Friction Hitches

[BTaylor]

The overhand, the stopper, and the carabiner would all work separately.

Looking at it now after seeing your comment, the overhand wasnt needed was it? That's why I wanted some other eyes on it, so I could get some learnins.

 

[Brocky]

It isn’t needed for improving the tending, but it would help to keep the VT hitch from spreading out too much, which makes it not grab reliably.

 

[BTaylor]

It isn’t needed for improving the tending, but it would help to keep the VT hitch from spreading out too much, which makes it not grab reliably.

So the overhand will keep it from grabbing reliably or the spreading out will keep it from grabbing? Want to be sure I am understanding what you mean there.

 

[Brocky]

The overhand would help it to stay together and grab better.

 

[BTaylor]

The overhand would help it to stay together and grab better.

Thought that was what you meant but decided I had better confirm. LOL

 

[Iron_llama]

Anyone ever use a carabiner pulley sheave as a tender with eye-and-eye hitch cords? As long as it doesn't abrade on the hitch cord it looks like it should work out pretty well, without metal-on-metal clanking.

 

[Brocky]

The sheaves work, but the eyes get drawn into the hole, especially when using an oval carabiner. Another downside to this type of tending is how the hitch can get too compressed and doesn’t want to grab again when weighted. It can also push the eyes down the sides of the carabiner. The edges on the hole are sharp and should be rounded off.
Another option is to use a hitch that self tends, here are best ones that I know of, the easiest breaking, when unweighted, are from top to bottom, left to right. Only the top two would break under full body weight, with the VHH2 binding up after a short distance of descending.

 

[Iron_llama]

The sheaves work, but the eyes get drawn into the hole, especially when using an oval carabiner. Another downside to this type of tending is how the hitch can get too compressed and doesn’t want to grab again when weighted. It can also push the eyes down the sides of the carabiner. The edges on the hole are sharp and should be rounded off.
Another option is to use a hitch that self tends, here are best ones that I know of, the easiest breaking, when unweighted, are from top to bottom, left to right. Only the top two would break under full body weight, with the VHH2 binding up after a short distance of descending.
View attachment 82576

Thanks! I had wondered why I didn't see them in common use. That explains it.

 

[phatkaw]

The sheaves work, but the eyes get drawn into the hole, especially when using an oval carabiner. Another downside to this type of tending is how the hitch can get too compressed and doesn’t want to grab again when weighted. It can also push the eyes down the sides of the carabiner. The edges on the hole are sharp and should be rounded off.
Another option is to use a hitch that self tends, here are best ones that I know of, the easiest breaking, when unweighted, are from top to bottom, left to right. Only the top two would break under full body weight, with the VHH2 binding up after a short distance of descending.
View attachment 82576

^^^ You don’t include the Oval VT or the WLR in that list or did you forget them???

 

[raisins]

related to friction hitches, here's a sewn eye cord, the eyes on some of these are large enough that they slip around on the carabiner, this especially bothers me when climbing with my tether as a backup because it has some slack and so the sewn hitch can go every which way.....if you buy some ranger bands (variety size pack), you'll find that the small size is likely just large enough to go over the eye, when you put the carabiner through, the ranger band will be slightly compressed and the rubbery material (it's not actual rubber) grabs the carabiner very well......the ranger bands are not tight on the eye but are kept in place by the shrink wrap protecting the hitch stitching and the ranger bands can be easily moved out of the way for inspection.....working very well so far.....ranger bands are not made out of rubber and are stronger and don't dry rot and fail (at least not very quickly...i have some in use for 3 years now in other areas)

i believe this would also help with the use of several tenders between the sewn eyes

 

[Brocky]

^^^ You don’t include the Oval VT or the WLR in that list or did you forget them???

The Oval VT is enough like the Sticht that it performs the same, although it might solve the slipping problem that @gcr0003 was experiencing. Another way to help the slipping might be to use a twist in place of the crossed sections, or braid on top of the ring, just below the wraps.
I was testing the similar Synergy X, which failed when used with 1/8” T-100 on 10.5mm rope. At the time of testing I didn’t think to reduce the number of wraps and weaves. I found that 4 wraps and 3 weaves work nicely, it also breaks under full body weight, so add it to the list.

 

[John RB]

@Brocky , Regarding the concept of auto tending friction hitches, what do you think about the idea that basically any friction hitch becomes automatically tending if we use a longer cord to create it and then terminate it on a Longhorn Hitch? Some people love the Distel for example (not my favorite at all)... but if ya want it to automatically tend, tie a compact Longhorn under it, and problem solved. I demonstrated it in this video.

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[Fl Canopy Stalker]

@Brocky , Regarding the concept of auto tending friction hitches, what do you think about the idea that basically any friction hitch becomes automatically tending if we use a longer cord to create it and then terminate it on a Longhorn Hitch? Some people love the Distel for example (not my favorite at all)... but if ya want it to automatically tend, tie a compact Longhorn under it, and problem solved. I demonstrated it in this video.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

You can do the same thing with cobra weaves and they use a little less cord. I’ve put them under distel and schwabish hitches. Makes them self tending but doesn’t do a whole lot for binding under load. Does the long horn hitch help with that at all?

 

[John RB]

You can do the same thing with cobra weaves and they use a little less cord. I’ve put them under distel and schwabish hitches. Makes them self tending but doesn’t do a whole lot for binding under load. Does the long horn hitch help with that at all?

No, i believe the jam characteristics of the hitch we choose will remain about the same. I can't find any applications for Distel or Swabisch for that reason given the better choices.

And not that i know much about a Cobra Weave, but I don't think there's a bend inside of it, right? So we need an eye to eye or a bend as well? I would be concerned that we can't create something so compact with little travel setback between tending and set positions. Gotta photo?

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[Brocky]

The hitches break easier if enough of the weaves are below it, and it does need eyes or bend.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

The hitches break easier if enough of the weaves are below it, and it does need eyes or bend.

I admit I usually only add like two. I could see several weaves curving the rope enough that the top portion of the hitch would not have to hold as much force (similar to a rope wrench splitting the friction in a basics RADS system). But I’m not a fan of super long hitches either. That’s why I really like some of these hitches you’ve posted, some of them are very compact even if they require a ring, they stay compact.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

No, i believe the jam characteristics of the hitch we choose will remain about the same. I can't find any applications for Distel or Swabisch for that reason given the better choices.

And not that i know much about a Cobra Weave, but I don't think there's a bend inside of it, right? So we need an eye to eye or a bend as well? I would be concerned that we can't create something so compact with little travel setback between tending and set positions. Gotta photo?

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I don’t have a photo but yes it needs eyes or a bend

 

[DroptineKrazy]

I admit I usually only add like two. I could see several weaves curving the rope enough that the top portion of the hitch would not have to hold as much force (similar to a rope wrench splitting the friction in a basics RADS system). But I’m not a fan of super long hitches either. That’s why I really like some of these hitches you’ve posted, some of them are very compact even if they require a ring, they stay compact.

Why don't you like about longer hitches? What difference does the length make other than restricting the amount of adjustment on your tether? Pardon my ignorance as I'm a virgin as far as hitches go and have been slowly learning some different ones lately.

 

[Fl Canopy Stalker]

Why don't you like about longer hitches? What difference does the length make other than restricting the amount of adjustment on your tether? Pardon my ignorance as I'm a virgin as far as hitches go and have been slowly learning some different ones lately.

That’s why. I like my tether about nose height and my bridge out long. The less the hitch has to spread, the shorter my angle off the tree. On my lineman’s rope it doesn’t matter as much (except you have to pull the tail a little longer to tend it). So far the Cornell with about a 26 to 29” eye to eye is as long of a hitch I will run. Brocky’s stitch is a great compact hitch. I love the VT prusik because in testing it had much stronger holding characteristics than most other common hitches BUT that is a long spreading hitch so I never use it. It’s all personal preference really but for my I like to stay close to the tree on my tether, as a rappelling back up or lineman’s rope it doesn’t matter nearly as much

 

[Brocky]

That’s why. I like my tether about nose height and my bridge out long. The less the hitch has to spread, the shorter my angle off the tree. On my lineman’s rope it doesn’t matter as much (except you have to pull the tail a little longer to tend it). So far the Cornell with about a 26 to 29” eye to eye is as long of a hitch I will run. Brocky’s stitch is a great compact hitch. I love the VT prusik because in testing it had much stronger holding characteristics than most other common hitches BUT that is a long spreading hitch so I never use it. It’s all personal preference really but for my I like to stay close to the tree on my tether, as a rappelling back up or lineman’s rope it doesn’t matter nearly as much

Try the VVH2 from post #287, 4 wraps and the two braids are replaced with half hitches, very VT like, but doesn’t spread out. The two half hitches also work great under other hitches.