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The Heavy Arrow Movement is Flawed

slonstdy said:
This subject of heavy vs light arrows and which one is "better" can be debated to the end of time and the only thing that everyone will agree to is continuing to disagree. Some have never had issues with fast light weight setups and some have had terrible experiences and want to try heavy. Neither setup is ideal and each has their shortcomings depending on the scenario they're used in so as individual archers we should use what we are comfortable with and confident in it's ability to dispatch game efficiently.

Using myself as an example, I have used mechanicals (spitfires, bloodtrailers and rages) on arrows weighing 415 - 440grs since 2005 and for the most part never lost an animal because of being "light" or a broadhead failure. There is one though that comes to mind that might have had a different outcome had I been "heavy"...

About 6 years ago I shot a bear at the base of my tree but hit him too far forward on the top of the shoulder and watched him run off with the arrow sticking straight up that it reminded me of the bumper cars at an amusement park with their orange flag waving above them. When I found the arrow it had maybe 4" of blood on the shaft, that's it. You can guess the rest of that story, hours of tracking a non existent blood trail and a bear that lived to see another day. There were other factors that lead to the shot hitting where it did (all operator error) but now I wonder if a heavier arrow with a stout broadhead would have brought home the win.

The last few years I have focused in on my kills and have noted a common trend, I get complete pass throughs on does but rarely on bucks and the placement of the shots are textbook confirmed by the autopsies. I've come to the conclusion that bucks are inherently tougher due to their larger bone size and denser tissue (duhhh) offering more resistance that my arrows from a 60# bow are giving up too much energy deploying the broadhead and don't have enough "ass" left to force their way to a complete pass through. I've recovered them all but I want my arrow to put two holes in game animals so that's my reason why I'm going with 611gr arrows with fixed blade broadheads this season. 30 yds is my self imposed limit I would shoot if conditions were right but in reality most of my kills have been under 20yds so the trajectory and speed penalties with heavy won't come into play the way I hunt. The benefits of going heavy far outweigh the cons in my case, hopefully I'll have an opportunity this season to prove it.
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I'm glad to hear that you want a better performing arrow.
The bear you lost was most likely due more to your shot selection than it was your arrow. Shooting straight down on big game often turns out bad, especially with broad heads that cut extremely wide. The odds of getting both lungs are poor with steep angles and the odds are greater that ribs will defect the wide broad head. The sternum also can come into play and impede an exit hole. It's not a matter of whether you will kill the critter, it's a matter of finding the critter because of minimal external bleeding. I realize that hunters recover animals shot straight down, or frontal shots, but the odds go down on those types of shot angles.

Our goal with heavy arrows isn't just to kill the animal, our goal is to recover the animal. Exit holes improve the odds of shorter blood trails and increased rates of recovery. Some of the most desirable and effective shot angles result in the broadhead hitting the far shoulder which can prevent an exit wound. We I'm and hit exactly where we need to hit, but the heavy bone on the opposite side stops the arrow that is often already losing most of its momentum.
When it comes down to it, the concept of heavy arrows and durable broad heads is all about having an exit wound.
 
Allegheny Tom said:
I'm glad to hear that you want a better performing arrow.
The bear you lost was most likely due more to your shot selection than it was your arrow. Shooting straight down on big game often turns out bad, especially with broad heads that cut extremely wide. The odds of getting both lungs are poor with steep angles and the odds are greater that ribs will defect the wide broad head. The sternum also can come into play and impede an exit hole. It's not a matter of whether you will kill the critter, it's a matter of finding the critter because of minimal external bleeding. I realize that hunters recover animals shot straight down, or frontal shots, but the odds go down on those types of shot angles.

Our goal with heavy arrows isn't just to kill the animal, our goal is to recover the animal. Exit holes improve the odds of shorter blood trails and increased rates of recovery. Some of the most desirable and effective shot angles result in the broadhead hitting the far shoulder which can prevent an exit wound. We I'm and hit exactly where we need to hit, but the heavy bone on the opposite side stops the arrow that is often already losing most of its momentum.
When it comes down to it, the concept of heavy arrows and durable broad heads is all about having an exit wound.
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It was totally my fault where the arrow hit, I remember rushing the shot because he was about to walk under lower limbs which would have shielded him from me so I lead him and released. Naturally he stopped as I released so I caught him too far forward. Lesson learned the hard way.

I've taken quite a few game directly under my tree and all were recovered easily except for said bear. This past season I took another bear as he was laying there like a lion eating some nuts. Shot was straight down but this time I put the arrow where it's supposed to be and he ran no more than 50 - 60 yards and piled up. That was a complete pass through with a 2 blade rage with a total arrow weight of 422grs. What made me realize I would be better prepared with a heavier arrow and a sturdy fixed blade was when I butchered him and saw just how massive the bone structure is and he was just 200 pounds. They are literally built like a tank!

I'll never know if a heavy arrow would have helped getting through that bear's shoulder and into the vitals on that poorly placed shot but I do know going forward I will be better equipped to increase the odds in my favor should a shot not go as planned.
 
slonstdy said:
It was totally my fault where the arrow hit, I remember rushing the shot because he was about to walk under lower limbs which would have shielded him from me so I lead him and released. Naturally he stopped as I released so I caught him too far forward. Lesson learned the hard way.

I've taken quite a few game directly under my tree and all were recovered easily except for said bear. This past season I took another bear as he was laying there like a lion eating some nuts. Shot was straight down but this time I put the arrow where it's supposed to be and he ran no more than 50 - 60 yards and piled up. That was a complete pass through with a 2 blade rage with a total arrow weight of 422grs. What made me realize I would be better prepared with a heavier arrow and a sturdy fixed blade was when I butchered him and saw just how massive the bone structure is and he was just 200 pounds. They are literally built like a tank!

I'll never know if a heavy arrow would have helped getting through that bear's shoulder and into the vitals on that poorly placed shot but I do know going forward I will be better equipped to increase the odds in my favor should a shot not go as planned.
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No one can guarantee 100%, but I'd go out on a limb and say it would have. Depending on the weight, a heavy set up can shoot through an elephant, or a water buffalo.
 
Kaskadian said:
I’m not judging anyone’s setup - shoot whatever makes you all happy. That being said I am a firm believer in shooting fixed blade > mechanicals regardless of what weight arrow you choose to shoot.

I shoot 750 gr arrows from a 31” DL/60# bow. I’ve got my bow sighted in out to 60 yards which was as easy as shooting 20/60 and putting on the correct speed tape. Are my arrows slower? Absolutely. I genuinely do not care about speed at the ranges I shoot - if trad guys can kill animals with 140-170 FPS I think I’ll be okay.

Almost every single animal I’ve harvested was 30 yards or under with the majority being 15-25 yards. The number of animals I’ve taken shots on past 30 yards I can likely count on one hand. I follow the leg up and put it on a heart shot and I either hit heart or they jump the string and I end up with double lung. Shooting significantly slower speeds hasn’t effected that. The primary change has been complete pass through shots on every single animal I’ve shot regardless of what’s in the way (bones, etc).

I’m completely sold and I have no plans to go back to light/fast arrows. I use the same setup I’m using now on everything I hunt - whitetail, hogs, elk, turkey, and hopefully moose this fall if that works out.

View attachment 28376View attachment 28377
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What is that broadhead with the insert built in?


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IkemanTX said:
What is that broadhead with the insert built in?


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200 gr right bevel Cutthroat
51 gr stainless steel half out
150 gr brass screw in weights (75x2)

I bought all the components from Black Eagle. The broadheads I got from RMS Gear.
 
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Single bevel broadhead recommendations for my heavy arrow....?

Id love to be able to afford bishop, but I’m not made of money...
Maybe steel force... the 300 grain has a steel ferrule, so may be worth jumping up to that.


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IkemanTX said:
Single bevel broadhead recommendations for my heavy arrow....?

Id love to be able to afford bishop, but I’m not made of money...
Maybe steel force... the 300 grain has a steel ferrule, so may be worth jumping up to that.


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Seems most heavy single bevels are out of stock lately.....I think it makes more sense to go heavy with the insert. Than u can use some more readily available broadheads and still get to higher arrow weight & foc
 
These are on the more budget end....haven't harvested anything with them yet but they all steel construction including ferrule, fly true, and get real sharp. 145gr steel force threaded into 200gr insert.
20200525_230126.jpg
 
I think Grizzly Stik has a budget minded single bevel... the overkill, I think. I am not sure if it's all steel or what kind of steel

GrizzlyStik

www.grizzlystik.com www.grizzlystik.com
 
Im going to order a RF test kit. Which one do you guys suggest high or extreme foc. Getting the 250/300 kit. 29" draw 28" arrow center of knock to end of insert. 70#s
 
They dont have the 200 to 300 grain kit anymore? That one has two heads each stepping up in 25 grain increments.
 
Jeremy_D said:
Its 2 diffrent kits. Im wondering which one I should buy
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Ok thanks I misunderstood the question. I shoot a 28" DL 73lb Hoyt and went with the 200-300 kit. I got bullet holes with the 250 spine Sirius Apollo cut to about 29" with the 210 Ethics insert/footer and anywhere from 225-275 grain FPs.
 
ericabbott said:
Ok thanks I misunderstood the question. I shoot a 28" DL 73lb Hoyt and went with the 200-300 kit. I got bullet holes with the 250 spine Sirius Apollo cut to about 29" with the 210 Ethics insert/footer and anywhere from 225-275 grain FPs.
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Perfect! Thanks..thats the one I ordered
 
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