Bareshaft/ arrow tuning

[jtw0057]

I’m back, got a new bow today and can’t get rid of a nock high tear. Bow tech said timing was good and he wouldn’t mess with it. Left right is good but with the rest bottomed out on the vertical adjustment (as high as it can get) I’m getting a pretty sizeable nock high tear.

Could the center shot be an issue? Or a too weak spine? It appeared to be setup right through the Berger holes when I got home with it and I moved the rest and it got marginally better on the tear but still bad.

Top 2 tears.

28.5” draw 57lbs. 26.5” 340 spine arrows with 175 total up front. These are just what I have on hand and was planning on using them for fun this spring shooting 3d. I tried some grizzly sticks I have in 320 at 28.5” with 170 up front and got the same tear.

Assuming timing isn’t an issue any thoughts on this?


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[jtw0057]

Got the tear to come down some moving nocking point down. Rest as high as it can be. Arrow is angled up when on rest (point above nock end). I don’t know much about bows but I don’t see how this happens if timing isn’t off.


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[BTaylor]

Got the tear to come down some moving nocking point down. Rest as high as it can be. Arrow is angled up when on rest (point above nock end). I don’t know much about bows but I don’t see how this happens if timing isn’t off.


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Have you tried adjusting the rest so the arrow is centered in the berger hole and moving nock point to something around say 3/8" above level? Not sure how it couldnt porpoise if you are nocking below level.

 

[Allegheny Tom]

There's a great tuning class over on The Push Archery (P.A.C.K.) and they are achieving bullet holes at 6 FEET with stick bows. You compound guys, with all of your available adjustments, should be able to do that.

 

[Horn]

There's a great tuning class over on The Push Archery (P.A.C.K.) and they are achieving bullet holes at 6 FEET with stick bows. You compound guys, with all of your available adjustments, should be able to do that.

Episode 249 precision bow tuning for the the diehard hunter?

 

[jtw0057]

Have you tried adjusting the rest so the arrow is centered in the berger hole and moving nock point to something around say 3/8" above level? Not sure how it couldnt porpoise if you are nocking below level.

I’ll try that later when I get a chance. I may try taking it to a different shop and see what they have to say if I can’t get it right. I shot a little bit today and it did fine at 30 yards with fletching on but bareshaft was funky.

 

[Allegheny Tom]

Episode 249 precision bow tuning for the the diehard hunter?

That podcast is an introduction to the class, which is pretty much for trad gear. But my point to the OP's question was there is great utility to paper tune at various distances (even as little as 6 feet). And these guys are doing it shooting basic trad bows. 6 foot bullet holes shouldn't be too difficult for tech bows.

 

[jtw0057]

Have you tried adjusting the rest so the arrow is centered in the berger hole and moving nock point to something around say 3/8" above level? Not sure how it couldnt porpoise if you are nocking below level.

That worked, took a bit of shooting and a bunch of adjusting but I got it dialed in


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[Slipnslide]

I went down this "tuning hole" a few months back when I decided to build my own shop, strip down my bow to bare, replace with custom strings and level everything Myslef. What I found is if you read and watch everything on the internet regarding tuning and try to meet those standards you'll probably end up going back to a shop or want to quit shooting.
I recommend a "close" paper tune and some bare shaft vs. fletched groups at 20-30 yds. If it's remotely close call it a day and walk back tune and broadhead tune. If my broadheads and field points hit the same(or really close) out to 50, I'm done.
98% of us "normies/bowhunters" don't have great/repeatable form enough to get consistent tares with paper. Let your broadheads be the judge

 

[Rg176bnc]

I went down this "tuning hole" a few months back when I decided to build my own shop, strip down my bow to bare, replace with custom strings and level everything Myslef. What I found is if you read and watch everything on the internet regarding tuning and try to meet those standards you'll probably end up going back to a shop or want to quit shooting.
I recommend a "close" paper tune and some bare shaft vs. fletched groups at 20-30 yds. If it's remotely close call it a day and walk back tune and broadhead tune. If my broadheads and field points hit the same(or really close) out to 50, I'm done.
98% of us "normies/bowhunters" don't have great/repeatable form enough to get consistent tares with paper. Let your broadheads be the judge

This right here^^^^ If your shooting broadheads skip the bare shaft and get to the business at hand.

I've seen tons of people say "I get all my fixed to hit in the same spot" Then you look at what they are shooting and they are all 1" cut heads. Well no ****! A lot of fixed 1" cuts fly better than mechs. You put some distance on those groups of different sized fixed heads and you'll find out real quick they aren't all the same.

 

[drpike22]

I don't practice as much as I should. But when I shoot a bow that I know was shooting bare shaft and fletched shaft to the same point and now I am hitting erratic, it is probably my shooting form. I find that changes in my grip and punching the release exacerbate the problem. Once I pick up my practice time everything gets back to being right. The other thing I find is that you have to know when its time to stop. If you start getting sloppy with your shots due to fatigue, it is hard to figure out whether it is the bow or you. I have had good results with G5 Striker X 125gr. 4 blade broadheads. I think when you shoot a heavier point/broadhead, it is easier to get a good flight. The other consideration is that shooting when you are hunting is a lot different than practicing. When I practice, I will shoot one or two arrows and retrieve them before I shoot again. Most times I shoot one arrow and retrieve it. It doesn't matter how good your second or third or fourth shots are unless you are shooting a competition. Most times you get one shot at a deer.

 

[Halfstep]

Bow tuning is a spectrum. The better one can shoot, the better one can tune. You can't tune better than you can shoot. So, what is tuned for one person may not be so with someone else. With a lot of today's bows that have high let-off, short axle to axle and short brace height, good shooting fit and form become more critical. Cheaper priced carbon arrows can be problematic when tuning due to inconsistent spine around the diameter of the shaft and from shaft to shaft.

When tuning, one must be results driven. Let the target group size and consistency determine if the bow is tuned and also if the arrows are tuned to group well together. One will usually need to nock tune the arrows to tighten up the groups.

All broadheads are not created equal. So, trying several different broadheads before one starts moving the rest thinking it's the bow. Some broadheads just don't fly well and one shouldn't "detune" their bow in an attempt to make a broadhead fly well.

Shoot a bow that fits you according to your physical draw length. Make sure the bow's poundage is easily manageable. Experiment with your grip placement and grip placement and find the one your bow likes. Shoot high quality arrows that are spined properly to you arrow length and poundage. Make sure the cam is in time and the cam lean is corrected by adjusting or shimming the cams to get true center shot.

 

[woodsdog2]

All good answers, I was going to suggest drop away rest timing. I was having difficulty getting with nock high tears with my fletched shafts, bullet holes with my bare shafts at 21 ft or 7 yards. At first I thought it was fletching contact of my arrow rest and it was, sort of. Then I moved the drop away rest cord from my yoke separator in my bottom limb to about 1.5 inches from the cam and my fletched shafts then also shot bullet holes. The timing of the drop was just off enough to cause my fletches to just hit the whale tail as it was going down upon release. So if your rest isn’t dropping quick enough you may want it move it back closer to the bottom cam.

 

[drpike22]

Bow tuning is a spectrum. The better one can shoot, the better one can tune. You can't tune better than you can shoot. So, what is tuned for one person may not be so with someone else. With a lot of today's bows that have high let-off, short axle to axle and short brace height, good shooting fit and form become more critical. Cheaper priced carbon arrows can be problematic when tuning due to inconsistent spine around the diameter of the shaft and from shaft to shaft.

When tuning, one must be results driven. Let the target group size and consistency determine if the bow is tuned and also if the arrows are tuned to group well together. One will usually need to nock tune the arrows to tighten up the groups.

All broadheads are not created equal. So, trying several different broadheads before one starts moving the rest thinking it's the bow. Some broadheads just don't fly well and one shouldn't "detune" their bow in an attempt to make a broadhead fly well.

Shoot a bow that fits you according to your physical draw length. Make sure the bow's poundage is easily manageable. Experiment with your grip placement and grip placement and find the one your bow likes. Shoot high quality arrows that are spined properly to you arrow length and poundage. Make sure the cam is in time and the cam lean is corrected by adjusting or shimming the cams to get true center shot.

I agree completely.

 

[jtw0057]

anybody run jnto a nock set being too low causing clearance issues with the riser shelf (compound)? my vanes barely clear the shelf and i dont know that a 3 blade head would clear the shelf. current arrows appeared to be tuned well but my rest is sitting a little low. arrows shot good through paper and grouped at 60.

If i move my nock point up i would assume if i move the rest up some too the arrow could still be in tune after adjusting accordingly. I tried to set it up around the berger hole. just wondering if theres any downside to moving the nock point higher to allow more clearance.


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[Halfstep]

anybody run jnto a nock set being too low causing clearance issues with the riser shelf (compound)? my vanes barely clear the shelf and i dont know that a 3 blade head would clear the shelf. current arrows appeared to be tuned well but my rest is sitting a little low. arrows shot good through paper and grouped at 60.

If i move my nock point up i would assume if i move the rest up some too the arrow could still be in tune after adjusting accordingly. I tried to set it up around the berger hole. just wondering if theres any downside to moving the nock point higher to allow more clearance.


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What bow is this on?

 

[BTaylor]

anybody run jnto a nock set being too low causing clearance issues with the riser shelf (compound)? my vanes barely clear the shelf and i dont know that a 3 blade head would clear the shelf. current arrows appeared to be tuned well but my rest is sitting a little low. arrows shot good through paper and grouped at 60.

If i move my nock point up i would assume if i move the rest up some too the arrow could still be in tune after adjusting accordingly. I tried to set it up around the berger hole. just wondering if theres any downside to moving the nock point higher to allow more clearance.


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I would for sure be adjusting both the rest and nock point up until I had arrow/fletching clearance.

 

[krub6b]

anybody run jnto a nock set being too low causing clearance issues with the riser shelf (compound)? my vanes barely clear the shelf and i dont know that a 3 blade head would clear the shelf. current arrows appeared to be tuned well but my rest is sitting a little low. arrows shot good through paper and grouped at 60.

If i move my nock point up i would assume if i move the rest up some too the arrow could still be in tune after adjusting accordingly. I tried to set it up around the berger hole. just wondering if theres any downside to moving the nock point higher to allow more clearance.


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Clearance is necessary. Not sure how much you need to move it to feel comfortable, 1/8"? 1/16"? I would expect that a small move up in rest and nock set shouldn't alter your tune a whole lot, but it may require a little tweaking after the move

 

[Jimdude]

You can move the nock point and rest up but you may also have to adjust the cam timing. Give it a shot.

 

[jtw0057]

Cool, yeah I have clearance right now but it’s not by much. Would not feel comfortable shooting a 3 blade broadhead. Not even sure it would clear the shelf when drawing back honestly. I’ll probably go for 1/4” or so and see if I can get it shooting fine with that. Cams are in time from what I can tell.


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