7 bolts to 21 feet high

[kyler1945]

16 bolts would get me 24’, with first bolt at 18” and last bolt at 24’. With the aider, first bolt at 36” last bolt at 24’, 8 bolts.

drill first and second bolt from ground and insert. Hook up lineman’s. Attach aider to 2nd bolt. Wrap across front of tree, pull up lineman’s, and step up. Hook aider midway to 2nd bolt which is now at hip level so my feet are even. Pull lineman’s tight. Drill third bolt at forehead level. Hook full length of aider to it.
Repeat.

I carried 8 bolts this year, and hinted from 8-25’ and never needed another bolt.

 

[kyler1945]

It will definitely reduce # of bolts, but its actually not in half. If doing the “traditional” bolt method with no aider (like [mention]Nutterbuster [/mention]) then each bolt gets you 2 feet. So 15 bolts = 30 feet.

With this aider, you get 3’ per bolt (18” with the aider step and then another 18” to the next bolt). 10 bolts = 30 feet. So # of bolts is reduced by 33% (15 down to 10 for same 30’ height).

Tall guys may be able to stretch out the aider some, but I don’t think it’s possible for the majority of us. With the aider you have to drill and place the next TWO bolts before moving up, so that you can remove the aider as you go (unless you want to try removing an aider from the only bolt you’re standing on). Stretching the aider into 24” steps would mean 48” between bolts. Drilling and setting 2 bolts 48” apart puts the second bolt 96” or 8’ up. I personally wouldn’t want to drill anything above head height, so I’d stick with 3’ between bolts with the aider.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

why is the step spacing in your no aider example 24”, and 15” in the aider example?

how many bolts, the distance between them, and aider length will depend on your height and stride - just like any other method.

If you have a 15” stride, you’ll use 30” bolt spacing.

I use 36-40” spacing under ideal conditions. I can drill 4-6” above my head. But I prefer to drill at forehead height (72”). Yes there’s an upper limit - you can only drill so high. But I always use 18-20” step spacing with bolts anyway.

 

[SETX hunter]

why is the step spacing in your no aider example 24”, and 15” in the aider example?

how many bolts, the distance between them, and aider length will depend on your height and stride - just like any other method.

If you have a 15” stride, you’ll use 30” bolt spacing.

I use 36-40” spacing under ideal conditions. I can drill 4-6” above my head. But I prefer to drill at forehead height (72”). Yes there’s an upper limit - you can only drill so high. But I always use 18-20” step spacing with bolts anyway.

All I was trying to show is that one method is limited by the height you can step, the other is limited by the height you can drill.

With the aider, 18-20” spacing is the max I could reach because I’m limited to how high I can drill, no matter how flexible I am or high how I can pickup my leg.

I compared 24” spacing without aider because guys with similar build/fitness to me are actually achieving this without issue (see nutter’s videos in other threads). If I can reach 24” per step and feel comfortable doing it, why would I not?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[kyler1945]

All I was trying to show is that one method is limited by the height you can step, the other is limited by the height you can drill.

With the aider, 18-20” spacing is the max I could reach because I’m limited to how high I can drill, no matter how flexible I am or high how I can pickup my leg.

I compared 24” spacing without aider because guys with similar build/fitness to me are actually achieving this without issue (see nutter’s videos in other threads). If I can reach 24” per step and feel comfortable doing it, why would I not?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Got it - makes sense.

 

[SETX hunter]

Anyone see an issue using your tether as the aider here? Use the eye of tether as a foot loop (or possibly girth hitch if you can’t get your boot through the loop). And then lift leg and place the prusik (NOT carabiner) on the bolt.

Seems like it should work safely. With the added bonus of not carrying a dedicated aider. Thoughts?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[raisins]

This method would really shine with strap on steps. I believe that my tree hopper method is secure enough and that tree hopper steps could hold a loop just like a bolt. Girth hitching anything to my foot makes me really nervous though. What happens if you end up dangling upside down by your foot and your foot is trapped and you can't get out without falling head first?

 

[kyler1945]

This method would really shine with strap on steps. I believe that my tree hopper method is secure enough and that tree hopper steps could hold a loop just like a bolt. Girth hitching anything to my foot makes me really nervous though. What happens if you end up dangling upside down by your foot and your foot is trapped and you can't get out without falling head first?

what type of fall would have to happen for you to end up upside down?

what’s the difference between that fall with a girth hitch on your foot and not? Maybe I’m thinking about it wrong, but one ends with your head splattered on the ground before you can think about it; the other gives you at least a tiny chance of getting right side up...

also, it seems like the fall that would have you upside down would involve the aider connection being broken. But maybe I’m missing your vision of how it goes.

 

[SETX hunter]

This method would really shine with strap on steps. I believe that my tree hopper method is secure enough and that tree hopper steps could hold a loop just like a bolt. Girth hitching anything to my foot makes me really nervous though. What happens if you end up dangling upside down by your foot and your foot is trapped and you can't get out without falling head first?

I’m with kyler here, seems difficult to get yourself into that kind of fall if you’re using a lineman’s rope.

As for the strap on steps, I would be nervous to have an aider going across the tree applying side pressure... bolts can handle just as much side pressure as they can downward pressure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[raisins]

I’m with kyler here, seems difficult to get yourself into that kind of fall if you’re using a lineman’s rope.

As for the strap on steps, I would be nervous to have an aider going across the tree applying side pressure... bolts can handle just as much side pressure as they can downward pressure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My step attachment method could handle it. With the other, just throwing out a concern. It would be difficult to get into that situation. But it's also about one of the worst situations I can imagine in the tree (probability X severity = level of concern afforded).

 

[mtsrunner]

This method would really shine with strap on steps. I believe that my tree hopper method is secure enough and that tree hopper steps could hold a loop just like a bolt. Girth hitching anything to my foot makes me really nervous though. What happens if you end up dangling upside down by your foot and your foot is trapped and you can't get out without falling head first?

My step attachment method could handle it. With the other, just throwing out a concern. It would be difficult to get into that situation. But it's also about one of the worst situations I can imagine in the tree (probability X severity = level of concern afforded).

I don’t girth hitch my Aider anymore (for comfort see post#4), so I’m not worried there.
I have tried this with strap on steps, but the side pressure of the Aider makes the steps move. Have you tried with your Treehopper steps using your ‘ raisins method’ like this?

 

[GeoFish]

The Guy on Saddle Hunting is doing the same thing with rope on steps.

 

[mtsrunner]

The Guy on Saddle Hunting is doing the same thing with rope on steps.

Nice. I thought there would be too much chance of the step slipping, but now I need to go try that. I also like how he used his tether carabiner and aider to get up on his last step. I always regret having to drill that last bolt hole to get up to hunting height. I will definitely employ that trick.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[raisins]

I don’t girth hitch my Aider anymore (for comfort see post#4), so I’m not worried there.
I have tried this with strap on steps, but the side pressure of the Aider makes the steps move. Have you tried with your Treehopper steps using your ‘ raisins method’ like this?

No, I never tried it. But I did climb with that method a whole season . I wasn't always super careful about no side pressure when putting up a platform, etc; and a step never once slid around the tree. So that's at least one decent nudge towards thinking it has a shot.

EDIT: When you put side pressure on the treehopper, its width in the back (little wings) seems to make it cam into the tree and not move (if you have it on there pretty tight using trucker's hitch). I don't think it is good to put too much side pressure on these because it was not tested to failure in that manner (per phone call with owner).

 

[GeoFish]

No, I never tried it. But I did climb with that method a whole season . I wasn't always super careful about no side pressure when putting up a platform, etc; and a step never once slid around the tree. So that's at least one decent nudge towards thinking it has a shot.

EDIT: When you put side pressure on the treehopper, its width in the back (little wings) seems to make it cam into the tree and not move (if you have it on there pretty tight using trucker's hitch). I don't think it is good to put too much side pressure on these because it was not tested to failure in that manner (per phone call with owner).

Raisins
Are you staying with the treehopper steps or are you going to the Pioneer steps?
If you are worried about side pressure, you may want to try the two aider climbing option.
You can still get 4 steps using two steps.

 

[raisins]

Raisins
Are you staying with the treehopper steps or are you going to the Pioneer steps?
If you are worried about side pressure, you may want to try the two aider climbing option.
You can still get 4 steps using two steps.

Haven't really decided yet. I'll probably stick with the treehoppers in part because I can't remove my daisy chains from them and put them on the pioneer steps (I have knots in the daisy chain that lock the steps from sliding and after a season of standing on them, they aren't budging). Making twelve 8 foot daisy chains took me way too long.

 

[D.AKINS]

Any tips on keeping eyes open on a web daisy aider I got s from EWO?
I have been using bolts for a few seasons. Saw this post and tried it, works well other than I have to fiddle around to get the eye opened and on the bolt. Kinda aggravating.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SETX hunter]

Any tips on keeping eyes open on a web daisy aider I got s from EWO?
I have been using bolts for a few seasons. Saw this post and tried it, works well other than I have to fiddle around to get the eye opened and on the bolt. Kinda aggravating.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not sure how this will work on webbing, but for amsteel daisy aider it helps me to have a small loop of paracord (or other small diameter line) in the eyes that are used most often.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[D.AKINS]

I will try that. I thought about taking a short piece of .75 or 1” pvc and taping it in the 2 loops I use

 

[mtsrunner]

Any tips on keeping eyes open on a web daisy aider I got s from EWO?
I have been using bolts for a few seasons. Saw this post and tried it, works well other than I have to fiddle around to get the eye opened and on the bolt. Kinda aggravating.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I used a webbing daisy chain before I made my Amsteel aider. I simply taped both sides of the loops with hockey tape. That was enough to keep them open.

 

[cmcclain88]

Any tips on keeping eyes open on a web daisy aider I got s from EWO?
I have been using bolts for a few seasons. Saw this post and tried it, works well other than I have to fiddle around to get the eye opened and on the bolt. Kinda aggravating.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

How about a small piece of garden hose inside the loop, maybe lash it to both sides of the loop using some paracord? Just my $.02


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk