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Screw it, I'm going back to the whisker biscuit

thedutchtouch said:
I would love to blame the rest or the bow draw cycle, so maybe that's part of it. In reality it's probably something I'm doing, I thought it was nock height but I've changed that and it doesn't seem to have results, and messed with the rest timing, from too loose/not fully lining up the lines, to being spot on, to going slightly past, and it doesn't seem to make a difference either.

I need to get/make a draw board and go through the draw cycle slower to figure it out, but to me the get hunting with it ASAP easy button is to throw a WB on the bow and get some practice in with that instead of continuing to mess with it. I will return to the drop away in the future, just... not now. To be honest part of this is just me being fed up/frustrated with "wasting my time" tinkering with it instead of shooting it and have lost confidence in my ability to set up the rest in the short term.

It actually shoots decently well/groups fine as-is, I'm just worried that the black marks on the fletchings could translate to an errant shot when I'm in the woods and the WB is a "known" to me because I had one on my old bow the last 3 years. Hopefully it shows up early enough today that I can test it out, if not I've got some time tomorrow afternoon.
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Sounds like a QAD.

I found they shoot best if the rest bottoms out (goes as far as it can....with the lines crossing past each other) just a hair before full draw (like less than 1"...it can be less but you just want the thing all the way up when at full draw). The cord tie in location also matters, with it just somewhat below the grip when at brace but not too far.

Some of the QADs do not have the "antibounce" feature and so the rest can rebound up.

I forgot until now how you can do this all without a draw board, just not as easily or maybe well.

Take an arrow and cover it with masking tape (one long piece lengthwise). Mark that tape with a sharpie every 1/4 inch or so in a way that you can read it somewhat from afar (different size ticks, different colors, maybe numbers...you decide). Next, draw the bow with that arrow nocked while video taping yourself where you can see everything you need to see.

Use an extra arrow and leave tape on for next time.
 
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I've shot WBs out to 100+ yds. and they'll do it if your form is "perfect". I'm not knocking them as a hunting rest, but a properly set up drop away is more forgiving to form issues. IDK about anyone else, I shoot from more screwed up positions with messed up form and follow through in a hunting position, than I ever will during practice... We also set up 90% QAD rests on sales or upgrades, but I personally prefer limb driven. I like Hamskea, but I choose to shoot the Vapor Trail Pro-VX for various reasons. BUT...USE WHAT YOU KNOW AND HAVE CONFIDENCE IN!!! If the QAD is an integrate or HD/HDX, it's very simple to set up without a draw board!
 
bowhunthard88 said:
I've shot WBs out to 100+ yds. and they'll do it if your form is "perfect". I'm not knocking them as a hunting rest, but a properly set up drop away is more forgiving to form issues. IDK about anyone else, I shoot from more screwed up positions with messed up form and follow through in a hunting position, than I ever will during practice... We also set up 90% QAD rests on sales or upgrades, but I personally prefer limb driven. I like Hamskea, but I choose to shoot the Vapor Trail Pro-VX for various reasons. BUT...USE WHAT YOU KNOW AND HAVE CONFIDENCE IN!!! If the QAD is an integrate or HD/HDX, it's very simple to set up without a draw board!
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The QAD technique of "loosen the clamp and allow the cord to pull through" always made my cord way too tight and it rose to all the way up/lines crossed several inches before full draw. This made them drop late, it seemed.
 
If you were closer, I'd make the drive and set it up for you in about 20 minutes or less. Have you shoot it and within a few shots we'd have it sorted out and you'd be good to go. :cool: I recommend taking it to an archery pro shop and have them show you how they do it. Video it if you have to and/or find a video on YouTube. Personally, I will never go back to a Whisker Biscuit and give up the perfect flight from my QAD. ;)
 
If it’s the QAD Hunter and not the HDX throw that in the trash. The rest will bounce back and cause fletching contact. Went to a Smackdown Pro and haven’t had any issues since. Limb driven rests are pretty fool proof.
 
thedutchtouch said:
I would love to blame the rest or the bow draw cycle, so maybe that's part of it. In reality it's probably something I'm doing, I thought it was nock height but I've changed that and it doesn't seem to have results, and messed with the rest timing, from too loose/not fully lining up the lines, to being spot on, to going slightly past, and it doesn't seem to make a difference either.

I need to get/make a draw board and go through the draw cycle slower to figure it out, but to me the get hunting with it ASAP easy button is to throw a WB on the bow and get some practice in with that instead of continuing to mess with it. I will return to the drop away in the future, just... not now. To be honest part of this is just me being fed up/frustrated with "wasting my time" tinkering with it instead of shooting it and have lost confidence in my ability to set up the rest in the short term.

It actually shoots decently well/groups fine as-is, I'm just worried that the black marks on the fletchings could translate to an errant shot when I'm in the woods and the WB is a "known" to me because I had one on my old bow the last 3 years. Hopefully it shows up early enough today that I can test it out, if not I've got some time tomorrow afternoon.
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I hear that for sure man. I like the tinkering. I should do less of the tinkering.
 
A QAD Hunter isn't worth a WB, but I don't hate the HDX rests. I would take (without a draw board) and set the rest up level and center (at "full load" height with felt installed), tie a solid serving stopper knot about at the bottom of the grip (on the "down" cable, interwoven through the cable if you have press access), create a melted head on the tag end of the drop cord and tie that end in a Lark's Head knot below the serving stopper (tighten with pliers so that the melted end is tight to the knot and the knot itself is tight), take a 7/64" allen key and loosen the bolt in the thumbwheel until the cord slides freely with minimal resistance, pull all the slack out of the cord on the opposite side of the thumbwheel until your timing section has no slack, draw your bow (the cord will pull through), take about 1/4" of slack back out through the opposite side of the thumbwheel and tighten the bolt back down. Double check rest timing marks visually. All done unless you have visible tuning issues!
 
It's a hdx. Seems like most points are coming back to figuring out timing it and that likely I don't have that process down. I've been following the "draw the bow back by hand and let the string slip" instructions, but assume with a draw board I can get it dialed exactly. If for some reason the WB gives me issues this week, I'll try the QAD again, but if not a draw board is a February project and then I'll do better at getting this rest timed correctly and decide next off season what I'm sticking with.
 
Dude I have contemplated going FROM a biscuit for 12 years and you know what? It’s all just peer pressure. Just like heavy vs light arrows, how you sharpen broadheads, whether a trad bow puts more hair on your chest (it does, even though sadly I don’t hunt with one), and how 007 your gadgets can be right down to the arrow rest. “Screw it” is right, my man. I just put a new biscuit on my bow two weeks ago in fact. And proudly. Dude at the archery shop was cool about it too, suggested I might try a DA rest since I was in the shop and he had time to tune, I said “I hang from a saddle or I still-hunt, I like my full containment silent WB” and you know what? That just got him all hyped on another saddle nerd being in his shop, having someone to discuss what he’s “running” this year, and I ended up with a brand new fully-tuned biscuit (and re-tuned bow for that matter) for the low cost of an hour of this guy’s time. Shooting bullets through paper and hitting with a thwack I haven’t experienced from my own bow before. dude shoot what you know puts the arrows where you want them and doesn’t make you do freaky things (in a tree) cuz you’re stressed about a piece of equipment that should never be in question. WB won’t shave hardly anything off your fps or KE. It’ll never make a sound. It’ll never release your arrow from your bow. And I’ve never had one freeze unless I got it actually WET from actual water, not snow or ice. I’m sure it could happen. But I can’t think of a time and when it snows I’m always looking to be in the woods.
 
bowhunthard88 said:
I have, a Blazer X2 left-helical, with no flight issues. The biscuit got fluffed, but no arrow flight negative impacts. I think you could get away with TAC vanes too, as the material would lend itself well to a biscuit.
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I use Blazers with no issues but I’ve heard good things about Bully vanes through the WB due to extra stiffness but similar profile to Blazers.
 
thedutchtouch said:
I took it as "don't be afraid of slapping a WB on a "fancy new bow"" which addresses my "overcoming ego" sentiment, so relatively on point. Regardless, I've ordered a new Wab and will put it on tomorrow and take the bow to the range to start fine tuning me shooting it instead of fiddling with components
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Correct, now that we can discuss it like normal folks…..

I used to chase perfection with a bow and, yes, it came from target archery. I went over a decade shooting at a bare minimum one NFAA 300 round per day. Every day. If you know anything about NFAA 300 you know that you HAVE to shoot a 300 every single time or that round is a failure. I could shoot a 300 at night in the headlights of my truck without thinking about it and did so many times, but it comes at a price. That price is you only accept perfection. Did I ever shoot a 60x? Nope, but if I shot below a 55x I was upset and below a 50x…..well, that was a dark place, lol.

During that time (‘92-‘04) I flat slaughtered deer because the shot was a non factor I didn’t even think about it because I knew I was going to make it. My only thought was when I was going to take the shot.

Fast forward to life getting the way and I didn’t have time for that level of dedication anymore. I simply became a “Bowhunter”. But the perfection bug stayed. I could still shoot a 300 without blinking, but I would shoot 15-25 X’s when I would pull the targets out. I started rushing shots because I had doubt.

A whisker biscuit??? Are kidding me? No way that will be acceptable, lol. I had a friend that was an engineer with CAP (left when Bear bought them out because he didn’t want to move to Florida) and he was always sending me WB’s trying to get me to use them. I would put it on, shoot it a few times and take it right back off, lol. Mental. The groups didn’t change, the biscuit didn’t change them, I had changed.

I finally overcame that crap, strapped a biscuit on and accepted the fact that I was a basket case, my groups MIGHT have grown by a few tenths of an inch, but my rest was bombproof and my arrow was staying in place no matter what.

All that drivel is to say, brother, free your mind of all those demons, strap a biscuit on any bow you dang want to, tune it and go to killing without any remorse.
 
I bought my bow used and it had a drop away rest on it. I shot it for a while like that. I switched it to the biscuit and didn't notice any difference accuracy wise. I like the full containment...1 less thing to think about when in awkward positions or stalking in with an arrow nocked but the main draw to me is it's simple with no moving parts. My bow takes a beating going thru thick stuff. I concur with @Zero One Actual.. wb and ezv pretty worry free combination
 
samu said:
How hard can setting up one dropaway be? Bolt on, attach the cord on the limb, throw away the original adjuster and tie a blakes hitch on the cord. Go shoot. Takes almost 15 minutes in total.
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I think he has a QAD which is cable driven and a bit more fussy with timing than a limb driven rest!
 
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thedutchtouch said:
I've been trying off and on all summer to get my new bow set up with a drop away rest, and I keep getting fletching contact on the rest. I am 100% sure I am doing something wrong, still figuring this all out on my own, and sure that this is a fixable problem, but season has begun and in the interest of hunting with this bow this year... I'm taking the whisker biscuit off my old bear cruzer bow and bolting it on the elite omnia tonight. The heck with it, I want to hunt deer under 35 yards, and that will get it done. No point having this fancy bow and not using it.

Also seeking advice for how to set up the drop away (qad) correctly next summer lol.
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Just take it to bow shop, I do all my own work except doing that. Shop doesn’t charge me to set up but if yours did it wouldn’t be hardly anything and it’s a quick fix for them. Mines a QADHTX also and it’s been in the bow since 2015 and never needed adjusted. Cable driven for now still.
 
dalton916 said:
Correct, now that we can discuss it like normal folks…..

I used to chase perfection with a bow and, yes, it came from target archery. I went over a decade shooting at a bare minimum one NFAA 300 round per day. Every day. If you know anything about NFAA 300 you know that you HAVE to shoot a 300 every single time or that round is a failure. I could shoot a 300 at night in the headlights of my truck without thinking about it and did so many times, but it comes at a price. That price is you only accept perfection. Did I ever shoot a 60x? Nope, but if I shot below a 55x I was upset and below a 50x…..well, that was a dark place, lol.

During that time (‘92-‘04) I flat slaughtered deer because the shot was a non factor I didn’t even think about it because I knew I was going to make it. My only thought was when I was going to take the shot.

Fast forward to life getting the way and I didn’t have time for that level of dedication anymore. I simply became a “Bowhunter”. But the perfection bug stayed. I could still shoot a 300 without blinking, but I would shoot 15-25 X’s when I would pull the targets out. I started rushing shots because I had doubt.

A whisker biscuit??? Are kidding me? No way that will be acceptable, lol. I had a friend that was an engineer with CAP (left when Bear bought them out because he didn’t want to move to Florida) and he was always sending me WB’s trying to get me to use them. I would put it on, shoot it a few times and take it right back off, lol. Mental. The groups didn’t change, the biscuit didn’t change them, I had changed.

I finally overcame that crap, strapped a biscuit on and accepted the fact that I was a basket case, my groups MIGHT have grown by a few tenths of an inch, but my rest was bombproof and my arrow was staying in place no matter what.

All that drivel is to say, brother, free your mind of all those demons, strap a biscuit on any bow you dang want to, tune it and go to killing without any remorse.
Click to expand...

And all God’s children said…

Amen.
 
bowhunthard88 said:
I've shot WBs out to 100+ yds. and they'll do it if your form is "perfect". I'm not knocking them as a hunting rest, but a properly set up drop away is more forgiving to form issues. IDK about anyone else, I shoot from more screwed up positions with messed up form and follow through in a hunting position, than I ever will during practice...
Click to expand...

....in the cold, wearing a mask and heavy outerwear, with adrenaline pumping and an unpredictable target at unknown exact range.

vs. flat ground, known distances, with a tidy little dot to aim at, on the range.
 
I like the WB and may also go back on my Darton I bought from @woodsdog2.
In reference to your pic above I always set up my odd fletch on top so none travel through the black whiskers on that same WB. I think the black ones are a bit stiffer maybe. I'm not saying it's right or wrong just how I had always done it.
 
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