Are knots for webbing just as safe as sewed loop?

[HuumanCreed]

No access to a sewing machine for the foreseeable future. Want to make some webbing aiders. Is this just as safe, any fear of slippage?

Knots for Webbing and Anchors: The Overhand on a Bight

OVERHAND ON A BIGHT The other "most-useful" knot in webbing is another overhand-type, the Overhand on a Bight. This is tied in webbing just as it is in rope.

www.canyoneeringusa.com

 

[raisins]

It shouldn't be life support, so I'd probably be okay with it, but the water knot is probably more appropriate. If you are worried about slippage, then put a few hand stitches to anchor your tag ends to the main loop. You can also look up how to stitch a bar tack by hand. My bar tacks with upholstery thread easily hold my weight.

 

[gcr0003]

Like @raisins said for an aider you would probably be fine, just make sure you check the aider for slipping as the over hand on a bight is known to slowly slip after multiple weighting’s. I always and will forever recommend the water knot for anything tied using webbing. There are a few threads of people showing how to make aiders using this knot. I used water knots to make my aiders that I used for the passed two years and have had no issues with them at all.

 

[raisins]

Like @raisins said for an aider you would probably be fine, just make sure you check the aider for slipping as the over hand on a bight is known to slowly slip after multiple weighting’s. I always and will forever recommend the water knot for anything tied using webbing. There are a few threads of people showing how to make aiders using this knot. I used water knots to make my aiders that I used for the passed two years and have had no issues with them at all.

I suppose you could peel the tag ends back on the overhand and tack them back to the loop. If you tack the tag ends to each other, as they naturally want to lay, then you can still untie the overhand (which defeats the purpose of the stitching). A water knot has your tag ends laying nice and neat back onto the loop.

If you leave sufficient tag end, then you're fine. I still like to tack the ends down. A lot of people hate tag ends on ropes/webbing, which I don't get.

 

[HuumanCreed]

Thank you so much guys for the quick response, I will go learn the water knot. My mistake, I though that the water knot was primary meant to join two webbing together, I didn't realized you can use it for loop end. Will hand stitch it close at end too!

 

[gcr0003]

Thank you so much guys for the quick response, I will go learn the water knot. My mistake, I though that the water knot was primary meant to join two webbing together, I didn't realized you can use it for loop end. Will hand stitch it close at end too!

Loop end is called a Water Knot Ring bend

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

No access to a sewing machine for the foreseeable future. Want to make some webbing aiders. Is this just as safe, any fear of slippage?

Knots for Webbing and Anchors: The Overhand on a Bight

OVERHAND ON A BIGHT The other "most-useful" knot in webbing is another overhand-type, the Overhand on a Bight. This is tied in webbing just as it is in rope.

www.canyoneeringusa.com

People have used water knots to tie in webbing and bridges for years. Even some of the older saddle companies used them before sewn eyes ropes became so popular. The key is realizing you are losing about 40-50% of the strength of the webbing AND picking webbing that is strong enough after that reduction

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

It shouldn't be life support, so I'd probably be okay with it, but the water knot is probably more appropriate. If you are worried about slippage, then put a few hand stitches to anchor your tag ends to the main loop. You can also look up how to stitch a bar tack by hand. My bar tacks with upholstery thread easily hold my weight.

Excellent idea with the hand stitches to prevent slippage. You can hand stitch eyes in webbing too as long as you use strong enough thread and keep it tensioned really hard. With nylon straps (because they stretch and you don’t have a pressure foot while hand stitching) people would use a really thin piece of webbing sandwiched in between the two pieces that create the eye. What they found was by adding the thin third layer, the stretch of the nylon was greatly reduced thereby making hand sewn stitch patterns much better at holding the material.

 

[raisins]

Excellent idea with the hand stitches to prevent slippage. You can hand stitch eyes in webbing too as long as you use strong enough thread and keep it tensioned really hard. With nylon straps (because they stretch and you don’t have a pressure foot while hand stitching) people would use a really thin piece of webbing sandwiched in between the two pieces that create the eye. What they found was by adding the thin third layer, the stretch of the nylon was greatly reduced thereby making hand sewn stitch patterns much better at holding the material.

I weight and bounce on the loop first and don't pull the tags really tight before sewing. That way, the knot is holding the weight and not the stitching.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

I weighted and bounce on the loop first and don't pull the tags really tight. That way, the knot is holding the weight and not the stitching.

Yea water knots would be the best bet but an over hand on a bite would tie into tubular webbing just fine as long as you leave long tag ends or sew the tag ends down.... Believe it or not, I’ve actually sewn entire saddles by hand, with size 138 thread doubled over and using the back stitch. The back stitch is the strongest hand stitch there is because it doubles all the thread back through before advancing the pass, thus locking the stitch in so if one breaks it only unravels to the following stitch where it locks in. Everywhere I had webbing meet or double back such as the over lap or the linesman loops, leg straps ect I would insert a small piece of polyester grosgrain between my nylon webbing. It prevented the webbing from stretching as much and made the stitching very strong. I dare say stronger than most machine stitched saddles because my thread was doubled effectively putting 2 passes of thread through every pass of the needle. I never got an official break test done on a hand stitched saddle but we did use one to help pull a truck out of a mud hole at my buddies hunting club. They broke their old beat up tow strap but needed a couple feet to split the difference to the truck to pull out, we used my hand sewn saddle to make up the difference, worked like a charm! Although it took me 14 hours of hand sewing to make that saddle and that’s 14 hours of my life I’d never get back. I never used that saddle again after using it to pull a truck, but I still have it in a tote at the house!

 

[Wolnut]

Anecdotally, I made a tubular webbing moveable aider (modeled after VersaAider) using water knots, and it was easy to make and held up just fine. Of course this is just one person's experience, but I am very safety conscious and felt secure while using it.

 

[Weldabeast]

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All the aiders I made with knots worked just fine but they suck....my diys all seemed to want to twist when I was using them.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

Harbor Freight Tools – Quality Tools at Discount Prices Since 1977

Harbor Freight buys their top quality tools from the same factories that supply our competitors. We cut out the middleman and pass the savings to you!

www.harborfreight.com

All the aiders I made with knots worked just fine but they suck....my diys all seemed to want to twist when I was using them.

That is a great tool for hand stitching bar tacks lol... other wise I found it slow and preferred a thicker large eye needle and a steel thimble

 

[Weldabeast]

That is a great tool for hand stitching bar tacks lol... other wise I found it slow and preferred a thicker large eye needle and a steel thimble

I used that tool to build all of my climbing equipment....

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

You should try the 1508 NH... lol it makes short work of climbing projects. Seriously though the speedy stitch is definitely worth investing in, if a machine isn’t in someone’s near future

 

[HuumanCreed]

You should try the 1508 NH... lol it makes short work of climbing projects. Seriously though the speedy stitch is definitely worth investing in, if a machine isn’t in someone’s near future

Lol, my first car didnt cost that much. But thank you

 

[raisins]

That is a great tool for hand stitching bar tacks lol... other wise I found it slow and preferred a thicker large eye needle and a steel thimble

If it has the same needle as the speedy stitcher, then it cuts the webbing instead of pushing the fibers to the side.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

If it has the same needle as the speedy stitcher, then it cuts the webbing instead of pushing the fibers to the side.

The speedy stitched comes with different needles. There are also smaller replacement needles sold by sail rite for using smaller thread with the speedy stitch..... Some are sharp tip, some are curved, some are blunt tip, and some are tapered (which is the knife like tip usually used for leather or upholstery). That is the tip that cuts the webbing. A good sharp works just fine with minimal damage and is the needle suggested by machine manufacturers and needle companies. That blunt tip idea works great for lose knit webbing but is not the best for tight knit webbings such as seat belt or mil spec type 7...

 

[Weldabeast]

My stirrups are 6 layers (2 are overhead lifting strap...much much thicker than standard webbing) thick for the standing surface and the awl was all I could get to pierce thru

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

My stirrups are 6 layers (2 are overhead lifting strap...much much thicker than standard webbing) thick for the standing surface and the awl was all I could get to pierce thru

You start getting that thick, hiTex might be the way to go