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Ropeman Safety

powhound84 said:
I meant in saddle hunting there is no belay. The bottom line is this: A 3' fall on an ascender with static rope is probably going to damage your gear and/or result in injury. Worst case, complete failure. Friction hitches lessen the peak load in the event of a fall and are less likely to fail.
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ok gotcha, but that website is calculating on rock climbing not saddle hunting so the rope distance (belay to climber) is taken into the calculation
 
Aeds151 said:
How much feet is slacked in a rope doing one stick/hand climber method? I might be screwed...
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I use a little technique to reduce the risk while ascending with the hand climber. After lifting my feet up, while standing straight up, pull the tag end of the tether up at the same time.
 
dbldrew said:
ok gotcha, but that website is calculating on rock climbing not saddle hunting so the rope distance (belay to climber) is taken into the calculation
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There is virtually no difference between being connected to a belayer at the anchor and being connected directly to the anchor until you climb above the anchor, except direct-in is less dynamic.

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If you take the post rate of this thread, average post size in this thread, my current location among said posts (398), my BM frequency (only those which occur in my office), my average BM downtime and my own post read rate for the average post size then you will find that it is going to take me 37 days to become current.
 
dalton916 said:
If you take the post rate of this thread, average post size in this thread, my current location among said posts (398), my BM frequency (only those which occur in my office), my average BM downtime and my own post read rate for the average post size then you will find that it is going to take me 37 days to become current.
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Crap more math
 
dbldrew said:
that 80kg is just for the rating, so a 3.3% @ 300lbs will have a much higher % at 900lbs, so if you are generating ballpark 800-900lbs from a fall you are probably very close or even surpassing the 1' mark that the calculator is using.

Honestly this is kind of pointless, because really for this to ever be an issue you would have to A attach your ropeman at the bottom of your tether, and B remove your linemans belt and NOT tighten your tether.. and then transition onto your platform and fall.. Kind of an absurd scenario to be worried about.
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A "much higher" percentage of around 10%. In other words for one of the stretchier ropes people are using, with 3ft of tether about 3.5 in. Still nowhere near a ft. And most people are using less stretchy ropes.

@Steve Plemmons - the 20kn rating is probably for pulley use. As an ascender it is similar to the ropeman and would be expected to behave similarly. In general toothed ascenders all tend to shed sheathes in thr 4-6 kn range. The ropeman is just the one that cuts first. Again - you should always work to avoid loading yourself in such a manner anyway, but that device is almost certainly not rated for that load in this usage.
 
mattsteg said:
A "much higher" percentage of around 10%. In other words for one of the stretchier ropes people are using, with 3ft of tether about 3.5 in. Still nowhere near a ft. And most people are using less stretchy ropes.

@Steve Plemmons - the 20kn rating is probably for pulley use. As an ascender it is similar to the ropeman and would be expected to behave similarly. In general toothed ascenders all tend to shed sheathes in thr 4-6 kn range. The ropeman is just the one that cuts first. Again - you should always work to avoid loading yourself in such a manner anyway, but that device is almost certainly not rated for that load in this usage.
Click to expand...

@mattsteg check out this video at about 11:06. I'm no expert, but let me know what you think about this. Thanks.

 
powhound84 said:
There is virtually no difference between being connected to a belayer at the anchor and being connected directly to the anchor until you climb above the anchor, except direct-in is less dynamic.

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im not sure what you mean. But the longer the distance from belayer to climber means more rope, which = more bungee effect reducing the kn on gear/climber

So even with that fall calculator it shows a 200lb person with a 20foot rope and 6 feet above anchor = 6.6kn But that same 200lb 6 feet above anchor but a 100 foot rope its only 5.4kn, so the extra bungee effect of the longer rope reduces the kn.
 
mattsteg said:
A "much higher" percentage of around 10%. In other words for one of the stretchier ropes people are using, with 3ft of tether about 3.5 in. Still nowhere near a ft. And most people are using less stretchy ropes.

@Steve Plemmons - the 20kn rating is probably for pulley use. As an ascender it is similar to the ropeman and would be expected to behave similarly. In general toothed ascenders all tend to shed sheathes in thr 4-6 kn range. The ropeman is just the one that cuts first. Again - you should always work to avoid loading yourself in such a manner anyway, but that device is almost certainly not rated for that load in this usage.
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a 3 foot tether wouldnt leave you any slack to generate a fall anyway. in fact that probably wouldn't even give you enough to fit around a tree and have anything to attach to in the first place. Most people I'm assuming are running ballpark 8' tethers which even with that doesn't leave you much slack distance to generate a long fall. It all depends on how long your tether is and the dia of the tree.
 
Food for thought:

The Dangers of Short Static Falls

I was going to post this in response to an ongoing thread but think it deserves more attention. This is a great read for everyone on this forum just as a reminder of how short falls on static systems can be devastating...
saddlehunter.com
 
dbldrew said:
a 3 foot tether wouldnt leave you any slack to generate a fall anyway. in fact that probably wouldn't even give you enough to fit around a tree and have anything to attach to in the first place. Most people I'm assuming are running ballpark 8' tethers which even with that doesn't leave you much slack distance to generate a long fall. It all depends on how long your tether is and the dia of the tree.
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Only the portion of your tether between you and the tree "counts".
 
Somebody call Mythbusters. I’m sure they can source a dummy with an artificial spine.


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mattsteg said:
Only the portion of your tether between you and the tree "counts".
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well kinda, you can still get elongation on the part that wraps around the tree.. although it would be reduced due to the friction of the tree. but even if you are talking a 3 foot tether not including the wrap. if you have your tether height right around head height.. 3 foot puts the end of your tether crotch height.. so depending on your bridge length your falling what 18" or so? So small length tethers that dont have much elongation also dont have much fall distance either
 

The Dangers of Short Static Falls

I was going to post this in response to an ongoing thread but think it deserves more attention. This is a great read for everyone on this forum just as a reminder of how short falls on static systems can be devastating...
saddlehunter.com

You don't need big distance for big forces.
 
Steve Plemmons said:
@mattsteg check out this video at about 11:06. I'm no expert, but let me know what you think about this. Thanks.

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It looks promising. My pnly concern would be if impact loading, or the different angle it grabs the rope at when used normally as an ascender vs. His unorthodox loading would change the behavior. The device looks pretty stout.

Note they only rate it for 4kn as a rope clamp.
Screenshot_20191014-152307_qPDF Notes.jpgScreenshot_20191014-152307_qPDF Notes.jpg
 
Holy moly, I cant believe this thread is still ongoing. The real question after all of this, did it change anyone's mind about using a ropeman, lol.

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PaTrout1 said:
Holy moly, I cant believe this thread is still ongoing. The real question after all of this, did it change anyone's mind about using a ropeman, lol.

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Not sure if this or the sweet oplux changed my mind, but I sold both of mine for the oplux and Beal jammy set up.


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PaTrout1 said:
Holy moly, I cant believe this thread is still ongoing. The real question after all of this, did it change anyone's mind about using a ropeman, lol.

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Click to expand...

Switched the RM to my LB. Switching to webbing tether made it an easy choice lol
 
I switched to oplux and beal jammy but it was a nightmare. I put ropeman 1 on the oplux with beal to back it up. Much better


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