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- Sep 1, 2020
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Going to get this nonsense off this important thread
I have extra slings and was actually thinking about implementing this when I SRT climb and rappel since I have them already with me. Might give it a try tonight to see how it feels, and it's a simple thing to implement to prevent a inversion accident.It looks like Dane was climbing in a Drey. Without going down too many tangents, if somebody out there is climbing in a Drey or RCH and is concerned that they may be a bit... topheavy, let's say, they might consider adding a chest harness to their setup to raise their point of attachment relative to their center of gravity. The link is the first thing I saw and contains this quote:
" The chest harness is supposed to keep the climber upright in the event of a fall. Also possibly handy if you're lowering an injured climber for example. Certain devices (such as some self belay devices), require you to wear a chest harness. Other situations might lend themselves to using one, like when wearing a large pack."
I keep seeing videos of people climbing with day packs and sticks and whatever else strapped to their back. If this describes you, maybe you would be more comfortable adding a simple chest harness to your system.
Out of respect for family, i wont talk about details now.How in the heck did you survive hanging upside down for 4 1/2 hours?
Interesting. From that update this almost becomes a non saddle related death.
How so? It now sounds like suspension trauma like normal fall arrest harnesses caused blood build up to his legs, he was unable to get himself relief, called for help, passed out around the time the other hunter arrived. Passing out allowed him to go inverted, which probably rushed all that blood back into his system. 260 lbs of weight on his lungs and a ton of non oxygenated blood rushing to the heart caused an accelerated suffocation. I just want to know what happened that had him just sitting there suspended for so long in the RCH?Interesting. From that update this almost becomes a non saddle related death.
She said the coroner found no evidence of Blunt trauma (ie concussive head blow). It now sounds like suspension trauma caused him to pass out and invert, inverting caused suffocationhard to tell
he could have hit his head from climbing and that caused his initial distress
many possibilities
Sorry slept on this for a bit. I am a physician and a pathologist, but not a fellowship trained forensic pathologist. I've assisted in a number of death investigations for positional asphyxia while in training at the office of the medical examiner.Foremost, I can't imagine the loss this family is currently having to navigate. The thought of going out to engage in one of my hobbies and not coming back is just unimaginable. My thoughts, prayers, and support are definitely being extended to this family!
I understand an inherent risk is present in any activity that is executed in an elevated position, but I'm a firm believer in a healthy risk/reward balance. Not being a professionally trained climber in an arborist or rope-access capacity, I'd personally NEVER attempt that JRB method. I'm 42 years old with 4 kids and a wife that I/they are eager for me to come home to them. I will just keep packing my climbing sticks into the woods as my ascending/descending method!
@GravityTension - Based on some of your statements and experience with autopsies, I am presuming you are/were a licensed medical professional? Please confirm or deny as it will validate your response to my next question - as I am uninterested in conjecture or hyperbole on this matter. What kind of time exposure could one expect to remain inverted prior to postural asphyxiation? Under normal circumstances, would you expect someone to experience syncope prior to asphyxiation? I understand there are a myriad of health variables that may contribute to some of these estimations, but would appreciate your general thoughts.
We need to keep these systems simple and be honest about who does and doesn't have the physical fitness to be climbing.
Climbing in almost every form is inherently dangerous.
It's probably more related to cardiovascular health than anything else. The cardiovascular system evolved to work with gravity in certain ways. When inverted blood can return to the heart through the veins from with legs and abdomen a lot easier, since gravity if pulling it back to the heart. This raises the pressure inside the heart and lungs, which makes the heart work harder to push the blood out. People with better cardiovascular health should be able to tolerate inversion better, but death can occur in anyone if sustained. There are cases of fit young cavers getting stuck while inverted.anyone know if you should be contracting your muscles/core if stuck upside down? is it like a fighter pilot fighting g-force or would contracting actually act like a tourniquet and make it worse?
Possible but these injuries would be evident on autopsy. In removing the brain you can see the soft tissues of the head from the inside. Trauma is usually pretty obvious.hard to tell
he could have hit his head from climbing and that caused his initial distress
many possibilities