Single stick cam cleat or cam buckle

[MBH]

Thinking about going back to cam buckle just looks like a better connection to stick never had a problem with cam cleat it just looks like a accident waiting to happen. ??? What do you think?

 

[JBDaddy]

So, you'll be midway up your climb... you stand on the top of your stick, raise your tether, and it comes time to reach down, loosen your stick below you and raise it to the next position of your climb... I don't exactly understand how you're gonna do that?

The nice thing about the cam cleat is that it fastens securely enough to climb on, AND you can just yank the tag end of your rope out to release it for the next move.

Do I misunderstand something about your climbing method that makes the cam buckle work similarly?

 

[Cbigbear]

I much prefer a cam buckle.

 

[PEEJAY]

So, you'll be midway up your climb... you stand on the top of your stick, raise your tether, and it comes time to reach down, loosen your stick below you and raise it to the next position of your climb... I don't exactly understand how you're gonna do that?

The nice thing about the cam cleat is that it fastens securely enough to climb on, AND you can just yank the tag end of your rope out to release it for the next move.

Do I misunderstand something about your climbing method that makes the cam buckle work similarly?

I think you would just reach down and pinch the cam buckle... if you can reach the tag end on a cleat you can reach the buckle.

Another method nobody really uses is a boat cleat design. but it works great for one sticking and it takes the mech failure part out of the climb if that's what you're worries about. wrap it just like you tie up a boat with a cleat hitch and it comes loose real easy. i still use it. If it holds puff daddys 150' yacht it should hold my arse just fine. I use amsteel.

 

[kobudo]

Regular buckle for me. I just slack the strap a little bit when setting, not exactly horizontal. It's loose enough to pull up to you. I do this mostly because I already had it on hand. I have not seen any reason to change quite yet.

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[jgleas114]

Cam cleat is the way to go


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[alabamahunt22]

I agree with the boat cleat style I always wondered why no one has came out one for climbing sticks yet. Would be quieter than a buck and lighter I would think.

 

[KYRanger]

Since you are considering going back to a cam buckle, you have apparently used both. The cam buckle is slow and cumbersome. I’m not sure if there is really any reliability advantage. The advantages of the cam cleat are covered pretty good in this forum. I couldn’t imagine going to a cam buckle for one sticking. I find the cam cleat to be the smoothest, fastest and easiest method to one stick. They are very reliable and I have yet to have a problem with mine. I‘m sure any device could fail, but I’m not convinced those little cam buckles held together by a tiny pin and a spring are any more robust or reliable than a cam cleat. But I don’t have data to prove it.

The analogy of the boat cleat is good, and if I am not mistaken, the CAM CLEAT was actually developed for marine / mooring industry. Perhaps a CAM CLEAT could hold Puff Daddy’s Yacht too!

If it’s fear of cam cleat failure, then you should probably use what makes you feel safest. Personally, I try to use only components that I’m confident in.

 

[Cbigbear]

Since you are considering going back to a cam buckle, you have apparently used both. The cam buckle is slow and cumbersome. I’m not sure if there is really any reliability advantage. The advantages of the cam cleat are covered pretty good in this forum. I couldn’t imagine going to a cam buckle for one sticking. I find the cam cleat to be the smoothest, fastest and easiest method to one stick.

Do you have a timeframe for unhooking & reattaching your cam cleat? The cam buckle takes approx 20 secs. to loosen, move, & tighten.

 

[BTaylor]

I think you would just reach down and pinch the cam buckle... if you can reach the tag end on a cleat you can reach the buckle.

Another method nobody really uses is a boat cleat design. but it works great for one sticking and it takes the mech failure part out of the climb if that's what you're worries about. wrap it just like you tie up a boat with a cleat hitch and it comes loose real easy. i still use it. If it holds puff daddys 150' yacht it should hold my arse just fine. I use amsteel.View attachment 78046View attachment 78048

Would you mind explaining that setup in a little more detail?

 

[PEEJAY]

Perhaps a CAM CLEAT could hold Puff Daddy’s Yacht too!

If it’s fear of cam cleat failure, then you should probably use what makes you feel safest. Personally, I try to use only components that I’m confident in.

Haha. Perhaps not. I know what the cam cleats are used for but im not really into sailing. Makes me yawn. Those hydrofoil sailboats look like a pretty wild time though. I had my uscg captains license and worked on boats for 12 years. I wouldn't use one of those little 150's to tie up a 20' boat. harken (although a reliable brand overall from what i hear) sells rebuild kits. That's my red flag. I think guys using these should pull them off and inspect at the end of the season if they hunt a lot. I understand they work great for the application and we're all tethered in anyway. I replace my amsteel when it starts to fray but I worry "out of sight out of mind" with the cam cleats. Everything that could fail is on the inside.

 

[PEEJAY]

Would you mind explaining that setup in a little more detail?

It's a bolt and nut with 1" delrin washers in between on both sides of the square tubing. Then amsteel is permanently attached and buried. Run it in a figure 8 around the posts and a half hitch to lock it. Once it's pulled tight you're good it's not goin anywhere. Loosen the half hitch to untie and advance the stick and repeat.

Honestly, if you had a stick like the hawk helium or skeletor (or any stick really), u could probably attach a real boat cleat to the front.

Here's an old 2018 thread explaining it credit to wirrex: https://saddlehunter.com/community/index.php?threads/ditched-the-button.7399/

 

[BTaylor]

It's a bolt and nut with 1" delrin washers in between on both sides of the square tubing. Then amsteel is permanently attached and buried. Run it in a figure 8 around the posts and a half hitch to lock it. Once it's pulled tight you're good it's not goin anywhere. Loosen the half hitch to untie and advance the stick and repeat.

Honestly, if you had a stick like the hawk helium or skeletor (or any stick really), u could probably attach a real boat cleat to the front.

Here's an old 2018 thread explaining it credit to wirrex: https://saddlehunter.com/community/index.php?threads/ditched-the-button.7399/

I am about to have a setup where that will be really useful.

 

[oldsouth]

I built my own one stick and decided to take one of the DIY Amsteel daisy chains from my helium's and I just use the daisy chain to one stick with. I do not get the stick real tight to the tree when climbing(as mentioned above). Once I'm at hunting height with my stick and one of the openings in the daisy chain doesn't line up right I loop around versa button and put tag end of chain through another opening tag side of tree then go back to versa button and loop the closest opening. That gets tight enough and provides more then enough stability for standing and side pressures. I have been using the daisy chain for the last 2 years while testing my one stick design and I feel it is fast, quiet and easy to unhook when advancing since its somewhat loose.

 

[KYRanger]

Haha. Perhaps not. I know what the cam cleats are used for but im not really into sailing. Makes me yawn. Those hydrofoil sailboats look like a pretty wild time though. I had my uscg captains license and worked on boats for 12 years. I wouldn't use one of those little 150's to tie up a 20' boat. harken (although a reliable brand overall from what i hear) sells rebuild kits. That's my red flag. I think guys using these should pull them off and inspect at the end of the season if they hunt a lot. I understand they work great for the application and we're all tethered in anyway. I replace my amsteel when it starts to fray but I worry "out of sight out of mind" with the cam cleats. Everything that could fail is on the inside.

I’m not gonna disagree with you, and I personally have a 72’ vessel that I wouldn’t use a cam cleat for. That’s another discussion. But nor would I use a cam buckle. Like the cam cleat, the cam Buckle and all things safety related should be inspected carefully on a regular basis.
Now back to sailing, I mean hunting.

 

[BTaylor]

I’m not gonna disagree with you, and I personally have a 72’ vessel that I wouldn’t use a cam cleat for. That’s another discussion. But nor would I use a cam buckle. Like the cam cleat, the cam Buckle and all things safety related should be inspected carefully on a regular basis.
Now back to sailing, I mean hunting.

72 footer will haul a lot of duck decoys.

 

[KYRanger]

Do you have a timeframe for unhooking & reattaching your cam cleat? The cam buckle takes approx 20 secs. to loosen, move, & tighten.

Well, I have not put a stop watch on it and don’t really need to. But it’s likely 5-7 seconds. So if your 20 seconds is accurate, and my 7 seconds is accurate on 3-4 moves its only 28 seconds. Agree that’s not alot of time. My point is that for me, it is faster, it is easier, it is smoother. I think it’s less chance for noise, although that may be able to be mitigated. Im not trying to convince you, you asked for opinions. As I said, if safety is the concern stick with what makes you safest or feel safest.

 

[KYRanger]

72 footer will haul a lot of duck decoys.

If only I duck hunted. But it’s not much of a duck boat.

 

[Ontariofarmer]

Since you are considering going back to a cam buckle, you have apparently used both. The cam buckle is slow and cumbersome. I’m not sure if there is really any reliability advantage. The advantages of the cam cleat are covered pretty good in this forum. I couldn’t imagine going to a cam buckle for one sticking. I find the cam cleat to be the smoothest, fastest and easiest method to one stick. They are very reliable and I have yet to have a problem with mine. I‘m sure any device could fail, but I’m not convinced those little cam buckles held together by a tiny pin and a spring are any more robust or reliable than a cam cleat. But I don’t have data to prove it.

The analogy of the boat cleat is good, and if I am not mistaken, the CAM CLEAT was actually developed for marine / mooring industry. Perhaps a CAM CLEAT could hold Puff Daddy’s Yacht too!

If it’s fear of cam cleat failure, then you should probably use what makes you feel safest. Personally, I try to use only components that I’m confident in.

I doubt a cam cleat properly sized for your weight would break. A few years ago I put an undersized cam cleat on a stick and tethered up and jumped up and down on the stick to test it.
After about 100 bounces the center popped out and it failed.
Two hundred pounds jumping on a small cam cleat rated at 175 pounds took a lot of effort to break.
I was trying to make a super light stick. The reason for the test.


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[Cbigbear]

Well, I have not put a stop watch on it and don’t really need to. But it’s likely 5-7 seconds. So if your 20 seconds is accurate, and my 7 seconds is accurate on 3-4 moves its only 28 seconds. Agree that’s not alot of time. My point is that for me, it is faster, it is easier, it is smoother. I think it’s less chance for noise, although that may be able to be mitigated. Im not trying to convince you, you asked for opinions. As I said, if safety is the concern stick with what makes you safest or feel safest.

I believe the original poster may have asked for opinions. I was actually looking for quantitative data with regards to the efficiency of the cam cleat.

A cam cleat is recommended in probably 99% of post I’ve seen on various social media outlets, however I’ve never seen it supported with real data. Could someone using a cam cleat give me some comparison data showing where it out performs other methods?

I’m not in support of any method just wondering why the cam cleat is better than all other methods.