The Helo is Getting me Out of the Saddle

[kyler1945]

I’ve thought about the jx3 but it’s expensive and heavy

For those concerned about the weight of the JX3 Hybrid

I've edited the original content of this post. I screwed up my math in the handwritten stuff in later posts, but I correct it. In this post I've updated the weight of my setup based on the completed modification of the hybrid. You can check out how I have my hybrid set up right now here...

saddlehunter.com

 

[PEEJAY]

I got my Original LW sandcast stand that is just as light as that HELO. Not all the bells and whistles but it works great on straight trees. I hate leaners anyway. i usually only use it on private where i know i have a tree it will work on and leave it for a while. I want to modify it to lean but its still in mint condition and might be worth some money one day. Replaced the cables and seat cushion and put some LW backpack straps on it. cool piece of hunting history.

 

[Plebe]

I’ve thought about the jx3 but it’s expensive and heavy

It carries really nicely. Much better than the sand cast treestand with webbing shoulder straps and sticks that has been pretty much the norm for some time.

Don't get me wrong, it's not the lightest setup I can name either.

But, I was impressed with how light it feels, even with a few climbing sticks and late season outerwear.

 

[John 35]

Weak side shot out of a JX3 or a Guido's web is no different for me than the same shot from a soft saddle. Have executed it from both multiple times.

If you're not comfortable buying one new without trying it out, there are good deals on used ones here and there. I would definitely recommend buying used if you aren't sure. Even better find someone close by and buy them beer or something so you can try it out.

I have come around to the fact that really short people might struggle with shooting from the hybrid on shots under 10 yards from typical hunting heights. I don't think it's something that can't be overcome. But I've just seen enough people complain/imagine/contemplate about it, that I'm willing to listen.

Weak side shot no different than a soft saddle though. If you're going to struggle in your diaper, you're going to struggle in the lazy boy, and vice versa...

Wouldn’t it be hard to turn around on a platform strapped in to what’s essentially a chair? Not every tree is suitable to travel around for a weak side shot. That’s always been my reservation about the jx3.

 

[kyler1945]

Wouldn’t it be hard to turn around on a platform strapped in to what’s essentially a chair? Not every tree is suitable to travel around for a weak side shot. That’s always been my reservation about the jx3.

Sorry, when I refer to a weak side shot, I mean shooting on my weak side (over bridge) without repositioning myself on the tree, or standing up on a platform and spinning around.

Neither of the scenarios you describe here fall into that definition for me.

Platform and hybrid makes no sense to me.

Spinning around a tree to shoot a deer works sometimes, sometimes not. I do know that the further away a deer is when you attempt the move, the higher the odds are you’ll pull it off. This is more “hunting” strategy, than it is the difference in a hybrid and other ways to hunt at height. Knowing how/when to address deer is a skill that takes a long time to refine.

 

[Plebe]

Sorry, when I refer to a weak side shot, I mean shooting on my weak side (over bridge) without repositioning myself on the tree, or standing up on a platform and spinning around.

Neither of the scenarios you describe here fall into that definition for me.

Platform and hybrid makes no sense to me.

Spinning around a tree to shoot a deer works sometimes, sometimes not. I do know that the further away a deer is when you attempt the move, the higher the odds are you’ll pull it off. This is more “hunting” strategy, than it is the difference in a hybrid and other ways to hunt at height. Knowing how/when to address deer is a skill that takes a long time to refine.

So, turning on a platform to shoot the weak side isn't technically a weak side shot as it positions the shooter to execute the shot on their strong side.

 

[bowhunthard88]

I haven't sold ALL of my treestands, but I have sold MOST of them, including my pride-and-joy "mobile" setup when I committed to saddle hunting. That being said, I personally prefer my saddle setup over treestands, primarily because of where I hunt (pack footprint is more important than weight). Comfort is comparable for me between the two.

I did really like my "mobile" treestand setup, though: a Millenium M7 modified (removed hook and bracket) with a top stand-off, that used a bushing mounted versa-button and OCB strap, with a platform mounted bow hand side bow holder. I was working on platform leveling, but I didn't quite get there before saddle hunting got me... Climbers are very dependent on quality trees per location...

 

[Petrichor]

It carries really nicely. Much better than the sand cast treestand with webbing shoulder straps and sticks that has been pretty much the norm for some time.

Don't get me wrong, it's not the lightest setup I can name either.

But, I was impressed with how light it feels, even with a few climbing sticks and late season outerwear.

I’m sure it Carries better. It looks amazing. But by the time you add sticks, and ros the cost is astronomical and the weight isn’t any real savings. So I’m just wondering is the carry that much better to justify the cost?

 

[enkriss]

I’m sure it Carries better. It looks amazing. But by the time you add sticks, and ros the cost is astronomical and the weight isn’t any real savings. So I’m just wondering is the carry that much better to justify the cost?

Absolutely not. Some people love them some people hate them. I didn’t like it. Felt like if you got stuck on the low side of the tree like a plumb bob it was much more difficult than a saddle to work yourself back to the top side.

 

[John 35]

So, turning on a platform to shoot the weak side isn't technically a weak side shot as it positions the shooter to execute the shot on their strong side.

The weak side shot was just in my mind all along.

 

[Plebe]

I’m sure it Carries better. It looks amazing. But by the time you add sticks, and ros the cost is astronomical and the weight isn’t any real savings. So I’m just wondering is the carry that much better to justify the cost?

I paid under $300 for mine, basically new, via Classifieds. So quite a bit less than a new TX5 Lonestar...or a new JX3.

I know they retail over $450, which is much more than other saddles, but compare what it takes to produce one vs most other saddles and the cost makes more sense.

It's not a goal of mine to champion or promote JX3. Some of the criticisms are unfair, and some of the advantages are a bit overblown, at least to me.

As far as system expense, cost is dependent on the chosen components. I have way more into my stand and soft saddle setups due to my personal choices in gear.

But, to generalize, many popular saddles are $250+ and platforms around $200, and folks normally add a day pack.

Assuming the same climbing method, a "typical" saddle + platform + pack is going to be a wash in price with a "typical" JX3 + ROS + pouches or bag.

The popular "mobile" hang-on stands are going to cost more than a platform, generally, but maybe RCH saves a bit over a saddle. Pack cost could vary greatly depending on how you want to carry the stand. Could be a wash, or quite a bit more than a JX3 setup.

A climber could be the least cost, perhaps.

All said, cost will depend.

Does it carry that much better to justify the cost? This isn't a question I've considered and I think the answer is, it depends.

I will say, it carries far better for than my Sit and Climb and daypack setup did. I don't think it will carry as well as my Kifaru frame pack when weighted down.

I wouldn't really call the JX3 a frame pack. It shares some commonalities, but it's a bit more limited. However, it feels very light with a moderate hunting loadout, such that I don't consider it heavy.

 

[Plebe]

Absolutely not. Some people love them some people hate them. I didn’t like it. Felt like if you got stuck on the low side of the tree like a plumb bob it was much more difficult than a saddle to work yourself back to the top side.

I haven't found it very comfortable sitting in a hang-on on the low side of a tree.

 

[Petrichor]

Well thanks for info. Probably will grab an m7 at some point, but I’m gonna pass on the jx3.

 

[ketch22]

I’be personally found that regardless of wether I’m in a saddle or a stand there is always a blind side. Even with my ROS you’re going to always have your back turned to something. The main reason I got out of the stand was curiosity which quickly lead to safety. Obviously this doesn’t apply to everyone but i fee much more comfortable in a saddle than hanging off the side of a tree trying to hang a stand.

even more so rappelling down. Being tied in going down is a major confidence booster for me.

but I had a novix echo, it was rock solid, if I needed another stand the helo would definitely be it.

 

[kyler1945]

I paid under $300 for mine, basically new, via Classifieds. So quite a bit less than a new TX5 Lonestar...or a new JX3.

I know they retail over $450, which is much more than other saddles, but compare what it takes to produce one vs most other saddles and the cost makes more sense.

It's not a goal of mine to champion or promote JX3. Some of the criticisms are unfair, and some of the advantages are a bit overblown, at least to me.

As far as system expense, cost is dependent on the chosen components. I have way more into my stand and soft saddle setups due to my personal choices in gear.

But, to generalize, many popular saddles are $250+ and platforms around $200, and folks normally add a day pack.

Assuming the same climbing method, a "typical" saddle + platform + pack is going to be a wash in price with a "typical" JX3 + ROS + pouches or bag.

The popular "mobile" hang-on stands are going to cost more than a platform, generally, but maybe RCH saves a bit over a saddle. Pack cost could vary greatly depending on how you want to carry the stand. Could be a wash, or quite a bit more than a JX3 setup.

A climber could be the least cost, perhaps.

All said, cost will depend.

Does it carry that much better to justify the cost? This isn't a question I've considered and I think the answer is, it depends.

I will say, it carries far better for than my Sit and Climb and daypack setup did. I don't think it will carry as well as my Kifaru frame pack when weighted down.

I wouldn't really call the JX3 a frame pack. It shares some commonalities, but it's a bit more limited. However, it feels very light with a moderate hunting loadout, such that I don't consider it heavy.

Cost of tethrd phantom kit and predator platform 570.00 plus shipping.

Cost of hybrid and ring of squirrel steps on OCB 570.00 plus shipping.

I don’t see why people keep saying it’s expensive compared to soft saddles.

 

[kyler1945]

Also, I think everyone will have forgotten than Dan charged 600.00 for the beast stand in a year.

Everyone will be used to paying 500-1000 for stands (for many reasons).

He just recognized where buying trends were going a year or two ahead. The net result is people will still end up paying the high price. And he’ll have made a few extra bucks, while also managing peoples expectations better.


All that said, we all better buckle in for a very volatile future from a consumption standpoint. Cheap stuff is going to be a relic of a bygone era…

 

[Petrichor]

Cost of tethrd phantom kit and predator platform 570.00 plus shipping.

Cost of hybrid and ring of squirrel steps on OCB 570.00 plus shipping.

I don’t see why people keep saying it’s expensive compared to soft saddles.

People say it’s expensive, Because it is. Your comparing apples to oranges. Ros with soft saddle way less. The saddle is 150-200 more than many of the main stream soft saddles on the market. A direct comparison of same climbing method and same ros would tell you that. Or you could just look at the price of the saddles themselves. People say it because it is actually numerically true. I’m not saying it’s not worth it. I just can’t logically seem to make the calculation worth it for me. In my brain.

 

[kyler1945]

People say it’s expensive, Because it is. Your comparing apples to oranges. Ros with soft saddle way less. The saddle is 150-200 more than many of the main stream soft saddles on the market. A direct comparison of same climbing method and same ros would tell you that. Or you could just look at the price of the saddles themselves. People say it because it is actually numerically true. I’m not saying it’s not worth it. I just can’t logically seem to make the calculation worth it for me. In my brain.

The whole predator kit is 400.00 plus shipping. The hybrid kit is 450 plus shipping.

It’s 50.00 more.

I’m not saying it’s cheap in absolute terms. I’m saying the cost difference is small relatively, swallowed up the everything else we spend money on.

Hunting equipment suppliers have recognized that they’ve been leaving profit on the table and are changing that. John is not one of those suppliers. The cost to make the hybrid is 10x at minimum what a soft saddle costs to make.

 

[bodark]

Also, I think everyone will have forgotten than Dan charged 600.00 for the beast stand in a year.

Everyone will be used to paying 500-1000 for stands (for many reasons).

He just recognized where buying trends were going a year or two ahead. The net result is people will still end up paying the high price. And he’ll have made a few extra bucks, while also managing peoples expectations better.


All that said, we all better buckle in for a very volatile future from a consumption standpoint. Cheap stuff is going to be a relic of a bygone era…

You said it right there. We had a really good two year run with boutique hunting equipment from tons of different manufacturers for relatively inexpensive considering what it costs to get something like that up and running. Those days are now behind us I’m afraid.

 

[Petrichor]

The whole predator kit is 400.00 plus shipping. The hybrid kit is 450 plus shipping.

It’s 50.00 more.

I’m not saying it’s cheap in absolute terms. I’m saying the cost difference is small relatively, swallowed up the everything else we spend money on.

Hunting equipment suppliers have recognized that they’ve been leaving profit on the table and are changing that. John is not one of those suppliers. The cost to make the hybrid is 10x at minimum what a soft saddle costs to make.

I see how you get there with the linesman and all that included. Still can’t get past the weight. Again appreciate the info.