I think what was happening was that the rope will develop a twist and if the brake hand is low/behind the safeguard, the rope will roll to the backside blocking the handle. Once you roll the rope to the front side, it tends to stay there.

I'm not saying it's defective or a flaw. You just have to know your equipment, it's quirks/limitations and adjust accordingly.

 

[Treehopper2]

I've had this happen too. I think what was happening was that the rope will develop a twist and if the brake hand is low/behind the safeguard, the rope will roll to the backside blocking the handle. Once you roll the rope to the front side, it tends to stay there.

I'm not saying it's defective or a flaw. You just have to know your equipment, it's quirks/limitations and adjust accordingly.

I didn’t care for it and started looking for other ways .
I use to fast rope when I was a young man and you sometimes get this feeling this is going to hurt if I don’t find my brake quick and it reminded me of that lol


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[phatkaw]

I swear I need to be earning royalties or endorsements on this but this is why I like the klemheist.

You ain't getting any loot from me for the klemheist.
TWICE I've had it twist into the most mangled mess I've had in my climbing ropes.
Both times I had it tied on my tether and both times I was leaning down to grab my stick for the first move.
I felt it slip the one time, I don't remember if I felt it the other?
I'll dig through my phone, I think I got a picture?

 

[MNFarmHunter]

I didn’t care for it and started looking for other ways .
I use to fast rope when I was a young man and you sometimes get this feeling this is going to hurt if I don’t find my brake quick and it reminded me of that lol


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Agreed. It was fun as heck back then but once I had to sit down to reach my shoe laces I realized I wasn't a bouncy as I use to be.

It may or may not happen this season but if I do get a dedicated SRT rope, the safeguard will stay with that and an 8 will go with my stick/2TC rappel line.

 

[DroptineKrazy]

Glad it was caught and you were on the ground.

Great catch there @MNFarmHunter ! Perfect example of why I love this site. Looking out for each other.

 

[Brocky]

If that is the Canyon Elite, it has a nylon core and doesn’t require three wraps, only those with dyneema, vectran, and aramid cores and single braids.

 

[Treehopper2]

If that is the Canyon Elite, it has a nylon core and doesn’t require three wraps, only those with dyneema, vectran, and aramid cores and single braids.

It is canyon elite and the knot felt secure with 2 wraps but I went ahead and changed it.
I normally have my tail to be the width of my palm but this was a touch shorter so I feel it had pulled some.

 

[MNFarmHunter]

If that is the Canyon Elite, it has a nylon core and doesn’t require three wraps, only those with dyneema, vectran, and aramid cores and single braids.

Learn something new every day, thanks. It does however create a failure point if you're not careful. Unless every one of your ropes are of the same construction, tying knots based on the construction could cause mixing the wrong knot with the wrong rope.

Knowing myself, I try an build "purposeful OCD" by doing things the same way every time with safety devices. That way, if I do something different it doesn't feel right and makes me stop to think whether I did something wrong. Thankfully though, that also doesn't prevent me from doing something different if it's a better way.

 

[Brocky]

If you tie the friction hitch first before joining the two ends of the cord, any better functioning hitch can be used. Also including the other leg of the loop in the joining knot.the bend, helps prevent some snagging, it’s called a sliding grapevine bend.

 

[phatkaw]

[QUOTE="Brocky, post: 533464, member:
If you tie the friction hitch first before joining the two ends of the cord, any better functioning hitch can be used. Also including the other leg of the loop in the joining knot.the bend, helps prevent some snagging, it’s called a sliding grapevine bend.
[/QUOTE]

Come on @Brocky, English!
Get me some pictures... lol

 

[Brocky]

Hope this translation helps, a grapevine used for the friction hitch, and another that holds a thimble in place.


This option for a figure eight only requires the gate of the carabiner to be opened to take the rope on or off, the rope rides up to the top of the carabiner when loaded, so doesn’t contact the gate. The Oplux needs the wrap around the carabiner so that all the load can be taken off the hitch when descending.

 

[phatkaw]

You ain't getting any loot from me for the klemheist.
TWICE I've had it twist into the most mangled mess I've had in my climbing ropes.
Both times I had it tied on my tether and both times I was leaning down to grab my stick for the first move.
I felt it slip the one time, I don't remember if I felt it the other?
I'll dig through my phone, I think I got a picture?

I found a picture of one of the times it happened... It was in this tablet not my phone.