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Thick cover questions

You are right that they all have hard transitions. So softer transitions where the more open woods like in my pictures would gradually transition into the virtually impenetrable stuff would be better?

I have definitely crawled on my hands and knees quite a bit while scouting in the post-season, so I know of some very thick areas. I just don’t know how to hunt those, I guess. Thanks for weighing in!


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Yes exactly. Especially some sort of change or breakup in that transition like a corner, point, finger, bowl, etc. thats where the bucks in my areas are mostly during the day.
look for small food sources right on the edges of these to.
 
Circling bedding is probably better advice. I haven't found that good bedding area yet though so I keep going in to find out

It’s public land. Those bedding areas are likely to have been stunk up plenty by now. And the deer are probably nonplussed by intrusion depending on the tract, and won’t bust completely outta town just because of you. They might skirt your presence and watch you walk by unaware they’re onto you, but I can guarantee that’s already happening. So have some fun man. Be smart about the wind, but go find those deer!

Yes I agree, perhaps I should have been more clear on my own comment. I don’t think one hunter on public is going to crush a bedding area by going through it, but sticking to edges as much as possible, or keeping intrusion as unintrusive as possible, is still a good idea. BUT if you can keep wind in your favor, you can still-hunt bedding on public land without popping every deer outta dodge, IMO. They are used to ppl mucking around in their living rooms on public land, that bedding area was a bedding area because it worked. If they bust every time a hunter comes in, it’s doing its job as a bedding area. Thus, they’ll be back. So if you can get there without every one of them busting out, hunt the doorways, keep tabs on both hunter habits and deer habits…you’ll get an opportunity to shoot a deer before you ruin that bedding area on public land.
Just my opinion, and I’m by no means a cervid serial killer. But you can get away with more on public, within reason, than people give credit for. I’ve seen deer pop out of bedding from my tree, putt around and do deer stuff, hear a human hiking towards them, casually dip back into bedding and watch the human pass, then casually walk back out and resume deerness. It’s also what makes public such a challenge, and why I’m glad deer don’t hunt us.
 
Man I’m lazy and I hate ticks and snakes, I don’t hunt “in” the thick stuff but I sure like to hunt right by it. When I first started hunting public, for maybe 5 years, I would stomp all around the woods trynna answer similar questions to OP’s. I got a lot of miles on the boots and ground registered in the databanks, that’s for sure. I also spent tons of hours pulling burrs out of my clothes by hand, getting tangled in stuff, bumping deer up out of beds, sinking into heat exhaustion or dehydration, freezing myself to near emergency status, hauling a treestand where a treestand was useless, or getting so frustrated with hauling it to the thick stuff that I started ground hunting exclusively until I got a saddle, and sometimes…completely the opposite, staying in open timber or a field edge, expecting deer to just show up where I happened to be with no real reason to be there other than I saw acorns and someone told me deer like acorns or there were a few tracks cutting across an open area.
But once I started seeing the tracks leading into and out of the thick stuff, how and why they might have crossed that open area, where those acorns were in relation to the thick cover or how the land transitions (years and miles on the boots), I started to see more deer. I practiced reading maps better and correlating once I got to a location, etc.
Also, I agree with others that “thick” has a wide margin of description based on your geography. Where I used to hunt in DE, thick meant you couldn’t see 5 feet past yourself on the ground, often swampy or thorny, nasty nasty stuff, and I would hang my set like 10-15 yards just outside of that on the first tree I could get a few sticks into with a view on a runway (or “tunnel” lol) into or out of that cover. Bonus points for an oak or persimmon or apple tree nearby. Here in OH where I hunt now, thick means just a higher stem count, more honeysuckle and grapevine just kind of obstructing some view but you can still see a few yards in any direction, and often close to a larger destination food source or something like that. But the principle of setting up right near a runway into or out of that is the same. I really benefit from post-season scouting in this regard. The thickest stuff is usually passable, or at least observable and trudgeable, in Jan and Feb. Mark gps locations, prep trees, and if you can’t cut limbs or clear brush with tools, you can stomp down trails and snap stuff with your hands and boots, put tacks on trunks, plan entries and exits, etc. for next season, and may only require a little TLC when you get back to hunt it later.
I really can’t say enough about getting your boots on (maybe leaving your climbing gear at the truck sometimes, or just a stick or two and small platform), grabbing some water and a map, and lugging your bow all over public ground until you start to see these features reveal themselves. Then bring the saddle gear in when you think you have an idea, and sit for a few hours in a tree that you believe will put deer in your eyes.
This is a really great thread btw. Too many newer (and more experienced) hunters are embarrassed to admit they are wondering the same things. I’m still learning about this stuff every time I go into woods, and expect to be made a complete fool of by the deer at least once every few hunts. Some days it’s easier, you just nail the spot selection and have a great hunt, more times you’ll see few or no deer and be completely wrong or your timing completely off. Oh well, that’s hunting. Enjoy it all, and good luck!

Good reply.

I think it's tough to nail down the level of deer intelligence and how it varies with deer age/sex and how this influences their behavior.

When I first started bowhunting 30 years ago, it was all magazines and I only looked at gear and as a teenager thought all those deer behavior articles were crud. I also thought deer were way dumber than they are. Then I realized I was wrong and swung the other way and thought mature bucks were as smart as chimps or something.

They are somewhere in the middle there, and they have their defined behaviors but also memory and ability to learn.

You also have a sort of reverse causation going on with them. I have a perfect area for deer to wind me. And there are big bucks there. Now, did the big bucks know that and figure it out? Or, did any little buck born there get lucky and had an advantage and so they survived to older age?
 
Trees on the edge of the thick stuff. That particular property is a jungle. No way to get in without hedge clippers and alerting everything nearby. Early season, it sucks. Late season, it sucks. But just before the rut, the scrapes on the edges were hot.
So it sounds like you're getting most shots right to the edge? Or are you often shooting into the cover, too?
 
The best advice I can give anyone when going to a new piece of woods to scout is pretty simple, stand there after getting out of your truck and pretend Seal Team 6 is after your ass and you’ve got 30 minutes to hide, that’s what your looking for, if the whole woods looks like that kind of terrain you have your work cut out for you narrowing down the better spots, if it’s wide open, like a local dog park, big trees, good visibility for 50-100 yards in all directions, that kind of terrain will not be productive for mature, daylight deer movement, of course during the peak of the rut all bets are off and it’s a complete circus, anybody's guess then. If the woods is big, before you even drive to a new piece of land find those thick areas on ONX or whatever you use, look for the ones with the worst access, places most won’t go, wear waders and cross water if that’s what it takes, a small boat, whatever… once I’ve established those kind of key locations I don’t dive in, I circle it, walk the entire edge looking for buck sign, rub lines, runways, mark everything on ONX as you go, don’t stare at your phone while walking through the woods trying to analyze it then, keep hammering away, covering ground is the key while your there, later that night or whenever you get back then sit down and go over all the data you’ve collected, connect the dots, see if you find a pattern, look at how wind direction may be influencing deer to enter and exit certain thick/bedding spots you circled and scouted, I can’t stress how important this is to cover as much ground as possible your first time out, marking everything as you go on ONX, what may seem insignificant while afield could prove to be later on the piece that solves the puzzle in locating your target animal. On the next trip to scout, you should have a better idea on what areas to key in on from your previous research, then I mite dive in, it all depends, time of year, just how big it is, these are all factors as to when or if I begin to crawl through some thick **** hole, every situation is different. Once you’ve found your nasty thick honey hole, only you can decide how far you can or can’t push in to set up when hunting without blowing the whole place up, nobody can answer that, each time is different, the real secret is having multiple spots like this so when you wreck one it’s on to the next one for another try. If you can find a narrow thick finger connecting a couple thick spots like this better yet, now you have a perfect all day rut spot, those are gold. Hope this helps.
That helps a lot! I have done some decent scouting over the past couple of years and marked a ton of stuff on my apps (trails, likely bedding, rubs, scrapes, oaks/other potential food sources, etc.). I have marked trees that I thought would be good setups, but now I'm thinking I'm not close enough to the thick areas. I'll definitely make that the focus in my next round of scouting!
 
Man I’m lazy and I hate ticks and snakes, I don’t hunt “in” the thick stuff but I sure like to hunt right by it. When I first started hunting public, for maybe 5 years, I would stomp all around the woods trynna answer similar questions to OP’s. I got a lot of miles on the boots and ground registered in the databanks, that’s for sure. I also spent tons of hours pulling burrs out of my clothes by hand, getting tangled in stuff, bumping deer up out of beds, sinking into heat exhaustion or dehydration, freezing myself to near emergency status, hauling a treestand where a treestand was useless, or getting so frustrated with hauling it to the thick stuff that I started ground hunting exclusively until I got a saddle, and sometimes…completely the opposite, staying in open timber or a field edge, expecting deer to just show up where I happened to be with no real reason to be there other than I saw acorns and someone told me deer like acorns or there were a few tracks cutting across an open area.
But once I started seeing the tracks leading into and out of the thick stuff, how and why they might have crossed that open area, where those acorns were in relation to the thick cover or how the land transitions (years and miles on the boots), I started to see more deer. I practiced reading maps better and correlating once I got to a location, etc.
Also, I agree with others that “thick” has a wide margin of description based on your geography. Where I used to hunt in DE, thick meant you couldn’t see 5 feet past yourself on the ground, often swampy or thorny, nasty nasty stuff, and I would hang my set like 10-15 yards just outside of that on the first tree I could get a few sticks into with a view on a runway (or “tunnel” lol) into or out of that cover. Bonus points for an oak or persimmon or apple tree nearby. Here in OH where I hunt now, thick means just a higher stem count, more honeysuckle and grapevine just kind of obstructing some view but you can still see a few yards in any direction, and often close to a larger destination food source or something like that. But the principle of setting up right near a runway into or out of that is the same. I really benefit from post-season scouting in this regard. The thickest stuff is usually passable, or at least observable and trudgeable, in Jan and Feb. Mark gps locations, prep trees, and if you can’t cut limbs or clear brush with tools, you can stomp down trails and snap stuff with your hands and boots, put tacks on trunks, plan entries and exits, etc. for next season, and may only require a little TLC when you get back to hunt it later.
I really can’t say enough about getting your boots on (maybe leaving your climbing gear at the truck sometimes, or just a stick or two and small platform), grabbing some water and a map, and lugging your bow all over public ground until you start to see these features reveal themselves. Then bring the saddle gear in when you think you have an idea, and sit for a few hours in a tree that you believe will put deer in your eyes.
This is a really great thread btw. Too many newer (and more experienced) hunters are embarrassed to admit they are wondering the same things. I’m still learning about this stuff every time I go into woods, and expect to be made a complete fool of by the deer at least once every few hunts. Some days it’s easier, you just nail the spot selection and have a great hunt, more times you’ll see few or no deer and be completely wrong or your timing completely off. Oh well, that’s hunting. Enjoy it all, and good luck!
This is another really helpful reply! I have definitely worked on scouting over the past couple of years. I feel like I know the areas I have hunted decently well with lots of stuff marked on my maps (trails, rubs, scrapes, possible food sources). I've spent some time crawling through lots of the nasty stuff. I've marked trees I thought would be decent spots. I've seen a few deer and spooked a number on the way in. Just trying to figure out the next piece(s) of the puzzle. These replies are definitely helping!
 
This has all been very helpful!

To take it a step further, for those of you who get into the thicker stuff to actually hunt, do you ever access via the deer trails? At first blush, it seems like a bad idea, but it's also the easiest way in and out, and theoretically, you could/would have a shot before they busted you on your ground scent. But if you couldn't get a shot or you passed because you were waiting for a different deer, you would definitely get busted, which would blow the whole deal. If you don't access this way, I'd assume you would just try your best to find the quietest access and take your time, right?
 
This has all been very helpful!

To take it a step further, for those of you who get into the thicker stuff to actually hunt, do you ever access via the deer trails? At first blush, it seems like a bad idea, but it's also the easiest way in and out, and theoretically, you could/would have a shot before they busted you on your ground scent. But if you couldn't get a shot or you passed because you were waiting for a different deer, you would definitely get busted, which would blow the whole deal. If you don't access this way, I'd assume you would just try your best to find the quietest access and take your time, right?
I will use a deer trail if it’s the only option or the only tree I need to be in is right off it. Sometimes I think you can do more harm by altering the normal patterns of movement in the woods by stomping over some long-undisturbed brush to avoid laying ground scent where every other animal is laying ground scent lol. A really good stickbow hunter I used to know would stalk parallel to deer trails maybe 2-3 yards adjacent, only putting his boots where there was a place to put them. If he had to step in the deer trail, he would for only the amount of steps he needed, keep his presence as sneaky as possible, then stay adjacent again. When he would take people hunting, he would make them walk in his bootsteps single-file like a group of does would.
I actually don’t see a lot of deer “spook” to ground scent, and if they stop to check it out and you have a clean shot…take it! If they do spook, I haven’t witnessed them bust like as if they saw something spooky. I find motion to be my own worst enemy over scent and sound.
 
The best advice I can give anyone when going to a new piece of woods to scout is pretty simple, stand there after getting out of your truck and pretend Seal Team 6 is after your ass and you’ve got 30 minutes to hide, that’s what your looking for, if the whole woods looks like that kind of terrain you have your work cut out for you narrowing down the better spots, if it’s wide open, like a local dog park, big trees, good visibility for 50-100 yards in all directions, that kind of terrain will not be productive for mature, daylight deer movement, of course during the peak of the rut all bets are off and it’s a complete circus, anybody's guess then. If the woods is big, before you even drive to a new piece of land find those thick areas on ONX or whatever you use, look for the ones with the worst access, places most won’t go, wear waders and cross water if that’s what it takes, a small boat, whatever… once I’ve established those kind of key locations I don’t dive in, I circle it, walk the entire edge looking for buck sign, rub lines, runways, mark everything on ONX as you go, don’t stare at your phone while walking through the woods trying to analyze it then, keep hammering away, covering ground is the key while your there, later that night or whenever you get back then sit down and go over all the data you’ve collected, connect the dots, see if you find a pattern, look at how wind direction may be influencing deer to enter and exit certain thick/bedding spots you circled and scouted, I can’t stress how important this is to cover as much ground as possible your first time out, marking everything as you go on ONX, what may seem insignificant while afield could prove to be later on the piece that solves the puzzle in locating your target animal. On the next trip to scout, you should have a better idea on what areas to key in on from your previous research, then I mite dive in, it all depends, time of year, just how big it is, these are all factors as to when or if I begin to crawl through some thick **** hole, every situation is different. Once you’ve found your nasty thick honey hole, only you can decide how far you can or can’t push in to set up when hunting without blowing the whole place up, nobody can answer that, each time is different, the real secret is having multiple spots like this so when you wreck one it’s on to the next one for another try. If you can find a narrow thick finger connecting a couple thick spots like this better yet, now you have a perfect all day rut spot, those are gold. Hope this helps.

Bookmarked.

I use a similar approach, sorta like tackling a big textbook for a specific question. You first skim the whole thing and look at the table of contents. This is like your first trips where you look as much as possible. Then, you dig into the "textbook" area that is most promising for you and give it a thorough "read". It isn't efficient to start reading thoroughly from page 1 on.

I think OnX is great for marking spots and such, but I also like to outline areas and this is difficult in the field with a phone. I'll print out the area of interest (from a topo but usually just print the OnX screen) and then I'll draw shapes around thick areas and then make notes on the paper map and/or a small notepad. Once home, I'll open OnX up on the computer and draw on the screen what I drew on my map and color code it. For instance, brown shapes are thick cover on my maps. Dotted brown lines are deer trails. Yellow lines are habitat transitions. Dark blue shapes are open woods. Medium blue is medium density. Purple lines are old logging roads. Etc. Everyone's color codes will be different. This allows me to really see the landscape on the 'puter. You can also turn these off and on to see an uncluttered view.
 
This has all been very helpful!

To take it a step further, for those of you who get into the thicker stuff to actually hunt, do you ever access via the deer trails? At first blush, it seems like a bad idea, but it's also the easiest way in and out, and theoretically, you could/would have a shot before they busted you on your ground scent. But if you couldn't get a shot or you passed because you were waiting for a different deer, you would definitely get busted, which would blow the whole deal. If you don't access this way, I'd assume you would just try your best to find the quietest access and take your time, right?

Anyway you use to get in will likely be exploited by deer. Even if you did the bad thing and cut a path in (ahem.....carefully moved living plants to the side in a way that did not harm them)....you just created a trail for deer to exploit. On private land, this is actually a good technique....clear a path through thick stuff and you've just made a trail for the deer.

One of my favorite spots on public, I walk in on a deer trail up a hill to a plateau. The deer I'm hunting are on the plateau though and I'm not counting on deer walking up that trail.

I don't wear rubber boots, but the last two years I've had good luck with Scent Killer Gold field spray. I really cover my boots with it and I've had more deer walk over my foot prints and not alert than ever before. I admit this could be a placebo effect or just random chance though.

One last thing about thick cover.....if it is totally nasty thick, you can use it as a screen. I have a field which is edged by stuff that no deer will cross. I setup on the woods side of it and it funnels deer by my stand. If it was on private, someone could cut a path through that as well.
 
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You are right that they all have hard transitions. So softer transitions where the more open woods like in my pictures would gradually transition into the virtually impenetrable stuff would be better?

I have definitely crawled on my hands and knees quite a bit while scouting in the post-season, so I know of some very thick areas. I just don’t know how to hunt those, I guess. Thanks for weighing in!


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Those very thick areas...hunt the trails/tunnels going in and out from a nearby tree where you have shooting lanes. try to figure out where they are going to feed and where they come back from to bed depending on different winds, time of year, etc.

You have to get as close as you can without spooking deer. i like mornings because i can get in there real early and wait for them to get back. if you're doing an afternoon hunt you might not be able to get as close. another thing you can do is stay downwind farther away for your first hunt and try to pin point where they are coming from. pay attention to the wind tho. if its blowing opposite they might not come that same way or even bed there period

Also, i usually find the less beaten in trails belong to a buck and the cattle path lookin trails belong to the doe herd. The bucks might use a different route in to the same stuff but just a little bit away.
 
Those very thick areas...hunt the trails/tunnels going in and out from a nearby tree where you have shooting lanes. try to figure out where they are going to feed and where they come back from to bed depending on different winds, time of year, etc.

You have to get as close as you can without spooking deer. i like mornings because i can get in there real early and wait for them to get back. if you're doing an afternoon hunt you might not be able to get as close. another thing you can do is stay downwind farther away for your first hunt and try to pin point where they are coming from. pay attention to the wind tho. if its blowing opposite they might not come that same way or even bed there period

Also, i usually find the less beaten in trails belong to a buck and the cattle path lookin trails belong to the doe herd. The bucks might use a different route in to the same stuff but just a little bit away.
An observation sit or two 50-75 yards off but with good visibility can pay dividends here to pinpoint that faint or unseeable trail the bucks are using.
 
Bookmarked.

I use a similar approach, sorta like tackling a big textbook for a specific question. You first skim the whole thing and look at the table of contents. This is like your first trips where you look as much as possible. Then, you dig into the "textbook" area that is most promising for you and give it a thorough "read". It isn't efficient to start reading thoroughly from page 1 on.

I think OnX is great for marking spots and such, but I also like to outline areas and this is difficult in the field with a phone. I'll print out the area of interest (from a topo but usually just print the OnX screen) and then I'll draw shapes around thick areas and then make notes on the paper map and/or a small notepad. Once home, I'll open OnX up on the computer and draw on the screen what I drew on my map and color code it. For instance, brown shapes are thick cover on my maps. Dotted brown lines are deer trails. Yellow lines are habitat transitions. Dark blue shapes are open woods. Medium blue is medium density. Purple lines are old logging roads. Etc. Everyone's color codes will be different. This allows me to really see the landscape on the 'puter. You can also turn these off and on to see an uncluttered view.

I like this idea for the mapping! I, too, have a color code on my maps(mostly for pins), but this is a different way to mark the cover types. I appreciate the tips!


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I will use a deer trail if it’s the only option or the only tree I need to be in is right off it. Sometimes I think you can do more harm by altering the normal patterns of movement in the woods by stomping over some long-undisturbed brush to avoid laying ground scent where every other animal is laying ground scent lol. A really good stickbow hunter I used to know would stalk parallel to deer trails maybe 2-3 yards adjacent, only putting his boots where there was a place to put them. If he had to step in the deer trail, he would for only the amount of steps he needed, keep his presence as sneaky as possible, then stay adjacent again. When he would take people hunting, he would make them walk in his bootsteps single-file like a group of does would.
I actually don’t see a lot of deer “spook” to ground scent, and if they stop to check it out and you have a clean shot…take it! If they do spook, I haven’t witnessed them bust like as if they saw something spooky. I find motion to be my own worst enemy over scent and sound.

This makes sense. I actually have had a couple of different younger deer seemingly more interested than scared of my ground scent. I was very surprised by this, but it definitely made me wonder if ground scent was as big of a deal as other potential factors.


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I’ve mentioned this hunt before, but I think it’s perfect for this thread and the OP. About 5 or 6 years ago, I dropped in on some public one day not too far from my house, monster woods, the Adirondacks, a small parking lot with a well worn trail goes to a somewhat popular trout fishing stream, typical path that is littered with beer cans and empty worm containers, at the end of this trail I found some good rubs and a couple scrapes, it almost looked fake it was so easy to find, but hey you never know. This sign was right on the edge of one of the thickest, nastiest, spruce **** holes you can imagine, picture a Christmas tree farm but with the trees so close together only rabbits would be happy. So I started taking the edge of that spruce swamp following this stream as I went, a few hundred yards in I noticed a runway crossing that stream in a shallow part of the water, so I followed that runway into the edge of that spruce thicket, and then I found this rub.
View attachment 77759
I knew I had something decent to hunt then, and my other sign which looked fake could be real, so I started really hunting, over the next few weeks I circled that spruce swamp multiple times, on snow and bare ground, I crossed that stream with waders, I did everything looking for that buck, he was nowhere to be found, I could not find that deer, not one time did I ever dive into the heart of that spruce swamp, I would guess all total maybe that thing is 20-40 acres, I’m not really sure maybe it’s more like a hundred, it’s an absolute jungle, I’m claustrophobic and being in there gets to me it’s so bad. So that was it… my buck went missing or so I thought, and season was over. Next year rolled around and my season started later than normal due to some health issues with a family member, so it must have been around Halloween when I first hunted that year, my first day, I wanted something close to home so I decided to drop back in on that local spot. Once again he was back, same fake looking scrapes and rubs by that well used fishing trail…. It was lightly raining out, I stood there thinking about what I should do next, I said screw this I’m going through every inch of that nasty thick swamp even if it takes all day, having had all winter to think about it, the only place I hadn’t thoroughly checked was that jungle, I know this mite seem obvious to most reading right now, but you have to understand this thing (swamp) for me isn’t big, and is located next to a small parking lot and somewhat active foot path, with thousands of other acres at this animals disposal I would have never imagined he was right there, a mature buck. So off I go, inch by inch, creeping through that mess, one step at a time, zig zagging, stopping, one step at a time, it was a one full can of Copenhagen used kind of hunt, monotonous, I told myself the day is already shot, I have nothing to lose, if it doesn’t work I will never do this again, ever. About 75% through that mess, somewhere in the middle I jumped a big deer, I was close, probably 30 yards, I seen it flag and that was it, a couple jumps and it was gone, like I said it’s unreal thick, I had no idea what it was. So right around lunch time I broke out of the backside into more normal woods, the fresh air was nice, I sat down and ate my lunch, while eating the rain stopped and the once quiet leaves were now drying out and going to be loud, I decided to follow the stream closer on the way back through that mess towards my truck, maybe the loud water would help cover any noise I mite make, so off I go, straight back through the same nasty hole, but on a little lower route. I would guess I was half way through it again when I caught some movement off my shoulder, all I could see was rack and it was coming right at me but off to my left, I swung my rifle and he blew and took one bound, I let out a big half assed mouth grunt and he stopped dead in his tracks, his head was on a swivel looking for me, I dumped him DRT, 20-30 yards away from me with my rifle, I knew immediately it was my buck, he had an inside spread of 21”, a nice 8 around 120”. After taking it all in for a few minutes I looked around some, not 80 yards away in the more friendly woods was that big maple tree from last season that started this whole journey, bucks in my area don’t usually rub trees that big, I knew he was probably wide. He was aged at 5.5.
View attachment 77778
I have no idea why that picture is rotated, but anyways that buck was in there and had I not covered every inch of that mess I’m positive he mite have lived, in years since I’ve gone back to that spot and it’s always been dead, the lesson of this hunt is never overlook anything, he called that spot home and although many hunters, fisherman, and everything else routinely walked that path, drove to that parking lot, he held tight and didn’t move much.

Great story; thanks for sharing! Definitely some good lessons in there. I’ll recommit to better exploring what I’m learning to be the right cover.


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