Ropeman Safety

[elk yinzer]

Forgive my newbie question but what if you connect the prussik under the Ropeman 1 with a carabiner like this?

Would this work well as a backup to the Ropeman?

The issue with the Ropeman is that it can cut the rope. It's design is basically the same mechanical action as scissors, so....Anyway I think it was cited in testing that became a concern somewhere around 4 or 5 kN but not positive about that number.

With that being the concern, the backup friction hitch should obviously be above the ascender.

Either way, it is low enough to be of concern if there is some fall factor in your system, which in my case not really being a real saddle hunter, being more of stander and occassional leaner, than having weight on the tether all the time, I need to make sure my ropeman is backed up. If you always have weight on the tether that is not a concern really.


This is how I will be backing mine up, if I decide to use the ropeman on the tether at all. I may decide just to cut the ropeman out of the tether, not sure. I need to play with it a few hunts and decide:

 

[TheTracker]

Forgive my newbie question but what if you connect the prussik under the Ropeman 1 with a carabiner like this?

Would this work well as a backup to the Ropeman?

You really dont need both for a tether but as stated in testing the ropeman can tear through the sheath in a 4kn fall, Get a good eye to eye hitch cord like a 28" armor prus and tie in a schwabish hitch and your set for a long time.

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[Soonlobo]

Got it.

Thanks gentlemen!

 

[IkemanTX]

I’m all for safety, but I’m not concerned with trying to meet rock climbing standards in our application.
I can’t get the multiple feet falls needed to generate high shock loads with my system. If I have fallen that far, my system has failed totally already and a backup prussic wouldn’t help me.

If I was using SRT or DRT and had possible recovery from a long fall, I’d totally overkill it.
But, I only have like 20 inches of tether length to my ropeman, and only ever have a couple inches of slack in that tether.



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[Soonlobo]

I’m all for safety, but I’m not concerned with trying to meet rock climbing standards in our application.
I can’t get the multiple feet falls needed to generate high shock loads with my system. If I have fallen that far, my system has failed totally already and a backup prussic wouldn’t help me.

If I was using SRT or DRT and had possible recovery from a long fall, I’d totally overkill it.
But, I only have like 20 inches of tether length to my ropeman, and only ever have a couple inches of slack in that tether.



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I see your point.

Many years ago I had a job that required me to work at heights in excess of 25 feet. I never had any fear at that height because I was tethered in and felt confident and safe.

That feeling of safety and confidence has to be there in order to enjoy a tree saddle at height.

So we should all take the steps we feel necessary to get that safety margin. Some may put more into that aspect than others. More power to them. What matters is getting out in those trees enjoying the experience.

 

[TheTracker]

I’m all for safety, but I’m not concerned with trying to meet rock climbing standards in our application.
I can’t get the multiple feet falls needed to generate high shock loads with my system. If I have fallen that far, my system has failed totally already and a backup prussic wouldn’t help me.

If I was using SRT or DRT and had possible recovery from a long fall, I’d totally overkill it.
But, I only have like 20 inches of tether length to my ropeman, and only ever have a couple inches of slack in that tether.



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Main issue where a fall could be bad with a ropeman is using it on a linemens belt, I had a pretty bad fall a while back I fell a total of 9 feet before my linemens belt caught onto the tree. I've climbed a thousand different trees for both hunting and rec climbing and the circumstances came into play just right, Didn't have a lot of slack in my belt and im lucky I was using a eye to eye hitch cord because you could see where the linemens belt was glazed as the cord slid down the belt like they were intended to do! I was lucky, I also had a situation with a ropemen 1 where it slid down the entire tether to my stopped knot which is around 8 feet from where I had it set, That wouldn't have happened with a ropeman 2 due to the teeth design!

 

[TheTracker]

I see your point.

Many years ago I had a job that required me to work at heights in excess of 25 feet. I never had any fear at that height because I was tethered in and felt confident and safe.

That feeling of safety and confidence has to be there in order to enjoy a tree saddle at height.

So we should all take the steps we feel necessary to get that safety margin. Some may put more into that aspect than others. More power to them. What matters is getting out in those trees enjoying the experience.

Agreed you have to trust your gear or you're going to be freaking out all the time! I took a new guy out climbing a few weeks ago and I worked with him a few days prior to us climbing with harness setup and how to tie appropriate knots for srt climbing. We got about 30 feet up and the dude was literally so scared that he wouldn't move "Even though he told me he wasn't afraid of heights beforehand" I used a basal anchor setup with a ISC D4 so I could lower him from the ground, Which I do a lot for new guys because you just never know!

 

[IkemanTX]

Main issue where a fall could be bad with a ropeman is using it on a linemens belt, I had a pretty bad fall a while back I fell a total of 9 feet before my linemens belt caught onto the tree. I've climbed a thousand different trees for both hunting and rec climbing and the circumstances came into play just right, Didn't have a lot of slack in my belt and im lucky I was using a eye to eye hitch cord because you could see where the linemens belt was glazed as the cord slid down the belt like they were intended to do! I was lucky, I also had a situation with a ropemen 1 where it slid down the entire tether to my stopped knot which is around 8 feet from where I had it set, That wouldn't have happened with a ropeman 2 due to the teeth design!

I have had 2 linesman belt falls. 1 with a prussic and 1 with a ropeman1. The ropeman1 linesman fall was intentional to test my comfort level with the device, the prussic fall was first and unexpected due to a stick swinging on me. I think the load factors in a linesman belt configuration fall are DRASTICALLY lower than an unrestricted fall. The linesman belt swings and binds you to the tree, and the final stop is when it gains enough friction on the tree to stop you. Neither event (unplanned or planned) had a hard arrest. They both gradually slowed me over 4 feet or so. I got no damage to my setup, verified by a thorough inspection, and the only damage to me was scraped skin on my hands from the bark of the tree (road rash). I wore long sleeves and heavy leather gloves on the intentional fall, for this reason, and had no road rash
I didn’t even have enough impact in my sit drag to bruise my hips/legs.

I 100% agree that if you feel more comfortable with a backup, you really need to back it up. I feel 100% comfortable in my setup, and don’t personally back the ropeman up. I do tie a stopper knot several inches under the ropeman (however long I think the tether adjustment may be needed to shoot 360) on my tether at hunting height, and then daisy chain below that. I guess that knot could be considered a form of backup, but that’s how I run it.


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[Apex7]

Forgive my newbie question but what if you connect the prussik under the Ropeman 1 with a carabiner like this?

Would this work well as a backup to the Ropeman?

I would put it above the ropeman so if the ropeman failed the prusik would grab if the prusik is below it could slide down the rope. Not good

 

[griff]

You really dont need both for a tether but as stated in testing the ropeman can tear through the sheath in a 4kn fall, Get a good eye to eye hitch cord like a 28" armor prus and tie in a schwabish hitch and your set for a long time.

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Agreed. I decided to get the armor prus cord after reading this thread and tied a distel hitch on my tether. After using it, I can't find a reason to use a ropeman on my tether. The hitch releases with ease even after it has been loaded. I am seriously reconsidering the use of a ropeman on my lineman's belt.

 

[griff]

Does anyone tether their saddle to the tree for the climb up like you would a harness?

 

[wvfarrier]

Does anyone have a picture of the set up with a prussik below the ropeman?

 

[donnieballgame]

Does anyone tether their saddle to the tree for the climb up like you would a harness?

I do that when climbing with my XOP hand climber, I'm in the tether all the way up, while hunting and back down.

I don't think there are a whole lot of other situations that use the tether all the way up. I think most use a linemans belt for climbing.

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[Orion5]

Does anyone have a picture of the set up with a prussik below the ropeman?

I think there are some earlier comments on this thread regarding using a Prusik for backup of the Ropeman, but I think the general consensus was that the Prusik should be above the Ropeman as one of the worries was that the Ropeman could possibly severe the rope during a fall ( not likely but possible). In which case the Prusik below the Ropeman wouldn’t do any good.


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[wvfarrier]

makes sense

 

[wvfarrier]

After toying the the distel hitch.....i think its gonna be my go to fh

 

[Zddog]

You are correct that a ropeman is not rated high enough for a long fall. In rock climbing falls can be much farther so greater strength and dynamic rope is needed.

If we are tethered our fall will be inches or we may slide a bit down a tree On a linemans belt the same thing would occur. Both would not stress our equipment the same as a rock climber.

I feel way safer in an aerohunter than a climber stand or lock on.
If you are worried put a prussic on the tail of your rope and clip it to your harness and leave a stopper below the prussic on the tether.

It takes a while to get used to a saddle. I don't like heights and cannot afford to fall but I feel safe in a saddle
Some of what is suggested on this site is not always up to standard. Many use a ropeman 1 on 9 mm rope. Not recommended A sit drag without a backup is not up to standards.


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I second the post here. I've been hunting out of a saddle for years but I'm a big proponent multiple safety precautions. I typically clip my carabiner into my ropeman 1 and have a prussic knot right about my ropeman 1 just in case it fails the prussic will catch before I hit my stopper knot. The other thing i've done is have a second carabiner on bridge and put the prussic knot real far down on the tether just above my stopper knot and clip into that. only thing about the second option is you have more possibility of noise happening.

And just like ontariofarmer said you aren't really falling when you are in a saddle compared to if you are in a treestand and fall out. you are hanging and it's constant pressure.

Good luck and welcome to the saddle hunting community.

 

[Jgetch]

I think there are some earlier comments on this thread regarding using a Prusik for backup of the Ropeman, but I think the general consensus was that the Prusik should be above the Ropeman as one of the worries was that the Ropeman could possibly severe the rope during a fall ( not likely but possible). In which case the Prusik below the Ropeman wouldn’t do any good.


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The prusik shouldn’t be set up below the ropeman, or any other device, because if the device fails it will act as a rope slider and prevent the prusik from binding on the rope. Also always remember to tie double fishermen knots at the ends of any open line so that if you do make a mistake like this in set up you at least have a shot at being caught.

 

[Patriot38]

Lots of great info on this. I read probably 90% of this entire thread and didn't find anything one weather conditions with the ropeman.

Does rain, snow or ice affect the mechanics behind the ropeman?

Thanks in advance

 

[Bigterp]

Lots of great info on this. I read probably 90% of this entire thread and didn't find anything one weather conditions with the ropeman.

Does rain, snow or ice affect the mechanics behind the ropeman?

Thanks in advance

I wouldn’t really be concerned with either. If it was icing up at such a rate that your ropeman would be comprised, you should no longer be in a tree. That said the ropeman under tension is going to bite the rope whether it’s wet or icy, so you would be ok.