My controversial view on tracking dogs

[kyler1945]

Does anyone else feel there is perhaps even more that can be learned from tracking with a dog?

Two things I’ve learned from watching dogs work -

the way deer move after being shot makes a lot of sense when you see another animal shadow their trail without being on hands and knees with tunnel vision looking for blood. Helps later trying to “go on instinct” figuring out where deer are going.

A four legged animal moves more like another four legged animal than a human.

Another side note - I’d say half or more of my top 10 “I can go right now and kill a deer” spots, I discovered while trailing deer.

 

[redsquirrel]

I don't make the connection.

Is it a knock to your pride to use GPS, trail cameras, or a modern compound bow?

The use of dogs in hunting is historically more familiar territory than nearly any other tactic we use today.

People are going to suck at skill sets because they don't put the work in to improve themselves and that's just human nature.

I would say you still need to develop woodsmanship to travel the woods even if you use a GPS, you need to have woodmanship to find deer if you're going to use trail cameras to see what is there and you need to put time in to learn how to shoot a compound bow as well.

Again, I'm not at all against the use of tracking dogs. I just think people are not developing all of the skills they need as bowhunters because of their increasing use. But I hear you, you could say the same thing for a lot of other things.

 

[kyler1945]

I guess my thoughts were that ive seen that phrase used to encouraged less effort from the inexperienced. Many deer are recoverable with effort, you just gotta get out there and try.

I totally agree with one person here who said that they with they had a mentor to help them, and I wish there was more people willing to pass on the skills to newer hunters.

I wish more new hunters actively searched out more experienced hunters and were more coachable. I’ve noticed that most killers are more than happy to show ya how to do it. They may not give you their spot, but it’s usually not hard to get someone obsessed with a topic to talk about it.

 

[redsquirrel]

One thing I really disagree with is on the MN tracking dogs group I'm a part of, the phrase "if in doubt back out" is thrown around. It's stuff like that that encourages and adds to the laziness and losing of our skills in blood tracking.

I think "if in doubt back out" is a great practice and I follow it all the time. It doesn't mean you can't go in there yourself to track after you wait.

 

[redsquirrel]

Does anyone else feel there is perhaps even more that can be learned from tracking with a dog?

Can something be learned? Definitely. More? I don't know. The tracks I've been on you are going at the dogs pace so if they pick it up good it can go pretty quickly. I just think each method has it's own advantages.

 

[iamcorey]

If pride is a factor in determining whether or not you would use a dog……you need to seriously reevaluate why you partake in the sport.

Its not whether or not I'd use or dog. It's at what point I'd choose to call a tracker. It's not a decision I'd take lightly.

Exhausted all leads for several hours? Sure I'd call one in. Tracked decent blood 100 yards and then it let's up or the deer went into some thick stuff? I'll keep going even though it would be more convenient to have a dog do the heavy lifting and I could head back to the truck for a cold one.

It's really just personal preference and whether your state/property allows it. Luckily mine does not, so the decision is already made for me.

 

[woodsdog2]

Absolutely agree!!! Blood trailing is a required skill set as a bowhunter especially. The "second hunt." Unfortunately, as attention spans continue to diminish due to instant gratification apps and other electronics, we will most sadly continue to see this over reliance on tracking dogs. I have blood trailed my fair share of deer for myself and friends and family over the years and oftentimes, it can be down to one speck, only finding it by spending considerable time on your hands and knees crawling, looking, overturning leaves etc.... unfortunately, many, many people cannot even stand to wait in a line at the store let alone take the time and commitment required to blood trail. It is a dying art and science unfortunately.

 

[iamcorey]

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[Jay_Disarray]

I wish more new hunters actively searched out more experienced hunters and were more coachable. I’ve noticed that most killers are more than happy to show ya how to do it. They may not give you their spot, but it’s usually not hard to get someone obsessed with a topic to talk about it.

Wish I had more like you in my area then.. Most the killers I know are so occupied with their own chase they don't have the time or patience to show a newbie around.

I remember being around around 13 or 14 a being dropped off in a section of woods and being told an approximate area to go, or sometimes just dropped off and told to find a good spot, that was the extent of the help I got. I had to figure it all out on my own. This was a time before YouTube and vast information sharing capabilities

 

[Hall17]

I would agree and have caught myself thinking about backing out and calling in a tracker too early in the situation. Blood trailing is an art and its part of what we should learn how to do. You should WANT to become an expert in blood trails. The more knowledge you have about that topic the better woodsman you become. I am glad PA allows dogs so more deer can be recovered. To me that is the positive about dog trackers. I have never used one personally yet but from what I hear it can be a great learning experience. Not knocking THP because I do watch their vids and have learned from them however when you see someone like THP using dogs it automatically makes you think I should as well if they are. Great post @redsquirrel

 

[Nutterbuster]

BUT.. I think they are leading to a loss of critical blood trailing skills in hunters. Over the past 5 years or so I continue to see threads posted across the internet where people seem to put forth a lackluster tracking effort and the responses are "just call a dog".

There are always people uninterested in learning a skill for various reasons. There have always been hunters who can't/won't learn to bloodtrail their own deer. Historically since they couldn't "call the dog" they "phoned a friend." Or looked for 10 minutes and shrugged it off. Dogs won't change that baseline level of incompetent folks.

Trackers usually don't work for free. Down here it'll cost you $100 or more to get somebody who should know what they're doing to come out. That dissuades a lot of people from relying on that as a go-to option. You MAY get somebody to come out and do it for free or for "gas and dog food", but you're most likely getting somebody like myself who is trying to teach a dog...not exactly an easy-button. Prices go up from what I understand in areas where deer get bigger and wallets get thicker. And there's no guarantee the number you call will pick up. A good tracker stays busy, and generally will be reluctant to bring a dog out on a trail he doesn't think has a dead deer at the end of it. If you talk to him and can't give him confident answers to his questions (Where did you hit? How did it react? What does the arrow look like? Do you have blood? What did it look like? Did you follow it? etc) his interest drops. Amateurs like myself kinda lose interest when people call at 8pm on a Sunday night...

There just aren't enough trackers out there to make "call the dog" anybody's first thought. And even if you have a dog who can follow trails (mine shows promise) going back to the house, loading him up, and fooling with him is enough hassle that you'll probably make at least an attempt to follow the trail.

I don't doubt that you've noticed more people interested in dogs or advising folks to use them. It's trendy currently (like "mobile hunting"), and "call the dog" is also a polite way to tell somebody who obviously doesn't have a clue to stop asking the facebook for advice and go fix their problem. It's hunting's version of "drain the gas, replace the sparkplug, and clean the carb" as a default reply for the ole "Why won't my engine run" question on go-kart forums. Hard to diagnose an engine or blood track a deer through the internet. "Call the dog!" is also used as an in-joke by the crusty-ole-bass-turds around my area to poke fun at the guys who post pics to instagram in their Sitka suit after gut-shooting basket racked "public land trophies" with 6.5 creedmoors out of their saddles...

But there just aren't enough dogs and trackers out there to affect the number of people who will be too lazy/ignorant to find a deer. Even if there were, folks hate paying for a service. They'll buy a GPS or camera or replaceable blade, but ask for money in exchange for years of training a dog and working trails yourself (not to mention the cost of buying the gremlin, feeding him, taking him out to crap, scooping said crap, taking him to the vet when the crap looks funny, having him crap in agreed-upon no-crap zones, etc, etc) and they get cheap.

If what you're saying was true, it'd be a whole separate thought altogether whether matters or not. You don't see people crying about kids these days not being able to tan and sew their own buckskins or shoe their mules or smoke their venison hams so they don't rot... Sometimes skills and tools become obsolete. And I say that as a guy who likes to think he's better than the average bear at killing and finding deer.

 

[MOBIGBUCKS]

Dogs should be last resort and some of the rules the trackers have before theyll come out will disqualify you when you reach that point where youve run out of trail.

Exactly. If you even try to track your deer many trackers will say it's not worth their time. I had this happen last year actually. Guy told me I probably wouldn't find it and he didn't want to "ruin" his dog on a track that wouldn't end in recovery. Took me until the third full day of walking but I did find my buck..

Blood trailing and woodsmanship are dying breeds the way hunting is headed. I agree 100 percent with what Red said.

 

[Mike Curtis]

I guess I'll swim up stream on this one. I had a dog that recovered over 60 deer for me and others. With out the stress of loosing a deer I saw blood that I normally would have missed. I would agree that if you just chased the dog that would not be helpful but most of us still track behind the dog.

 

[kbetts]

I think some of these dog guys are full of themselves. You aren’t going to “ruin” a dog by putting it on a track you already attempted. The nose knows. Now, I wouldn’t beat the crap out of the place, but looking is not hurting a thing. It’s not tracking a human.

 

[Razorbak66]

I think some of these dog guys are full of themselves. You aren’t going to “ruin” a dog by putting it on a track you already attempted. The nose knows. Now, I wouldn’t beat the crap out of the place, but looking is not hurting a thing. It’s not tracking a human.

I agree from what I been told by some trackers. What you need to do is ridiculous for them to track one conservation was basically you couldn’t even be there was the gist of it

 

[Razorbak66]

And I don’t mind tipping if I actually needed a dog which in all my years I haven’t yet knock on wood Couple conversation I had with a few fellas was minimum of 100$ to come and if you don’t have it then they ghost you and won’t return the calls I sure as heck don’t carry a couple hundred in the woods with me for TIPs. I know of one tracker that has a credit card scanner with him for this purpose. I guess I’m to cheap to call a dog plus my wife will kill me if I did after knowing how much I spend a year in my gear. It’s good to have friends sometimes who will drop everything to come help if needed

 

[Jay_Disarray]

I think I'm unclear on one thing, do some states allow you to just loose the dog to track?
From my understanding, in MN the dog must be leashed while tracking deer

 

[Razorbak66]

Leashed here in NH

 

[Nutterbuster]

I think I'm unclear on one thing, do some states allow you to just loose the dog to track?
From my understanding, in MN the dog must be leashed while tracking deer

In Alabama they have to be leashed on public. No real laws on private.

I prefer to work my dog on an e-collar. Lead is a major PITA in the thick stuff down here. I can page him if he's working too fast and have him sit in place while I inspect for blood to confirm he's on-trail or figure out how in heck I'm about to get through the briars he juat plowed through.

 

[Bowonly]

It seems like most are coming at this conversation as though most people calling a tracker have a trail that there is blood to see and follow; and a dead deer laying within 150 yards just a few minutes after the shot.

Speaking from experience, that's generally not who calls a dog.

Where a dog really shines is on stomach and intestinal hits where the deer could live many hours or even days. Often they leave very little visible sign and if you're waiting enough time for the deer to expire, the blood will be dry and much harder to pick out.

Most calls to a tracker involve a poor shot or poor shot selection. Improving that skill would result in a lot more recoveries than being a better tracker. You have to kill it before you can find it.