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A&A feathers

So I just recently learn 3 River has tubes for carbon arrows. But I think you are not going to get the 30% FOC. a tube of 8 gpi would literally add 200+ to an arrow.
That’s cool but I think I need the weight up front so it increases my dynamic spine. Putting a tube inside the shaft would make the spine go down (stiffer) I would think.
 
It is my understanding that the quills are optimally bound "better" in certain portions of the feather, I hope I'm saying that correctly. Therefor, most feather choppers only use the "best" part of each feather for fletching purposes.
I think that mostly has to do with the quill width being most consistent over the length of the final cut fletch. Towards both ends the quill is really thick or really thin. I don’t believe they actually feather portion is much different.
 
I think that mostly has to do with the quill width being most consistent over the length of the final cut fletch. Towards both ends the quill is really thick or really thin. I don’t believe they actually feather portion is much different.
Yes you want to use best part of quill which is middle but if you plan it right you can use the whole feather if you match it as well as you can especially when feather prices are crazy high. I remember when I can get 100 feathers for under 20$
 
I mean unless you have schlieren imaging or some other test set up that allows you to see the air flow separation all of this is hypothetical or speculative at best. Again, the smaller fletching benefits are fairly intuitive, the turbulator is a stretch for me. Also, while we are speculating let me speculate. I would say that I would not think that you would just need a piece only in front of the fletching. If you only had 3 single pieces in front of each fletching you would have a mixture of turbulent flow and laminar flow. You would then have three smaller flow separations and then still have a larger flow separation from the arrow at the end. I am having trouble speculating how this would be beneficial. Naturally, (without a turbulator) your turbulent flow separation will occur a little past the end of the fletching/arrow and using a turbulator to create flow separation ahead of the fletching would cause the flow separation before the end of the arrow. Making the turbulent flow transition sooner would increase friction drag which may contribute to the smaller vanes ability to more effectively stabilize the arrow. Regardless, I am still not convinced the that would make a noticeable difference but it is interesting.

Since the purpose of the fletching is to induce spin, I fail to grasp the concept where introducing a disruption of air flow over the surface which creates the spin would be beneficial. Would not clean air flow over the spin inducing surface not be more efficient in creating spin?
 
Since the purpose of the fletching is to induce spin, I fail to grasp the concept where introducing a disruption of air flow over the surface which creates the spin would be beneficial. Would not clean air flow over the spin inducing surface not be more efficient in creating spin?
Ask Dr Ed.
 
Since the purpose of the fletching is to induce spin, I fail to grasp the concept where introducing a disruption of air flow over the surface which creates the spin would be beneficial. Would not clean air flow over the spin inducing surface not be more efficient in creating spin?
my small brain understanding is that fletching induces spin via controlled turbulence. bigger fletching creates more than smaller fletching, and bigger fletching is also more capable of disrupting the laminar, or straight line flow, that is created along the arrow shaft. By creating a break in that laminar flow before it hits the fletching you allow the smaller fletching to create more spin and do so with an overall lower weight on the fletched end of the shaft, thereby increasing the F.O.C. without sacrificing arrow flight, which checks multiple boxes for Dr. Ed
 
my small brain understanding is that fletching induces spin via controlled turbulence. bigger fletching creates more than smaller fletching, and bigger fletching is also more capable of disrupting the laminar, or straight line flow, that is created along the arrow shaft. By creating a break in that laminar flow before it hits the fletching you allow the smaller fletching to create more spin and do so with an overall lower weight on the fletched end of the shaft, thereby increasing the F.O.C. without sacrificing arrow flight, which checks multiple boxes for Dr. Ed
I can rationalize that if we are talking about an arrow fletched in a straight clamp where disturbance might put more force on the fletch in a lateral fashion. I just cant rationalize where that would apply if fletch were in an offset or helical orientation where it would seem you would want clean air flow over the surface of the fletch to impart maximum rotation. My jello computes that a disrupted air flow over an offset or helical fletch would impart less rotational force. I dont expect they will ever let me drive a space boat though so no biggie.
 
You can tune the bow in rudimentary ways. Mostly yes, you are tuning an arrow. But in trad, you are not just tuning the arrow to the bow but also to your idiosyncratic inputs, most of which compound bow and mechanical release technology has worked to eliminate. It can be a challenge.
Just tell em about my idiosynratic inputs bro! :tearsofjoy: :tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy:
 
One would expect to see positive performance effects on any arrow with a turbulator, right?
 
I can rationalize that if we are talking about an arrow fletched in a straight clamp where disturbance might put more force on the fletch in a lateral fashion. I just cant rationalize where that would apply if fletch were in an offset or helical orientation where it would seem you would want clean air flow over the surface of the fletch to impart maximum rotation. My jello computes that a disrupted air flow over an offset or helical fletch would impart less rotational force. I dont expect they will ever let me drive a space boat though so no biggie.
The concept behind these fletchings is that they donot need offset or helical, they are to be applies perfectly straight. That gives the arrow more speed and less noise in flight. I absolutely know for a fact that these arrows shoot quieter than my old 5" helical.
The heavy TAW makes the bow quieter and these fletchings make the arrow fly quieter...less chance for the deer to jump the string.
And feathers have a natural "lift" as air passes over them. Its what helps a bird fly.
When we put feathers on an arrow, that "lift" is translated into spin. The arrow will spin regardless of being straight or helical or offset.
 
That’s cool but I think I need the weight up front so it increases my dynamic spine. Putting a tube inside the shaft would make the spine go down (stiffer) I would think.
The tubes would make a heavier arrow overall but then you defeat the purpose of a the lightest shaft possible to facilitate EFOC. Weight along the entirety of the shaft would begin to work against your efforts to increase FOC. You want the lightest shaft possible to be able to add weight to the front of the arrow which will still tune properly and increase your FOC to Extreme or Ultra Extreme FOC depending on what your hunting requirements may be and the constraints of your particular bow set up, dw, dl etc.
 
The concept behind these fletchings is that they donot need offset or helical, they are to be applies perfectly straight. That gives the arrow more speed and less noise in flight. I absolutely know for a fact that these arrows shoot quieter than my old 5" helical.
The heavy TAW makes the bow quieter and these fletchings make the arrow fly quieter...less chance for the deer to jump the string.
And feathers have a natural "lift" as air passes over them. Its what helps a bird fly.
When we put feathers on an arrow, that "lift" is translated into spin. The arrow will spin regardless of being straight or helical or offset.
Yeah, I understand all of that, been shooting feathers mostly for long time and have shot all sorts of lengths, cuts and orientations. My hang up is with the tubonator or whatever to introduce turbulence ahead of the fletch. Disruption of the air space prior to the fletch entering seems like it might create a situation where you could have opposing lateral force on the fletch. I seriously doubt it would be enough to have an impact on arrow flight, just dont understand the rationale to do it. Even clamped straight, real turkey feathers are going to impart helical spin due to the curvature of the feather. Would love to see some video of shooting your arrow build when you get it all dialed in. Cool build.
 
One would expect to see positive performance effects on any arrow with a turbulator, right?
Probably, but to what extent on helical, offset fletching? Probably not enough to effect it.
The idea behind the turbulator is to maximize a straight fletch.

One more thing about gluing straight fletch...
With these micro diameter shafts, there just isn't much surface area to get a good bond with a helical offset fletch.
Its not a problem with larger diameter aluminum or wood, but with micro, just a couple of degrees offset was harder for me to glue, and its worse with longer fletch.
 
Since u cut down the feather so short is there still a natural curl?
Not a curl exactly. But if you look at each individual hair on a feather you can see that each one is on an angle in relation to the quill, kinda like a fan blade has a pitch. That's what gives a feather built-in lateral force as air moves across it. Its why we don't mix left wing and right wing feathers on the same arrow.
Push sideways on the fletching on an arrow...you'll see that one side seems stiff and the other side will collapse easier with lateral pressure. Thats the physics of how a feather has lift. When the bird raises its wings, there is less resistance than when the wings are lowered. It gives lift as opposed to the wing just going back and forth.
God is a genius beyond human comprehension. The stuff He designed is absolutely incredible. No way all this came from a big bang...its intelligent design!
 
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Not a curl exactly. But if you look at each individual hair on a feather you can see that each one is on an angle in relation to the quill, kinda like a fan blade has a pitch. That's what gives a feather built-in lateral force as air moves across it. Its why we don't mix left wing and right wing feathers on the same arrow.
God is a genius beyond human comprehension. The stuff he designed is absolutely incredible. No way all this came from a big bang...its intelligent design!
AMEN!!!
 
The first thing any newer trad guy learns....is that the arrow kills the animal, not the bow. You quickly realize how little you know about arrow tuning. Once it clicks, however, you can darn near tune/shoot anything.
 
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