Drone Deer Recovery

[ricky racer]

Agreed, but a very short jump to flying it around and using the thermal imaging to scout your property and also use it to find the deer before you even go into the woods that day to hunt.

If someone had 100 acres and they knew a nice 8 was usually on it, this guy could probably find it for you pretty quick and then you could setup your strategy for that day.

That is why states like Alaska have laws that say you can't hunt the same day you fly. Enacting laws like that would make hunting the same day as using a drone illegal.

 

[Plebe]

Fair chase...explain to me the terms and conditions under which you think it'd be fair for me to hunt you. Nothing about what we do to deer is fair. Fairness means equal and just treatment, and they don't get equal consideration or a voice in the deliberation.

We don’t have to go further than the literal definition.

fair:without cheating or trying to achieve unjustadvantage.

chase: pursue in order to catch or catch up with

Hence, things like hunting from power vehicles and employing methods to immobilize the hunted animal are considered to infringe upon fair chase.

Generally deer are more fleet footed than we...probably why some jokers think it’s ok to pull a trump card.

 

[raisins]

Possibly. He couldn't do it in any of the heavily wooded areas I hunt. Even in farmland/crp I imagine it'd be a bit of a crapshoot for results, but a guaranteed bill.

The slope ain't that slippery, and the bottom of the slope ain't that bad. If, and it's a big if, people find a way to locate and harvest game with a drone, but it's regulated and done below the replacement rate of breeding and parts of the monies spent go to wildlife management...who cares? If you don't think it's fun/cool/challenging...don't do it.

Fair chase...explain to me the terms and conditions under which you think it'd be fair for me to hunt you. Nothing about what we do to deer is fair. Fairness means equal and just treatment, and they don't get equal consideration or a voice in the deliberation.

Did you watch the video closely? At night, the deer's warm body sticks out like a sore thumb even through the cooler canopy of vegetation. I'm not sure about during the day when the world heats up a bit.

 

[BackSpasm]

Two things: First, I had a chance to talk with Mike for one of my podcasts. It will be live this Thursday. As we talked off air, he’s very careful to avoid doing things that would push him across what I would consider an ethical line.

Second, honest question, for those who are against this being used to recover already wounded deer, what’s the big sticking point for you?

Here is what bothers me about it... in one of his videos, he helps a friend locate a very much alive deer that he had shot. The drone findings completely informs the recovery strategy and they don't blood trail or pursue the buck at all. They even admit on camera if not for the drone they would call a dog and would have bumped the buck off the property. Then later, after the buck survives his bad shot, he shoots the buck again on the same property. He made a good shot this time, but calls the drone back in any way for the recovery and they locate the deer laying in a field and observe it before a huge party of hunters (over 10) go in to get it. To me, the addition of the drone in this case gave an unfair advantage to the hunter and prevented a trophy-class animal from knowing he was being pursued at all. There are too many slippery issues and temptations here. In numerous episodes, he informs hunters of a deer's current living location and drives away with an interview like: "maybe they will end up getting him"

If a buck gets shot in the foot, they call the drone tracker and say they shot a buck, he locates the barely wounded deer which bedded or feeding WITHOUT IT EVER KNOWING (unlike any type of foot pursuit), and then relays the specific GPS location to the hunter who then after the drone guy leaves makes a play on that deer, you cannot tell me the drone in this case is for "recovery only" if the deer anything but stone cold dead

 

[PEEJAY]

We don’t have to go further than the literal definition.

fair:without cheating or trying to achieve unjustadvantage.

chase: pursue in order to catch or catch up with

Hence, things like hunting from power vehicles and employing methods to immobilize the hunted animal are considered to infringe upon fair chase.

baiting isnt considered fair chase to most and certainly not P&Y. hunting with any source of electronic light on your bow sight doesnt qualify either for P&Y.

Employing methods to immobilize the animal... Like shooting it? lol isnt that the main goal of hunting. i think thats what nutter was getting at. Its not really fair to the deer no matter how you look at it unless youre just gonna grab a deer with your mitts... Which i have done and will never recommend. A healthy full grown doe will whoop a mans azz all over the woods. "Catchin' deers" or "catching up to" deer isnt the goal in my definition of hunting so a "literal" definition of fair chase goes right out the window for me. I follow p&y guidelines for hunting but i also understand i still have some serious advantages considering what my weapons are.

 

[PEEJAY]

i guess what im getting at is Fair chase is an imaginary line that humans have created to keep hunting sustainable. everyone has different opinions. I think baiting deer with a big ol barrel full of corn and a timer that goes off at 4pm every day is 1,000x worse than using a frickin drone to recover one you already shot as far as fair chase goes. Im sure traditional archery purists think my compound bow is an abomination to fair chase.

kinda goes along with some wise words from a long haired guy with a beard...
"He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone at her"

 

[Plebe]

baiting isnt considered fair chase to most and certainly not P&Y. hunting with any source of electronic light on your bow sight doesnt qualify either for P&Y.

Employing methods to immobilize the animal... Like shooting it? lol isnt that the main goal of hunting. i think thats what nutter was getting at. Its not really fair to the deer no matter how you look at it unless youre just gonna grab a deer with your mitts... Which i have done and will never recommend. A healthy full grown doe will whoop a mans azz all over the woods. "Catchin' deers" or "catching up to" deer isnt the goal in my definition of hunting so a "literal" definition of fair chase goes right out the window for me. I follow p&y guidelines for hunting but i also understand i still have some serious advantages considering what my weapons are.

Sedatives. Traps. Enclosures. TR didn't shoot the bear, btw.

We all know the game of hide and seek. The pursuit is tarnished when the pursuer affirmatively knows the locations of the hiders . Usually, as it goes, it's a tip to the youngest child, one lacking in facilities and experience to succeed on his or her own merits. Lets hunt like adults.

 

[PEEJAY]

Sedatives. Traps. Enclosures. TR didn't shoot the bear, btw.

We all know the game of hide and seek. The pursuit is tarnished when the pursuer affirmatively knows the locations of the hiders . Usually, as it goes, it's a tip to the youngest child, one lacking in facilities and experience to succeed on his or her own merits. Lets hunt like adults.

Right. I would throw electronic corn feeder right into that list. but plenty of adults would throw a tantrum if we took that away.

WWTRD

 

[CooterBrown]

Many years ago, I had carried my Grandsons fishing, on the way home thru the forest they had to pee so I stopped on a logging road. As soon as they started peeing they had to see who could pee the furthest, they were maybe 5-6 yrs old. We are what we are.

My 10-year-old bragged about this a few days ago on our last hunting trip. Man, I didn't realize I had lost some much reach in 44 years LOL

 

[Nutterbuster]

Fair chase is an imaginary line that humans have created to keep hunting sustainable. e

Bingo.

Fair chase evolved as a countermeasure to unsustainable practices. I think sustainable harvest was a step up from unsustainable harvest, and some consideration of animals was a step forward from no consideration.

But hunting's not fair, and it's not a game. Games are played by consenting parties who mutually agree upon the rules.

The only fairness problem we have in this thread is perceived fairness to other hunters.

 

[Plebe]

I'm not here as a hardliner, necessarily.

On the one hand, recovering every deer seems good.

On the other, https://saddlehunter.com/community/index.php?threads/wasting-meat.49938/

I'll reference a post from @neonomad from another thread that is thoughtful:



And while I truly wish every hunter success, and pray for quick kills and recoveries for each and every shot taken, I wonder if a crutch like this emboldens hunters to take on increased risks at the expense of their quarry. And to what end? One-upmanship?

Who is this intended to serve? Truly hungry peoples? Or sportsman?

 

[BTaylor]

Biggest difference between a drone and tracking dog to me is the glaring opportunity for miss use. I could easily claim I shot a deer and call in the drone to find him, whereas, no one is going to call in and pay for a tracking dog to go through the property if they actually havent shot anything. I would rather see folks put more effort into mastering their weapon and their hunting skills so they dont need a drone to find a critter they winged a shoot at because there is an easy button for recovery. Maybe put in the effort to learn how to track wounded game too. There was a comment erlier about spears and missing the tech we have and use now in the way of weapons and clothing, etc. I would be perfectly fine with going to selfbows and stone points, tanned hide clothing, etc. It would certainly cure the crowding problem.

 

[Loopwing]

The part that gets me is everyone keeps saying "what if it is used this way or that way". Some of the biggest poachers I know of and heard of are the most tech savvy people out there. People have been using drones to hunt animals since they came out. This guy probably got the idea from a poacher friend, lol.

Do you really think because it is illegal the poachers won't use it? Kind of like fun laws are only for the law abiding people.
I have no problem with good people using it for the right way to recover a deer. Criminals are criminals.

 

[BackSpasm]

The only fairness problem we have in this thread is perceived fairness to other hunters.

I know what you mean but I disagree, I don't care about it being easier for someone else to find or get their deer. I think it cheapens the experience and lessens the skill acquisition that gives this pursuit so much of its inherent value. I know this argument could be made about many forms of tech including trail cams and compound bows, but we agree there is a line in the sand somewhere before we get to poisoned corn piles. For me, that line is drawn before thermal drone imaging and the location of my own line has nothing to do with fairness to other hunters. Also, it is generally poor PR to nonhunters in my opinion to be tracking deer with thermal drones after you shoot them OR post youtube videos of them limping around the woods after someone made a crap shop

 

[Nutterbuster]

I don't care about it being easier for someone else to find or get their deer. I think it cheapens the experience and lessens the skill acquisition that gives this pursuit so much of its inherent value.

Right. It's a raisins vs no-raisins in coleslaw thing...personal taste. If you feel like you wouldn't appreciate a deer being recovered via drone, don't do it and all's good. But there are some people trying to make this a moral dilemma and suggesting that their taste should be imposed on others.

This isn't about what's fair or good for a deer as an individual or as a species. Considering the deer's wellbeing went out the window the minute someone decided to put a broadhead through its ribcage. Any consideration of fairness here concerns the interests of parties with a voice, namely, hunters.

It's a weird conversation.

 

[Plebe]

Right. It's a raisins vs no-raisins in coleslaw thing...personal taste. If you feel like you wouldn't appreciate a deer being recovered via drone, don't do it and all's good. But there are some people trying to make this a moral dilemma and suggesting that their taste should be imposed on others.

This isn't about what's fair or good for a deer as an individual or as a species. Considering the deer's wellbeing went out the window the minute someone decided to put a broadhead through its ribcage. Any consideration of fairness here concerns the interests of parties with a voice, namely, hunters.

It's a weird conversation.

There are much bigger conversations going on about drones than their use for recovering deer.

Trespassing, privacy, etc. Airspace is a new dimension, one that's largely unsettled.

Hunting is a small small cut of that. But one in which some states have weighed in already.

The loudest voice won't likely be hunting specific.

 

[JoyRyd]

So, would anyone here use Falconry to locate an animal? No screen to look at, but very similar. I know nothing about Falconry, just for comparison sake.

 

[Plebe]

So, would anyone here use Falconry to locate an animal? No screen to look at, but very similar. I know nothing about Falconry, just for comparison sake.

There was a video posted maybe last year that was exceptionally good. I think it was posted by @Nutterbuster. It was an interview with a dog tracker who was very experienced and knowledgeable. He had been working with birds too.

Yep..

MUST-WATCH FOR BOWHUNTERS - Blood Tracking Deer with Dogs

Above are parts 1 and 2 of a video interview with "Tracker John," a professional blood tracker with 4 decades of experience. As somebody with a pup who shows potential at trailing, it was very interesting. But I think it's worth a listen for anybody who shoves broadheads through deer. Part 2...

saddlehunter.com

 

[Kayl]

Oh yeah. What's stopping someone from using drones to stalk their ex or even kids. There are a lot of sickos out there and Amazon delivers. Look at the uses drones are being put to in Ukraine. Drones are in the infant stages now and controlled by people but pretty soon you could have drones making the decisions when and who to kill based on simple algorithms. it's not far-fetched at all.

Battery life. My drone can only fly for about 20 minutes. If I wanted to stalk someone, it'd be much easier to buy a cheap car that they don't know about and follow them.

 

[Shed84]

Technology, weapons, clothing it's all up to the individual where they draw the line. Things are going to advance faster now then ever and going to continue that way. "Slippery slope" and technology go hand in hand with everything it's applied to. My son doesn't know of an archery word without a rangefinder in it.His son won't know of a hunting season without drones in it.Its a run away train because there is too much money in it.U all can think of a handful of "influencers" that will be pimping the recovery drones. Personally for me I have a love for tracking deer from a young age.Was taken on a ton of track jobs by my father and uncles before I was old enough to even hunt.That passion I'm thankful for and is a huge part of the hunt that I don't want to forfeit. The sense of accomplishment I get from following a track and finding my deer at the end of it can not be replaced with watching it on a video screen.